That is just it. WE do not have, will not have a QBOTF as long as peterson is holding the reigns. ALL we will ever get is rejects from other teams.

WE should have tried to get Clint Stoerner but now his is Dallas property

"The faulty assumption is that because Gunther is not a good HC, that therefore Raye is not a bad OC. It is a common mistake in logical analysis."

You lost me there Gaz. That wasn't the assumption I was making. What I was saying was either Raye is a bad offensive coordinator, and Gunther's faliure to see that and get rid of him brings the blame back to Gunther (which is what I believe) or that should it be true as Horn says and Raye has his hands tied by Gun, it is thus still Gun's fault, and thus either way the bottom line is Gun is the problem...

Go to sleep, GUN.

Clint: 11-5 would almost as much of a miracle as Carl Peterson actually getting fired by Lamar. Neither will happen so the point is moot.

Pam:
will not have a QBOTF as long as peterson is holding the reigns. ALL we will ever get is rejects from other teams. - How do you get a QBOTF when drafting an average of #21 since 1990?

How many Franchise QB's come out of the draft outside the top 10 picks? How many Franchise QB's has Carl passed up when drafting?<BR>

In your opinion, how long do you think Carl will be around? 20 years? 30?

Maybe Carl will inherit the team.

My stomach just started churning...

Clint: I know you hate me for this opinion http://www.ChiefsPlanet.com/ubb/wink.gif , but I honestly do not believe that Carl will be sent packing until Lamar hands the team to his son? or other family member.

I could be completely wrong on this, but that's what I believe.

Above that, though, it's not the GM it's the philosophy of play that is dictated to the team and I do NOT believe that this philosophy is driven by the GM. It's driven by the HC. The GM, however, does receive the blame for hiring the coach.

It is my hope that Carl proves that he has learned this is a flawed philosophy and hires someone who has an offensive mindset and a philosophy that fits NFL football in y2k.

[This message has been edited by KCTitus (edited 09-15-2000).]

DaWolf-

I was coincidence that put my post directly after yours. I was responding to svuda's thread, not Reply #3.

Raye is a proven failure at OC, and was a proven failure at OC before coming to KC. He should never have been promoted to OC and he certainly should not have been retained.

But I do agree that the ultimate responsibility belongs to Gunther. I like Gunther. I thought he was a great DC. That four-blitz series against Buffalo still warms my crusty old heart. However, it is becoming clear that the HC job is too much for him. The Three Stooges must go, and I am reluctantly deciding that Gunther has to go with them.

xoxo~
gaz
really wanted Gunther to succeed.<BR>

My bad! http://www.ChiefsPlanet.com/ubb/smile.gif

Well it is early. Though I have begun my Gun bashing quite earlier than I expected this year, I am still somewhat optimistic and hope he gets the message soon. I doubt it, but it is not too late to turn it around, although we let two winnable games slip right through our hands, which makes the task even harder...

I too really wanted Gun to succeed. I like Gun, but I'm in agreement with gaz. If the stooges must go, and we all agree they must go, than gun must go with them.

------------------
[b]ct
The 3 Stooges must go!!</B>

The BEST thing that could happen to this team: .. .. Gun admits that the run-only theory is stupid, endorses the use of "Frisbee Football" along with a balanced running attack to score a lot of points through the air with SLYMO, and GONZO. Chiefs go 11-5

The Next Best thing that could happen to this team: .. .. Gun sticks to his Guns, & Runs all the time to the point of stubborn foolishness. The running game & the Chiefs season are a complete failure. Chiefs go 3-13. WE draft a great QBOTF, fire Gun, Raye, Stock, and Cunningham. Bill Parcells Takes over the team.

The ABSOLUTE WORST thing that could happen to this team: .. .. Gun sticks to his guns, but mixes in just enough passing to go 8-8. We get a crappy draft pick, and stick with the same stupid Offensive philosophy & coaching staff. Looks like another bad year.

I hope Gun sees the light, and quickly becomes a more balanced, and progressive coach....But I am not holding my breath. If gun doesn't Morph into a more balanced coach real soon I will be hoping for a high draft pick, and a new staff.<BR>

The biggest thing that the Coaches are missing is that they rely on the run to set up the pass, but absolutly refuse to do have the pass setup the run when the other team is stopping the run. If the run is not working then you have to change, we don't. I really think that if we took away the DL and put a brick wall there that Gun would have us run into the wall until it fell over, instead of passing around it.

Morphius You are right, and with Cloud running it would only have to be a 6 inch high brick wall.

Svuba: bad news, you are never, ever going to get Bill Parcells out of NY or the New England area. He's an east coast guy.

I can't believe it took anyone this long to figure out that Gun is not cut out to be a head coach. He never accepts blame for a defeat and deferrs any questions about questionable playcalling to the coordinators. Not exactly what you like to see in a leader. Best we can hope for now is a 3-13 season, a high draft pick, and a housecleaning. I don't think Peterson needs to go, but it may be time for a change there too. Clint, I hate to break the bad news to you, but Peterson's predesessor, Jack Steadman, ran the Chiefs for 15 years before he was dismissed. I believe they made the playoffs once or twice during his tenure. Lamar is very loyal and I think Carl will stay as long as Carl wants to.

I can't believe it took anyone this long to figure out that Gun is not cut out to be a head coach. He never accepts blame for a defeat and deferrs any questions about questionable playcalling to the coordinators. Not exactly what you like to see in a leader. Best we can hope for now is a 3-13 season, a high draft pick, and a housecleaning. I don't think Peterson needs to go, but it may be time for a change there too. Clint, I hate to break the bad news to you, but Peterson's predesessor, Jack Steadman, ran the Chiefs for 15 years before he was dismissed. I believe they made the playoffs once or twice during his tenure. Lamar is very loyal and I think Carl will stay as long as Carl wants to.