#2 Wide Receiver 2016-17
 

I still see #2 WR as a big hole. So, who do you guys want as our #2 next year?


Develop from within? I'm not confident that Wilson, nor Conley is our #2 next year.

Draft "The Guy"? I've read there are a lot of options in the draft again this year, but rookie WRs are mostly unreliable.

Vet FA? Several FAs coming up, but not sure who will get away from their current team: http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/free-agents/wide-receiver/

Conley.

Marvin Jones would be a good FA pickup....but I don't see how we could afford him and keep our own guys.

I don't see anyone on that F/A list that's good enough or fit the scheme well enough to be handed the keys to the #2 WR position.

They'll likely keep developing players and drafting. There's no Maclin, Cobb or Sanders available this coming offseason.

Travis Benjamin would be a good pick-up, and he would upgrade the Chiefs punt return situation as well (adios DAT).

I don't think Benjamin gets away from the Panthers

Kelvin Benjamin is on Carolina. Travis Benjamin is on Cleveland.

Ahhhhh gotcha sorry... yeah Travis is on my fantasy team this year. Would be interesting to see how he does with a consistent QB.

That would be a cum-worthy development.

This. He was drafted to be a #2. Therefore, a #2 he will be.

I would love to see this happen. Not that I'm anti-DAT, but I've seen Benjamin in a few games and he's really been the biggest target for Cleveland the past few games.

Dwayne Bowe will be available haha

He has the physical tools. He just needs a full year and an offseason to learn the entire offense. He's smart enough to be a fast learner.

Conley will be fine.

We should just trade DaT to Seattle for Tyler Lockett.

Probably going to burn a pick on the 1st or 2nd on one.

Wilson is a fine #2

Where do you think Wilson has failed in his role?

In this offense, the #2 target is Travis Kelce.

The X receiver in this offense is never going to be a guy that gets a ton of looks. His primary role is going to be to exploit coverages that sell out to stop Maclin and Kelce. In that regard, Wilson's done his job extremely well.

Wilson doesn't do a bad job of finding space, he is a solid route runner and he has good hands. For the most part, Wilson has been a very solid player and is by no means holding back the offense.

If Conley isn't ready to take the next step, Wilson will remain just fine as the X. I don't see any pressing need to use high-end draft capital and certainly don't see a need to use cap space to bring a guy in to replace Wilson when he's not likely to make a significant difference in the offense over Wilson.

Yeah...we're really gonna need Conley to take that role on next season. I'm not down on him...rookie, complicated offense. He's smart and physically gifted. He can put it together by next year.

I'd like to see wilson in the slot running those option routes NE uses so well. He seems to have good short area quickness and is good in the open field, although I think they envision DAT doing that.

I still think your best option is Conley running those deep crosses, posts and Flys from the x, but wilson has been fine, even though he doesn't seem to be ideal for it

I just don't think Conley's feet are fast enough to get the separation needed from the X.

Look at the TD Wilson scored on the slant - that was ALL footwork. The jabstep to get the corner playing the outside giving Wilson a chance to get inside position on him was all footwork. Many of those drag routes are a result of that same kind of movement.

If Conley could develop into the X that would be great because he does have a size advantage on Wilson and a little bit more athleticism. That said, I still think Conley's best role in KC could well be in the slot. At that point he'd get to line up off the line of scrimmage and it would buy him some of that space that he'll be unlikely to be able to get using the quickness that Wilson has. He'd start inside the formation a little more often so he could use that open space towards the sidelines to screen off DBs a little more.

Essentially I'd like to see him used how the Giants used Cruz when Cruz was at his best.

Wilson's skill-set is just a little more rounded and his game is a lot more polished. Unless Conley makes enormous strides in the offseason (and somehow figures out how to overcome fairly slow feet), I don't see him taking that job away from Wilson. And frankly, if it doesn't happen, I think Wilson is fine out there.

I guess I'm the opposite in that with his quickness, I'd rather give wilson a little more room from the slot.

Hinestly, I don't see the fit here with Conley, in this offense and his skillset, but maybe that's just me

Conventional wisdom says that's the way to go.

But recently the teams that have experimented with the bigger, more physical WRs in the slot have had a lot of success with it. Given that I don't think Conley can get the separation he'd need at the X and Wilson can, I'd rather stick with Wilson at X and Conley at Y.

And given the fact that the offense runs through the Z and the TE anyway, I just don't see a need for expending substantial resources to upgrade on either of those guys.

I wouldnt, unless someone like Treadwell falls to them.

Good discussion DJ and O.

I'd like to see it as a matchup thing. If Conley can handle the route tree and there is a favorable matchup, move the guys around. Remember when ****ing Crennel wouldn't move guys. "We haz left and right cbz." So Flowers would cover huge mother****ers and Carr would chase around small quick guys. If we could play matchups, let's rape faces.

Dat is going to go off come playoff time assuming we make it

I can't imagine any other reason to hold him out

Unless it's a steal in the later rounds why the hell would we waste a pick on a #2. Wilson has only gotten better over time **** you doubters.

People yell that we suck
demand a playoff win
dream of a super bowl game


yet have such low expectations when it comes to talent level

corners are great
safeties are outstanding
front seven dominates
wide receivers are good
our tightends are just fine
running backs are the best in the NFL

we have great offensive weapons and the best defense in the universe


How in the **** do you think we are going to win a super bowl?

oh, that's right ... the only problem is Alex Smith and Eric Fisher, everything else is super bowl level.

:doh!:

It would be ridiculous to use a high pick or invest in FA on a #2 wide out in this offense.

With the scheme, it's not designed to be that important of a role. You just need a guy who can win the one-on-one's. I believe Wilson has proven capable and Conley could as well.

Personally, I truly believe #2 TE is as or more important than the #2 WR in this offense. If Kelce goes down, then what? It's a extremely important position given what we do.

.. are you suggesting there might be an agenda against these two players??? Here at the CP?

how dare you, sir... how. dare. you. :harumph:

Brett Perriman!

Wait a year and then draft Gabe Marks or River Cracraft. Both fit the Welker\Amendola mold though Marks is a bit more dynamic.

There's no reason to think Reid doesn't want a second dynamic WR. See Percy Harvin and Jeremy Maclin.

Conley could be that guy, lord knows he has the straight-line speed to be a deep threat. But the one combine stat that separated him from Julio Jones was his short-shuttle, which my amateur guess would assign to separation in quicker routes. I think that could end up being the albatross around his neck.

The Chiefs should absolutely be targeting another dynamic WR in the draft. Smith's contract is cost-prohibitive for drafting a first round QB this year, but not next year. Get another playmaker so he is ready to blossom when our QBOTF becomes the QBOTP.

Maclin, Kelce, FIRST ROUND WR, Conley, Charles, Ware, West. That's a hell of an arsenal for any QB to play with.

Charles as well, if healthy.

I'm just not sure Conley has the short area quickness to be effective in a whole array of route concepts. That's my reasoning for talking to dj about him playing the x. Maybe he surprises me and develops those areas more and really with a competent z accross from him in maclin, you need him to be your deep bug play threat.

Not all wrs are going to be well rounded, just need to be great at a few things when your in his situation

Albert Wilson is everything you want in a #2 WR. He's like a poor mans Desean Jackson to compliment Maclin.

I don't see how or where you get an upgrde. Conley is not better. Nobody worth investing a 2nd or 3rd round pick would be better because they are going to take a whole season to be groomed and this is a win now veteran team.

Wilson is fast, he knows the system, salary cap friendly, he's a great YAC guy, and he can beat 1 on 1 man coverage most of the time when Alex Smith identifies it.

What more do you people want? He's better than any #2 we had here since the Kennison/Morton days.

We had turds like Chris Chambers, Donnie Avery (completely overrated on this forum), Steve Breason (LOL), Jon Baldwin (bigger LOL) playing that position over the years and they were all HORRIBLE.

I would like them to just keep stocking the position though, like the steelers and cardinals have.

Yeah, yeah our qb is our qb is whatever

Win now veteran team? We're the 8th youngest roster.

I'm comfortable with Wilson and Conley needs some time to develop.

DEVARD MOTHER****ING DARLING. For the....loss.

what are Alex Smith, Jamaal Charles, Jeremy Maclin, Ben Grubbs, Dustin Colquitt, Derrick Johnson, Tamba Hali, Sean Smith, etc

are these not NFL veterans? Even if the depth of this roster is young some of the highest paid players and biggest contributors are either A) in the prime of their career or B) in their late twenties approaching 30 or over 30.

That to me is a win now veteran team.

The days of 36 year old Ray Lewis leading your defensive unit being considered a veteran team are over. Guys retire much earlier, the twilight of their careers is coming much earlier (except QB).

I'd rather invest in the TE position as crazy as that sounds than chase after #2 WR.

Don't get me wrong, I love Travis Kelce, but he is a little all over the place, and thing a another TE option would work well with Alex.

I'll happily take one of Cincinnati's #2 receivers at 2 years 10mil. Their stats will be suppressed by how much the ball gets distributed in their offense.

We should have went after Vernon Davis when he was available. Low risk, high reward and has chemistry with Smith

What more could I want.

I want a guy that wll extend himself on deep balls that are just a little high, a little long.

I want a guy that doesn't leave me questioning his effort.

No thanks.

You misspelled Will Fuller.

We'd be best off with Alex Smith to draft a 2nd TE if there is a really good one available. Then next year we will have Connelly step up along side Albert Wilson.

so you want another #1 WR then. Not many teams have two of those.

Yeah, cause number 1s are the only ones that give full effort.


Dumbass.

I like Rishard Matthews from Miami.

And I'm curious what other teams #2 WR is acceptable by your mighty standards that you would want here? Martavis Bryant does not count.

Mighty standards?

I am asking for effort, dipshit.

Effort.

Mighty standards?

Good lord, what a ****ing moron.

I haven't really seen Albert Wilson give full effort. He's getting better and still learning the ins and outs of the NFL, but there are several balls he could have stretched out for or at least made a reaching jump for.

And you got them mixed up? Doesn't it say T. Benjamin - WR - CLE?

I'd roll with Wilson. I agree with DJ about Kelce being the #2

Well I have no faith in the ability of the Chiefs to draft a wide receiver. The best we drafted in the past 15 years was Dwayne Bowe and even he was largely dissapointed. I wish we could have the success that Pittsburgh has had drafting wide receivers. They've repeatedly found excellent wide receivers in the 3rd round or later.

Markus Wheaton - 3rd round
Antonio Brown - 6th round
Emmanuel Sanders (**** him) - 3rd round
Martavis Bryant - 4th round

I would happy with hitting on even one guy of a caliber similar to any one of them, but I simply have no faith that it will happen. It seems certain teams have positions they just can't draft or develop talent, and ours are quarterback and wide receiver.

Bring Eddie Kennison in for a look?

I'm not sold. I think he's too small and he has a habit of quitting on plays.

Agreed. I also have been irritated with his (and others') tendency to run out of bounds instead of pushing for a few yds or more.

I like that he recently has been giving more regarding this lately, though I hope it continues.

Can you really question a 5'9" WR's effort?

Why not?

I don't know if its effort. I see a lot of effort from him when he's run blocking or blocking on screens.
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Conley has some serious #1 receiver type of talent. If he can somehow figure it out eventually, very good things will happen.

Well, our no 2 WR has only averaged 3 catches a game the last 3 weeks.

Not great...

to be fair to him though... 8 receptions on 12 targets.

So most seem to agree that Wilson is our #2, and Conley has a chance to get there if he develops. I like the idea that a second TE could be more impactful than another WR. One vote for Rashard Matthew and another for TRAVIS Benjamin.

Well, I think I'm for bringing in one of the above vets, developing our young guys, AND drafting a TE. A bit surprised others don't see this WR corp as lacking the way I do.


Thoughts:

...How about James O'Shaughnessey? I thought he was going to be our second TE?

...I'm sure plenty of teams are saying so now, but had we grabbed Lockett.

...which brings me to what happened to DAT? Why isn't he more active in the passing, and kick/punt return?

But again, he's not our #2 target; Kelce is.

If you figure that you want Maclin getting 10 targets a game and Kelce another 8 then your backs get 6ish you're at 24. In a typical game we'll probably throw the ball 30 times or so. So you're looking at 6 targets for Wilson, the #3 WR and the #2 TE combined.

The #2 WR in this offense just isn't a terribly critical position. I see Milkman's point regarding effort - yeah, Wilson has failed to lay out a time or two this season - but using raw numbers just doesn't make a lot of sense for the X in this system.

Wilson is averaging 3.3 targets/gm and I don't think it's because he's failing to get open. We saw last season that he was getting about 6 targets/gm down the stretch when he was our de facto #1 option and he was making things happen with those targets. His lack of numbers is a function of the system and not Wilson himself.

As to the effort, I just think he needs to have a better understanding of what he can and cannot do. Or perhaps we need that understanding and he already has it. The long catch he made 2 weeks ago when he went up into traffic and brought the ball in knowing he was going to get hit makes me think that he's not exactly a scared player. Moreover, he's an UDFA that made himself into a starting WR - guys that jake plays don't manage that.

I just think we have far more pressing concerns than Albert Wilson.

Watching the Steelers yesterday, I would love to model our WR corps after them.

I want another speed receiver this offseason, and I'd really like to get one in the first 2 rounds if no QB is available.

I want our WR's to all be dynamic, athletic and dangerous.

ROFL

dude gtfoh

based off of what exactly???

As much as people get maligned for saying it, we really need to get the offensive line beefed up. As much grief as Alex smith gets here, when he's comfortable in the pocket, he plays well.

I think RT and LG are pretty big holes at this point

OL def needs to be a point of emphasis in next offseason.

Can't continue giving up the most sacks in the NFL.

And more CB depth. And the depth of our DL is what allows us to rotate guys in and keep them fresh the whole game (allowing us to play excellent run defense even in a Nickel set). If we lose Howard and/or DeVito, we'll need to invest there. Oh, and DJ isn't getting younger.

There are a lot of areas on this team that need to get tightened up well before we get to the #2 corner. I'd be just fine taking a T in the first and then another interior lineman in the 2nd or 3rd (though I'd rather see a CB there).

Guys are describing who they want their #2 wideout to be and yet Wilson possesses most of those tools; he's just not a volume option. He'd go for 800 yards and 6 TDs in Pittsburgh if he were running as their #3. They're a volume offense and we're not. Big Ben's going to be a first ballot HoFer; there's a reason his WRs tend to put up numbers...

The more I think about it, maybe some effort issues with Albert were more about him still recovering from that shoulder injury.. and not wanting to take big hits. (at least for the running out of bounds part)

The deep down field issues, I still suspect he just doesn't have ideal ball tracking +/or body adjustments while deep.

I think CB would be a need, whether Sean is in or out the door, as many expect.

Peters is the real deal, but Gaines is coming back from injury. Nelson hasn't shown much yet. If Sean is gone, I would smile over them drafting a CB on day 2.

We need to go 4 deep at WR and CB.

legit deep, not crap.


every other position has a legit backup, why not WR and CB?

several teams have guys at 4 or 5 that could challenge for our #2 wr spot.

I'm not saying you are right or wrong.. but feel free to list some teams and WR names, if you can take the time. That would be interesting (maybe) discussion.

:hmmm:

Infinite needs vs. scarce resources.

Would I like to have 5 Maclins on the team? Sure. Am I willing to expend substantial draft capital and/or cap space to acquire one? No, not when we have at least one dire need on the OL and no depth to speak of at CB.

Now again, FA could change a lot of that - namely if we're able to bring back Smith and/or Howard. But right now, I see us keeping only one of those guys (at best) and if that's the case, we'll need to use those resources on more pressing spots.

Besides, WR has become a place where you can find a shitload of value in the middle rounds. Guys like Moncreif and Brown fall into the 3rd pretty much every season. This year it was Crowder and Diggs in the 4th and 5th. There will be guys next year as well (even a Ty Montgomery or Justin Hardy would do nicely).

It's just not a good use of scarce resources to throw a high pick at a player who's likely the 3rd option in the offense, at best (more likely the 4th option).

I think they need to keep transitioning the offense closer to that type of offense, so if they wanna keep stocking the wr position, fine.

I think the offensive line needs to be upgraded as well, but I'm with you defensively but somethings have to be developed from within. Just like our dl depth gas been, some of these young corners, ilbs, etc are gonna have to develop into replacements

I'm not saying we go out and spend for 4 maclins.

I'm talking about the guys like you mentioned.

we need to draft guys like Montcrief etc. instead of Avant,Hammond etc.

Maybe Dorsey will get there eventually. He seems to love safeties.