Investing megathread extravaganza

[DaFace]

A place to talk about investing stuff.

[TLO]

Hi everyone.

As some of you might be aware from my RR thread, I'm a gambling addict. I've been addicted to gambling since I've been of legal age to do so.

Luckily I haven't been of legal age to gamble for TOO long, and I don't think I've done any irreparable damage to my finances. (I'm trying to look at things optimistically).

I currently have about $50,000 in debt. This is a mixture of student loan, some medical bills, and loans I've used to finance my gambling. $10,000 in student loans. $20,000 in medical, $20,000 in personal loans and credit cards.

I've never had a lot of guidance financially, and obviously have been wreckless in my spending.

I'm putting the gambling behind me. I'm done. Now I'm just looking for some advice on how to get myself financially back on track.

I have about $1500 to my name. I clear around $1400 a paycheck every 2 weeks.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

[Rain Man]

Originally Posted by TLO

Hi everyone.

As some of you might be aware from my RR thread, I'm a gambling addict. I've been addicted to gambling since I've been of legal age to do so.

Luckily I haven't been of legal age to gamble for TOO long, and I don't think I've done any irreparable damage to my finances. (I'm trying to look at things optimistically).

I currently have about $50,000 in debt. This is a mixture of student loan, some medical bills, and loans I've used to finance my gambling. $10,000 in student loans. $20,000 in medical, $20,000 in personal loans and credit cards.

I've never had a lot of guidance financially, and obviously have been wreckless in my spending.

I'm putting the gambling behind me. I'm done. Now I'm just looking for some advice on how to get myself financially back on track.

I have about $1500 to my name. I clear around $1400 a paycheck every 2 weeks.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Good for you for making a turnaround. My quick advice is that paying interest is your enemy. Sort your debts by the interest rate, then try to find a way to convert them into lower interest rates via other types of financing. Then pay off the highest remaining interest rate debt first, putting all of the money you can against it. Then roll those payments into the second highest once you get it paid off.

I think a good rule for debt is to avoid it unless you're purchasing something that will give you a greater return than that debt. That generally means you should borrow only for education or job training, buying a home, or starting a business, and really nothing else. (Yeah, sometimes you might have to borrow for a car if you don't have cash for it. But if it gets you to a job it kind of counts in the same way.)

[DaFace]

The flow chart linked in the OP is a good road map for the long-term, but in short, Rain Man's advice is a good place to start. To expand on a couple things:

1. It's probably worth going through the exercise of putting together a monthly budget. List out your total (after tax) income, all of your bills that you can't get rid of (rent, gas, electric, etc.), stuff you could potentially get rid of (e.g., cable), and then take a close look at what's left and how you're spending it. If you truly want to get out of debt in a reasonable amount of time, you may have to shift your spending habits to make it work. It'll suck, but otherwise it's gonna take a really long time to get through $50k in debt on a $35k salary.
2. On that note, you need to figure up how much this is all costing you in interest each month. You MUST be putting more toward your loans than that amount or you're just going to keep digging a deeper hole. The more, the better, obviously.
3. Rain Man alluded to this, but you may want to look into ways you can reduce the interest rates you have. For student loans, check into refinancing. (I've heard good things about SoFi.) For credit cards, you can try to find a new card that has an 0% intro APR on transfers and just move things around for a couple years. For medical debt, it's tough to say since that can take a wide variety of forms, but if it's debt directly to the hospital, you can try to negotiate it down outright. Here's an article that describes the options better than I can.

In short, you've got a bit of a battle ahead of you, so it's important to take a long-term view. It'll seem insurmountable at first, but slowly if you make a plan and stick to it, it'll start going down. The way this stuff works is that it takes forever at first, but it'll speed up as you start reducing the amount of interest you're paying each month.

Good luck. Feel free to ask for advice on specific components of what you're working with.

[TLO]

Originally Posted by Rain Man

Good for you for making a turnaround. My quick advice is that paying interest is your enemy. Sort your debts by the interest rate, then try to find a way to convert them into lower interest rates via other types of financing. Then pay off the highest remaining interest rate debt first, putting all of the money you can against it. Then roll those payments into the second highest once you get it paid off.

I think a good rule for debt is to avoid it unless you're purchasing something that will give you a greater return than that debt. That generally means you should borrow only for education or job training, buying a home, or starting a business, and really nothing else. (Yeah, sometimes you might have to borrow for a car if you don't have cash for it. But if it gets you to a job it kind of counts in the same way.)

Originally Posted by DaFace

The flow chart linked in the OP is a good road map for the long-term, but in short, Rain Man's advice is a good place to start. To expand on a couple things:

1. It's probably worth going through the exercise of putting together a monthly budget. List out your total (after tax) income, all of your bills that you can't get rid of (rent, gas, electric, etc.), stuff you could potentially get rid of (e.g., cable), and then take a close look at what's left and how you're spending it. If you truly want to get out of debt in a reasonable amount of time, you may have to shift your spending habits to make it work. It'll suck, but otherwise it's gonna take a really long time to get through $50k in debt on a $35k salary.
2. On that note, you need to figure up how much this is all costing you in interest each month. You MUST be putting more toward your loans than that amount or you're just going to keep digging a deeper hole. The more, the better, obviously.
3. Rain Man alluded to this, but you may want to look into ways you can reduce the interest rates you have. For student loans, check into refinancing. (I've heard good things about SoFi.) For credit cards, you can try to find a new card that has an 0% intro APR on transfers and just move things around for a couple years. For medical debt, it's tough to say since that can take a wide variety of forms, but if it's debt directly to the hospital, you can try to negotiate it down outright. Here's an article that describes the options better than I can.

In short, you've got a bit of a battle ahead of you, so it's important to take a long-term view. It'll seem insurmountable at first, but slowly if you make a plan and stick to it, it'll start going down. The way this stuff works is that it takes forever at first, but it'll speed up as you start reducing the amount of interest you're paying each month.

Good luck. Feel free to ask for advice on specific components of what you're working with.

These posts seem chock full of good advice.

I'm going to sit down and make a budget this evening, and also look into which bills are carrying the highest interest rate.

I'll report back tomorrow with a battle plan and see what you guys think.

Thanks for taking the time to enlighten me a bit. I'll report back soon.

[DaFace]

Originally Posted by TLO

These posts seem chock full of good advice.

I'm going to sit down and make a budget this evening, and also look into which bills are carrying the highest interest rate.

I'll report back tomorrow with a battle plan and see what you guys think.

Thanks for taking the time to enlighten me a bit. I'll report back soon.

In case it's helpful, this article is a decent starting place for budgeting. The 50/30/20 thing isn't the end-all, be-all, but it's a place to start your thinking.

https://www.nerdwallet.com/blog/fina...uild-a-budget/

[Buehler445]

DaFace and Rain Man covered the good stuff, but my recommendation is to take a look in the mirror and get to the root cause of your behavior.

When you spend money (or gamble) what are you feeling? If you can effectively identify the feelings, then you can work on getting to the root cause of your spending problems. Work on rectifying the underlying issues that cause you to spend recklessly.

The easiest problem is boredom - find something cheaper to occupy your attention.

Next is ignorance/laziness - this usually isn't the case because some common sense approaches can address the problem. But if it is Rain Man and DaFace just fixed you problems.

Other stuff, like needing to be in control of something, needing a status symbol, being depressed and thinking something new and shiny will make you feel better are a lot harder, and it has to come from you.

People have come to me a lot over the years saying "DUDE you've got an MBA and you do taxes, fix my finances!" So I would give information similar to Rain Man and DaFace. You have to work with proper information. Find out where your money is going then we can work on a proper allocation of your resources. The problem with that is it is based in logic, and most peoples problems, not restricted to finances (substances, gambling, temper, laziness, whatever), do not become logic from a position of logic. It took me an embarrassingly long time to figure that out, but that's what I've come up with over the years.

As you sit here now, ready to make a change, definitely do those things. But as you get an impulse to buy something or do something stupid, do an introspective examination and try to identify the emotions that drive the troublesome behavior. It's been my experience that you can't affect real change until you have a good handle on those. They're the hardest ones too. I deal in logic and it's difficult to get there. But most people I've run across will start out with the best of intentions and fall flat because they aren't emotionally stable enough to do what they need to do (that's not a crack at you, a shockingly small number of people in society are balanced emotionally).

And it's not just major life changes, hell I struggle with eating right. I'll lay out a good plan, and then have a shit day on the farm and eat some garbage to make myself feel better. It's a real thing. A vast majority of our decisions in any given day aren't necessarily based in logic. Some more than others - I fall firmly on the logic side, but garbage food is an emotional crutch for me.

Beyond that and back to the structure of things, you're in some shit, friend. Understand that I don't know anything about your situation, but here's what I see from what you've posted. I don't know what your living expenses are, but I'd try to knock off any fat you can, even if it takes moving into a smaller apartment, not eating out, kicking nicotine or alcohol or pop or whatever. Streamline your expenses down to the bare minimum.

Then I'd look at the revenue side of the equation. Typically it is easier to earn your way out of trouble than save your way out of trouble. If you can't pick up more hours at work, look at adding another job, a side hustle, or some fill in work. All that shit sucks, but you get money in exchange for work, so that's what it takes.

Philosophically I don't like consumer debt. I have some student loan debt that I refuse to accelerate because it is uncollateralized. It's irrational, but that's where I'm at. Other than that I just have a mortgage. Buy a cheap car and get it paid off ASAP, and don't buy anything on credit. You probably will until you can un**** your situation, but generally don't do it.

I can budget like a mother****er, but I'd be lying if I said I budgeted my personal life. What's served me pretty well is just acting like I don't have any money. For most of my life I didn't and it carried over to when I finally started getting some and it treats me pretty well.

Beyond that, I don't know what kind of plan you have at work, but after the debt is serviced, you need to look hard at saving like a bastard for retirement, too. I think you're about my age, and we're not that young anymore.

Anyway, there is a lot of heavy shit to process in this post, but that's been my experience.

Best of luck bud.

[Nightfyre]

One thing that hasn't been mentioned yet is finding ways to increase your earning power and applying those increases directly to your debt. Extra work hours leaves less time to spend money, as an added benefit. If you can get a better job and/or work a second job, you will tackle the debt much faster. Good luck

[ChiliConCarnage]

Among the options the Trump administration is considering: delisting Chinese companies from US stock exchanges and limiting Americans’ exposure to the Chinese market through government pension funds.

The bolded seems crazy extreme. Blocking new IPOs would seem more reasonable. Hide yo Clays, Hide yo kids

[TLO]

Originally Posted by Buehler445

DaFace and Rain Man covered the good stuff, but my recommendation is to take a look in the mirror and get to the root cause of your behavior.

When you spend money (or gamble) what are you feeling? If you can effectively identify the feelings, then you can work on getting to the root cause of your spending problems. Work on rectifying the underlying issues that cause you to spend recklessly.

The easiest problem is boredom - find something cheaper to occupy your attention.

Next is ignorance/laziness - this usually isn't the case because some common sense approaches can address the problem. But if it is Rain Man and DaFace just fixed you problems.

Other stuff, like needing to be in control of something, needing a status symbol, being depressed and thinking something new and shiny will make you feel better are a lot harder, and it has to come from you.

People have come to me a lot over the years saying "DUDE you've got an MBA and you do taxes, fix my finances!" So I would give information similar to Rain Man and DaFace. You have to work with proper information. Find out where your money is going then we can work on a proper allocation of your resources. The problem with that is it is based in logic, and most peoples problems, not restricted to finances (substances, gambling, temper, laziness, whatever), do not become logic from a position of logic. It took me an embarrassingly long time to figure that out, but that's what I've come up with over the years.

As you sit here now, ready to make a change, definitely do those things. But as you get an impulse to buy something or do something stupid, do an introspective examination and try to identify the emotions that drive the troublesome behavior. It's been my experience that you can't affect real change until you have a good handle on those. They're the hardest ones too. I deal in logic and it's difficult to get there. But most people I've run across will start out with the best of intentions and fall flat because they aren't emotionally stable enough to do what they need to do (that's not a crack at you, a shockingly small number of people in society are balanced emotionally).

And it's not just major life changes, hell I struggle with eating right. I'll lay out a good plan, and then have a shit day on the farm and eat some garbage to make myself feel better. It's a real thing. A vast majority of our decisions in any given day aren't necessarily based in logic. Some more than others - I fall firmly on the logic side, but garbage food is an emotional crutch for me.

Beyond that and back to the structure of things, you're in some shit, friend. Understand that I don't know anything about your situation, but here's what I see from what you've posted. I don't know what your living expenses are, but I'd try to knock off any fat you can, even if it takes moving into a smaller apartment, not eating out, kicking nicotine or alcohol or pop or whatever. Streamline your expenses down to the bare minimum.

Then I'd look at the revenue side of the equation. Typically it is easier to earn your way out of trouble than save your way out of trouble. If you can't pick up more hours at work, look at adding another job, a side hustle, or some fill in work. All that shit sucks, but you get money in exchange for work, so that's what it takes.

Philosophically I don't like consumer debt. I have some student loan debt that I refuse to accelerate because it is uncollateralized. It's irrational, but that's where I'm at. Other than that I just have a mortgage. Buy a cheap car and get it paid off ASAP, and don't buy anything on credit. You probably will until you can un**** your situation, but generally don't do it.

I can budget like a mother****er, but I'd be lying if I said I budgeted my personal life. What's served me pretty well is just acting like I don't have any money. For most of my life I didn't and it carried over to when I finally started getting some and it treats me pretty well.

Beyond that, I don't know what kind of plan you have at work, but after the debt is serviced, you need to look hard at saving like a bastard for retirement, too. I think you're about my age, and we're not that young anymore.

Anyway, there is a lot of heavy shit to process in this post, but that's been my experience.

Best of luck bud.

This is some great advice. Thank you.

How old are you, out of curiosity?

[Hammock Parties]

IQ sucks again

[Buehler445]

Originally Posted by TLO

This is some great advice. Thank you.

How old are you, out of curiosity?

36.

Younger than DaFace

[TLO]

Originally Posted by Buehler445

36.

Younger than DaFace

You've got quite a few years on me. Your advice still rings absolutely true though. I'm an adult, and it's time to start acting like it.

[TLO]

To follow up. I sat down and made a full budget out today. At the end of each month, I have around $500 that isn't accounted for anywhere. This is what was used as my "entertainment AKA gambling money before"

(This assumes I'm making minimum payments on each bill.)

I'm figuring I can leave out maybe $50 per paycheck for a total of $100 a month to spend on eating out, a new video game, etc etc. (My new entertainment budget)

The other $400 can be used to tackle debt. Throwing an extra $400 at bills every month should really make a big impact.

[TLO]

I'm up to date on all my bills. Everything is current. I'm trying to stay optimistic. I know I'm in a mess, but I can fix this.

[Pasta Little Brioni]

Get all your bad habits in check before you commit to anything. Go a couple months minimum on being fully disciplined.