A Question for all that want DE with 1st pick

Kclee · 12-23-2004, 11:14 AM

I must be missing something and need enlightenment. I think Allen starts and Holliday will be gone. And didn't we just sign Hicks? The coaches love him. Believe me, I would love to draft stud DE first, but do you think they will bench Hicks? Or even bench Allen, who will most likely break DT's sack record? I guess I just don't see the coaches doing that. But alot of people are thinking DE, so enlighten me please.

HC_Chief · 12-23-2004, 11:16 AM

RDE is where they want us to go. Replace Hicks with a more aggressive pass-rusher.

Heck, we could have done that THIS year... instead of resigning Hicks we could have kept Truluck.

12-23-2004, 11:16 AM

Uh - Hicks blows?

Does that answer your question?

htismaqe · 12-23-2004, 11:18 AM

Hicks needs to be replaced, period.

But alas, you're probably right. The coaching staff cares more about warm fuzzies than wins...

Alphaman · 12-23-2004, 11:19 AM

At a minimum, Holliday must be replaced as part of the normal rotation. That means a DE in the 1st or 2nd round (unless we get one in free agency).

Given where we may be drafting now, DE may be the best value on the board (or it could be CB). Erasmus James or Spears might be on the board when we draft. Of course Carlos Rogers or the CB from Michigan may be as well.

In a nutshell, we need to get 2 CBs, 2 LBs, and 1 DE in Free Agency and the 1st 2 rounds of the draft. Which happens where is really irrelavent to me.

philfree · 12-23-2004, 11:20 AM

Allen has RDE locked up and Hicks probably has LDE locked up to start the season but the way we rotate linemen we could draft a DE who has more pass rush then Hicks and play him on 3rd downs until he's ready to start. IMO our biggest problem is 3rd down. If we could improve our 3rd down pass rush it should help our D a bunch.

PhilFree

Kclee · 12-23-2004, 11:23 AM

Hicks does blow. But why would they re-sign him? I was hoping they wouldn't. If he is cap friendly to cut, then maybe they will draft a DE. I just think the coaches love him way too much to bench him, even more so now since he just signed a new contract. Mistake? What mistake? He's the one with the motor always running. It just seems to be stuck in park.

HC_Chief · 12-23-2004, 11:27 AM

IMO this team has done a lot of shitting in one hand and wishing in the other, when it comes to personnel on D and at WR.

It's pretty obvious which hand filled up first....

shaneo69 · 12-23-2004, 11:35 AM

I am holding out hope that Wilkerson will step up and develop into a starter. He has shown some pass rush ability (at least more than Hicks, IMO). But I think we just need to draft the best defensive player available, as long as it's not another DT.

RedandGold · 12-23-2004, 11:44 AM

Hicks is one of Gunther's guys, so regardless of how much he blows, we should probably get prepared for another season with him as our starter.

HC_Chief · 12-23-2004, 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedandGold

Hicks is one of Gunther's guys, so regardless of how much he blows, we should probably get prepared for another season with him as our starter.

Aw shit.... that means we'll have Woods, Wesley and Bartee starting next year as well.

shaneo69 · 12-23-2004, 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedandGold

Hicks is one of Gunther's guys, so regardless of how much he blows, we should probably get prepared for another season with him as our starter.

I think he's more of a DV pet than a Gunther guy. I don't remember Gunther ever having pets in his earlier tenure that he stuck with after they became unproductive.

RedandGold · 12-23-2004, 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HC_Chief

Aw shit.... that means we'll have Woods, Wesley and Bartee starting next year as well.

I'd almost put money down that Wesley and Harts will be our starters next season. I don't think that even Gunther can justify keeping Woods around for another season.

Considering that Bartee has even received negative press on the Chiefs official website, I don't expect him to be around.

Chiefnj · 12-23-2004, 11:55 AM

I've advocated taking a DE with the 1st round pick for the following reasons:

1. There aren't many highly rated MLB's in the draft.
2. There are several MLB's available in free agency, who I would hope KC would pursue.
3. I'm of the opinion that in a 4-3 defense, the most important part of the D is the DL. It begins with them - they need to stop the run and generate a pass rush on their own.
4. If the front 4 could generate a decent pass rush by themselves, Gunther wouldn't have to employ his wild blitz packages as often, which often lead to very large gains. (High risk, high reward).
5. I'm still not convinced the Chiefs Run D is as good as some people think. IMO, it looks okay because of teams passing so much b/c the DB's are atrocious and opposing teams have to keep up with the high scoring O. They are 28th in yards per carry.
6. If the NFL is going to continue enforcing the no contact rule with CB's it is all the more important to pressure the QB as quickly as possible with a speed rusher.
7. A derivative of #6, CB's aren't allowed to do anything why spend top dollar on them. A lot of teams with big name corners are on the bottom of the stat page for pass defense.

That's why I'd go with a DE. It doesn't mean that DV would see things the same way and give a Pollack a chance, but I'm hoping DV completely 100% hands control over D and personnel of the D to Gunther. I think Gunther would be more inclined to pull a player even if it was one of his favorites.

htismaqe · 12-23-2004, 12:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shaneo69

I am holding out hope that Wilkerson will step up and develop into a starter. He has shown some pass rush ability (at least more than Hicks, IMO). But I think we just need to draft the best defensive player available, as long as it's not another DT.

I sincerely hope that Siavii develops or something.

Both Sims and Dalton are serviceable, but neither of them pushes the other "over the top" the way Henderson did with Stroud in Jax...

12-23-2004, 11:14 AM
Kclee Veteran Join Date: Mar 2002 Casino cash: $10014147	A Question for all that want DE with 1st pick I must be missing something and need enlightenment. I think Allen starts and Holliday will be gone. And didn't we just sign Hicks? The coaches love him. Believe me, I would love to draft stud DE first, but do you think they will bench Hicks? Or even bench Allen, who will most likely break DT's sack record? I guess I just don't see the coaches doing that. But alot of people are thinking DE, so enlighten me please.
Posts: 2,245

12-23-2004, 11:16 AM	#2
HC_Chief That's just f***in' stupid Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: suburbia Casino cash: $3687107	RDE is where they want us to go. Replace Hicks with a more aggressive pass-rusher. Heck, we could have done that THIS year... instead of resigning Hicks we could have kept Truluck. __________________ "Gentlemen, you can't fight in here, this is the war room!"
Posts: 12,355

12-23-2004, 11:16 AM	#3
Phobia Guest Casino cash: $	Uh - Hicks blows? Does that answer your question?
Posts: n/a

12-23-2004, 11:18 AM	#4
htismaqe 'Tis my eye! Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Chiefsplanet Casino cash: $8179900	Hicks needs to be replaced, period. But alas, you're probably right. The coaching staff cares more about warm fuzzies than wins...
Posts: 104,292

12-23-2004, 11:19 AM	#5
Alphaman Veteran Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Austin, TX, USA Casino cash: $10004900	At a minimum, Holliday must be replaced as part of the normal rotation. That means a DE in the 1st or 2nd round (unless we get one in free agency). Given where we may be drafting now, DE may be the best value on the board (or it could be CB). Erasmus James or Spears might be on the board when we draft. Of course Carlos Rogers or the CB from Michigan may be as well. In a nutshell, we need to get 2 CBs, 2 LBs, and 1 DE in Free Agency and the 1st 2 rounds of the draft. Which happens where is really irrelavent to me.
Posts: 1,380

12-23-2004, 11:20 AM	#6
philfree Indian Twitter Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Free Agency Casino cash: $-1983802	Allen has RDE locked up and Hicks probably has LDE locked up to start the season but the way we rotate linemen we could draft a DE who has more pass rush then Hicks and play him on 3rd downs until he's ready to start. IMO our biggest problem is 3rd down. If we could improve our 3rd down pass rush it should help our D a bunch. PhilFree __________________ [/SIGPIC]
Posts: 16,098

12-23-2004, 11:23 AM	#7
Kclee Veteran Join Date: Mar 2002 Casino cash: $10014147	Hicks does blow. But why would they re-sign him? I was hoping they wouldn't. If he is cap friendly to cut, then maybe they will draft a DE. I just think the coaches love him way too much to bench him, even more so now since he just signed a new contract. Mistake? What mistake? He's the one with the motor always running. It just seems to be stuck in park. __________________ If any man says he hates war more than I do, he better have a knife, that's all I have to say.
Posts: 2,245

12-23-2004, 11:27 AM	#8
HC_Chief That's just f***in' stupid Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: suburbia Casino cash: $3687107	IMO this team has done a lot of shitting in one hand and wishing in the other, when it comes to personnel on D and at WR. It's pretty obvious which hand filled up first.... __________________ "Gentlemen, you can't fight in here, this is the war room!"
Posts: 12,355

12-23-2004, 11:35 AM	#9
shaneo69 Smug Weasel Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Bleachers at Busch Casino cash: $10004900	I am holding out hope that Wilkerson will step up and develop into a starter. He has shown some pass rush ability (at least more than Hicks, IMO). But I think we just need to draft the best defensive player available, as long as it's not another DT.
Posts: 4,910

12-23-2004, 11:44 AM	#10
RedandGold Born with Bad Habits Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Right Here Casino cash: $-770000	Hicks is one of Gunther's guys, so regardless of how much he blows, we should probably get prepared for another season with him as our starter.
Posts: 1,399

12-23-2004, 11:55 AM	#14
Chiefnj MVP Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Willis, Harris and Davis. Casino cash: $10004900	I've advocated taking a DE with the 1st round pick for the following reasons: 1. There aren't many highly rated MLB's in the draft. 2. There are several MLB's available in free agency, who I would hope KC would pursue. 3. I'm of the opinion that in a 4-3 defense, the most important part of the D is the DL. It begins with them - they need to stop the run and generate a pass rush on their own. 4. If the front 4 could generate a decent pass rush by themselves, Gunther wouldn't have to employ his wild blitz packages as often, which often lead to very large gains. (High risk, high reward). 5. I'm still not convinced the Chiefs Run D is as good as some people think. IMO, it looks okay because of teams passing so much b/c the DB's are atrocious and opposing teams have to keep up with the high scoring O. They are 28th in yards per carry. 6. If the NFL is going to continue enforcing the no contact rule with CB's it is all the more important to pressure the QB as quickly as possible with a speed rusher. 7. A derivative of #6, CB's aren't allowed to do anything why spend top dollar on them. A lot of teams with big name corners are on the bottom of the stat page for pass defense. That's why I'd go with a DE. It doesn't mean that DV would see things the same way and give a Pollack a chance, but I'm hoping DV completely 100% hands control over D and personnel of the D to Gunther. I think Gunther would be more inclined to pull a player even if it was one of his favorites.
Posts: 6,811