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Old 10-22-2018, 04:56 PM  
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The Myth that Nelson Sucks
Simply put, it’s wrong.

Quote:
BJ Kissel
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#Chiefs CB Steven Nelson (92.7 PFF Overall Grade) was
@PFF
's top-graded player last night. He was targeted six times and only allowed two receptions for 33 yards.

Over the past six games, Nelson has only allowed 264 yards while being targeted 42 times.

He’s having a pretty good season, and at least half of CP thinks he sucks. It’s a shame.
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Old 11-13-2018, 03:40 PM   #166
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I don't think you can make that argument at all.

His ceiling is what we've seen this season (this is a career year for him, IMO), and what he's been this season is far more than quality depth.

He's been genuinely great this year. And you don't have to trust the stats on their face - simply look at the company he's keeping. He's on lists with the guys that people would kill to acquire; the Patrick Peterson's and Chris Harris Jrs. Fitzpatrick was a high 1st round pick who's looked as good this year as Lattimore looked last year.

This is high company he's keeping, man. At some point you have to give something some weight. If it's not PFF or production in coverage, at the very least you have to consider him relative to his peers and right now his peer group is among the best in the league.

So to say his 'ceiling' is quality depth is simply objectively disprovable.
Lets see him maintain it across a full season and through the playoffs, then I'd consider changing my tune
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Old 11-13-2018, 03:47 PM   #167
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Lets see him maintain it across a full season and through the playoffs, then I'd consider changing my tune
But that's not a reasonable position to take if you're talking 'ceiling'.

Sure, you can adjust his 'top quartile of probable outcomes' or something like that, but for 10 games the dude has played like one of the top 5-10 CBs in the league. I don't care if he gets his ass beaten like a rented mule for the rest of the season, that damn sure doesn't change the fact that he's proven his 'ceiling' to be far more than quality depth.

Especially not when he was a one of the better slot corners in football in 2016 before we asked him to bite off more than he could chew in 2017.

You're just not being fair here and that's coming from one of the people has has been most critical of Nelson to this point.
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Old 11-13-2018, 03:56 PM   #168
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Players get hot for a while and then tail off all of the time

I'm not sold on him as a long-term answer, at all... if he is still starting here next year, I'll gladly eat humble pie
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Old 11-13-2018, 03:59 PM   #169
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Nelson (and the whole defensive backfield really) still is near the worst in the league at getting penalties. It's not all wine and roses with this crew.
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Old 11-13-2018, 04:00 PM   #170
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Easy 6 View Post
Players get hot for a while and then tail off all of the time

I'm not sold on him as a long-term answer, at all... if he is still starting here next year, I'll gladly eat humble pie
Nor am I.

Still doesn't mean that his ceiling is quality depth. He's proven that it isn't. His ceiling, if he plays to it, is a top tier NFL starter.

I just don't think he'll play to it. Again - completely different conversations.
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Old 11-13-2018, 04:01 PM   #171
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Quote:
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Nelson (and the whole defensive backfield really) still is near the worst in the league at getting penalties. It's not all wine and roses with this crew.
The offense is averaging at/near 2 false-start penalties per game at home.

Penalties are a problem at every level of this football team.
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Old 11-13-2018, 04:02 PM   #172
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut View Post
The offense is averaging at/near 2 false-start penalties per game at home.

Penalties are a problem at every level of this football team.
Absolutely true...
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Old 11-13-2018, 04:04 PM   #173
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Easy 6 View Post
Players get hot for a while and then tail off all of the time

I'm not sold on him as a long-term answer, at all... if he is still starting here next year, I'll gladly eat humble pie
Terrance Mitchell
I thought he was the answer.
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Old 11-13-2018, 04:07 PM   #174
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RippedmyFlesh View Post
Terrance Mitchell
I thought he was the answer.
Marcus Cooper.
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Old 11-13-2018, 04:22 PM   #175
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RippedmyFlesh View Post
Terrance Mitchell
I thought he was the answer.
Terrance Mitchell looked like a solid starting CB for about 3 games. He had one fantastic game, a solid game or two and then was just there. He was never showing up on the 'best CBs in football' lists.

Quote:
Originally Posted by htismaqe View Post
Marcus Cooper.
Warmer; better and for longer. But Cooper started showing drop off pretty quickly as well. Moreover, he didn't have an entire season at the level Nelson had in 2016.

Nelson demonstrated a full season as a 'starting' caliber Nickel CB in 2016 - that's more than Cooper or Mitchell ever showed. Then this year he's gone wire to wire as not just a credible complementary corner (which is the lense we were looking at Mitchell and Cooper through) but as a genuinely excellent starting guy.

Nelson has played at a quality NFL player level for much longer, he's hit a higher peak and he's held it for much longer than either Cooper or Mitchell.

And again - that's not to say that I believe this is his new normal. I don't trust him any more than most to keep it up. I just think it's wildly unfair to simply hand waive 10 weeks of damn good football as 'credible depth'.

You're ignoring what he's done in favor of what you thought he'd do. That's how Matt Cassel's happen...
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Old 11-13-2018, 04:33 PM   #176
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Warmer; better and for longer. But Cooper started showing drop off pretty quickly as well. Moreover, he didn't have an entire season at the level Nelson had in 2016.

Nelson demonstrated a full season as a 'starting' caliber Nickel CB in 2016 - that's more than Cooper or Mitchell ever showed. Then this year he's gone wire to wire as not just a credible complementary corner (which is the lense we were looking at Mitchell and Cooper through) but as a genuinely excellent starting guy.

Nelson has played at a quality NFL player level for much longer, he's hit a higher peak and he's held it for much longer than either Cooper or Mitchell.

And again - that's not to say that I believe this is his new normal. I don't trust him any more than most to keep it up. I just think it's wildly unfair to simply hand waive 10 weeks of damn good football as 'credible depth'.

You're ignoring what he's done in favor of what you thought he'd do. That's how Matt Cassel's happen...
Well said.
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Old 11-13-2018, 08:02 PM   #177
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They are throwing flags to keep our games semi close. Some of the bullshit is ridiculous.
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Old 11-13-2018, 08:41 PM   #178
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They are throwing flags to keep our games semi close. Some of the bullshit is ridiculous.
Man, it’s really hard not to feel that way.

The Pats and Cardinals game are perfect examples. Opposing team could do no wrong while we get called for ticky tack BS.
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Old 11-14-2018, 08:44 PM   #179
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hey guys steven nelson is elite

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Old 11-14-2018, 10:24 PM   #180
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hey guys steven nelson is elite
#11 CB as per PFF.

But don't say that. Fans want to keep saying Dorsey was so poor at drafting and as a GM.

He is not the reason why the offense is historically good but he is the reason why this defense is supposedly terrible. Ok.

And what about that guy earlier in the thread who was saying Nelson has been bad. Ok sure lol.
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