Canseco's "Juiced"

mcan · 03-30-2005, 04:53 AM

Just bought the book last night, and I sat down and read it cover to cover. Great read, and it gives an insite that is hard to gain from any article you've read. Has anybody here ever read it?

Here are my overall thoughts:

1. Canseco is a bit paranoid that people are "out to get him" but he probably has a point that the media and public were harder on him then they were the "golden boys" like McGwyre and Giambi who are just as obviously juicing.

2. His thoughts and experiences with steroids seem to go right with mine; that they are only harmfull when grossly abused, and should be available to people in safe doses that want to experience the positive effects of steroids (of which there are many).

3. That said, however Canseco seems to suggest that he thinks baseball would be better off if they encouraged steroid use. While it might make the game more entertaining, I think that would be going too far since it would basically FORCE all the players to take them to keep up (which I guess isn't really any different then it is now).

4. Canseco is a bit of a conspiracy theorist (I myself am not) but the one thing that I think makes a whole lot of sense is that the owners turned a blind eye to steroids for more than ten years, and LOVED the increased interest when Mac and Sosa were making their run. Now, the league (read also: owners) are going to great lengths to clean it up... Why? Political pressure? Integrity of the game? Nope: player salaries are skyrocketing as offensive production soars to unheard of levels.

Anyway, it's a fascinating book, and I would encourage any fan of the MLB to pick it up...

Eleazar · 03-30-2005, 05:57 AM

I was kind of wanting to read it myself. I mean, say what you will about the guy's character, the one thing he probably is not is wrong.

This is from a Jayson Stark piece about the steroid testing this season:

Quote:

No matter how you break down the numbers of the last couple of years, though, there is one eye-popping area where it's obvious there has been a dramatic difference:

All of a sudden, no one is hitting 50 home runs anymore. Or 60. Or 70.

In the 10 seasons from 1993 through 2002, hitters reached or passed 50 home runs 18 times. Which equaled the number of 50-homer seasons in the 118 previous major-league seasons put together. In the last two seasons (since the launching of major-league steroid testing): Zero.

And in just a four-year period from 1998 through 2001, Mark McGwire, Bonds and Sammy Sosa combined to blow past 60 homers six times. Before that, only Roger Maris had reached the 60s in the previous 71 seasons.

Since 2003, however, no one has come within a dozen of 60. Even Bonds hasn't gotten within 25 of 70.

**penguinz** · 03-30-2005, 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcan

2. His thoughts and experiences with steroids seem to go right with mine; that they are only harmfull when grossly abused, and should be available to people in safe doses that want to experience the positive effects of steroids (of which there are many).

I saw you post this before I left for work this morning. I expected you to get flamed for it.

BIG_DADDY · 03-30-2005, 02:31 PM

I have about as much interest in supporting that POS Canseco as I do Michael Moore.

bkkcoh · 03-30-2005, 02:36 PM

isn't it interesting that about the time of the home run races, was about the time baseball had recovered from the strike in 94? could that have been the reason why MLB ignored it? I think you would have to hire the best of defense lawyers to prove that there wasn't a connection.

**penguinz** · 03-30-2005, 02:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bkkcoh

I think you would have to hire the best of defense lawyers to prove that there wasn't a connection.

Cochran had a brain tumor and is now dead.

bkkcoh · 03-30-2005, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by penguinz

Cochran had a brain tumor and is now dead.

I did almost put JC in the post, but I thought that since he wasn't really room temperature or hadn't been room temp very long.

Did he take steroids???

Thig Lyfe · 03-30-2005, 04:15 PM

I'd bet that you read the book before Canseco did.

BIG_DADDY · 03-30-2005, 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bkkcoh

I did almost put JC in the post, but I thought that since he wasn't really room temperature or hadn't been room temp very long.

Did he take steroids???

That will probably be the ESPN spin, they haved blamed everything short of the Tsunami on roids.

Frazod · 03-30-2005, 06:23 PM

I hated Cansucko long before he added being a backstabbing rat to his long resume of assholish behavior. No way will I ever consciously do anything to put money in his pocket.

mcan · 03-31-2005, 07:58 PM

Wow, a lot of animosity towards Canseco here... Didn't realize that he was so hated.

Naming players out loud is certainly going to turn some heads, but baseball turned it's back on Canseco before he put out the book. According to Canseco, the owners are trying to rid the league of roids since salaries are skyrocketing, so in order to send a message to everybody, they colluded to kick Canseco out of the league when he was one season away from hitting 500 homeruns, and being considered for the hall of fame. The players right now (who are benifitting from Canseco showing them how to get big) are turning their backs.

Canseco's goals aren't to get a whole lot of people in trouble. He's trying to show how EVERYBODY is doing it... Not 10% not 20%... More like 85% to 90%... And there are only one or two top players that aren't. He honestly feels that if the public can see that most of the players are using them without adversly risking their health, that they won't be able to ignore the fact that steroids are a GOOD thing when used properly. He likens finding out about steroids to people first learning about fire and using basic tools and making herbs and medicine to help them live longer and better. That's exactly what anabolics do. They help men get stronger and healthier and get more bang for their exercise buck. As for side effects and dangers. There are some for steroids, but there are also some for aspirin.

Frazod · 03-31-2005, 09:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcan

Wow, a lot of animosity towards Canseco here... Didn't realize that he was so hated.

He was an arrogant prick who played for OAKLAND. Why wouldn't he be hated?

Deberg_1990 · 03-31-2005, 09:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcan

Canseco's goals aren't to get a whole lot of people in trouble

No, I think his goal is to make a quick buck while he still can. Why else write a book about it and promote it?? Why couldnt he just do interviews and make the statements??

BIG_DADDY · 04-01-2005, 12:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcan

Wow, a lot of animosity towards Canseco here... Didn't realize that he was so hated.

If he dies a horribly painful death tonight drinks are on me

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcan

Naming players out loud is certainly going to turn some heads, but baseball turned it's back on Canseco before he put out the book. According to Canseco, the owners are trying to rid the league of roids since salaries are skyrocketing, so in order to send a message to everybody, they colluded to kick Canseco out of the league when he was one season away from hitting 500 homeruns, and being considered for the hall of fame. The players right now (who are benifitting from Canseco showing them how to get big) are turning their backs.

Yea right, if you believe that I would also like you to know that I am god and just happen to post here at the ChiefsPlanet. I can't believe you would buy this crap, all they had to do was ban steroids instead of going after Jose Canseco the mighty roid guru of MLB.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcan

Canseco's goals aren't to get a whole lot of people in trouble. He's trying to show how EVERYBODY is doing it... Not 10% not 20%... More like 85% to 90%... And there are only one or two top players that aren't.

Canseco's goal is all about making money over everyone's carcass, get real.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcan

He honestly feels that if the public can see that most of the players are using them without adversly risking their health, that they won't be able to ignore the fact that steroids are a GOOD thing when used properly. He likens finding out about steroids to people first learning about fire and using basic tools and making herbs and medicine to help them live longer and better. That's exactly what anabolics do. They help men get stronger and healthier and get more bang for their exercise buck. As for side effects and dangers. There are some for steroids, but there are also some for aspirin.

This is very true but remember, he changed his testimony in court to saying he changed his mind and they are dangerous.

|Zach| · 04-01-2005, 12:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BIG_DADDY

If he dies a horribly painful death tonight drinks are on me

Heh, I think you are limited to celebrating the death or possible death of only one person per week around here.

03-30-2005, 04:53 AM
mcan Apr 13,1949 – Dec 15, 2011 Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Kansas City, MO Casino cash: $9996085	Canseco's "Juiced" Just bought the book last night, and I sat down and read it cover to cover. Great read, and it gives an insite that is hard to gain from any article you've read. Has anybody here ever read it? Here are my overall thoughts: 1. Canseco is a bit paranoid that people are "out to get him" but he probably has a point that the media and public were harder on him then they were the "golden boys" like McGwyre and Giambi who are just as obviously juicing. 2. His thoughts and experiences with steroids seem to go right with mine; that they are only harmfull when grossly abused, and should be available to people in safe doses that want to experience the positive effects of steroids (of which there are many). 3. That said, however Canseco seems to suggest that he thinks baseball would be better off if they encouraged steroid use. While it might make the game more entertaining, I think that would be going too far since it would basically FORCE all the players to take them to keep up (which I guess isn't really any different then it is now). 4. Canseco is a bit of a conspiracy theorist (I myself am not) but the one thing that I think makes a whole lot of sense is that the owners turned a blind eye to steroids for more than ten years, and LOVED the increased interest when Mac and Sosa were making their run. Now, the league (read also: owners) are going to great lengths to clean it up... Why? Political pressure? Integrity of the game? Nope: player salaries are skyrocketing as offensive production soars to unheard of levels. Anyway, it's a fascinating book, and I would encourage any fan of the MLB to pick it up...
Posts: 3,761

03-30-2005, 02:31 PM	#4
BIG_DADDY THE RED MENACE Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Texas Casino cash: $4958410	I have about as much interest in supporting that POS Canseco as I do Michael Moore. __________________ The diabolical genius of Marxism-Socialism is that it provides the emotional and intellectual road map for autocrats to persuade millions of people to support their own enslavement to government. ~Mark Levin April 15, 2019
Posts: 32,387

03-30-2005, 02:36 PM	#5
bkkcoh MVP Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Lewis Center, Ohio USA Casino cash: $9805595	isn't it interesting that about the time of the home run races, was about the time baseball had recovered from the strike in 94? could that have been the reason why MLB ignored it? I think you would have to hire the best of defense lawyers to prove that there wasn't a connection. __________________ Brian K. Aspire to Inspire before you Expire
Posts: 5,506

03-30-2005, 04:15 PM	#8
Thig Lyfe Banned Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Thigpen's America Casino cash: $10004900	I'd bet that you read the book before Canseco did.
Posts: 25,680

03-30-2005, 06:23 PM	#10
Frazod WE ARE THE CHAMPIONS Join Date: Aug 2000 Casino cash: $2805085	I hated Cansucko long before he added being a backstabbing rat to his long resume of assholish behavior. No way will I ever consciously do anything to put money in his pocket.
Posts: 119,532

03-31-2005, 07:58 PM	#11
mcan Apr 13,1949 – Dec 15, 2011 Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Kansas City, MO Casino cash: $9996085	Wow, a lot of animosity towards Canseco here... Didn't realize that he was so hated. Naming players out loud is certainly going to turn some heads, but baseball turned it's back on Canseco before he put out the book. According to Canseco, the owners are trying to rid the league of roids since salaries are skyrocketing, so in order to send a message to everybody, they colluded to kick Canseco out of the league when he was one season away from hitting 500 homeruns, and being considered for the hall of fame. The players right now (who are benifitting from Canseco showing them how to get big) are turning their backs. Canseco's goals aren't to get a whole lot of people in trouble. He's trying to show how EVERYBODY is doing it... Not 10% not 20%... More like 85% to 90%... And there are only one or two top players that aren't. He honestly feels that if the public can see that most of the players are using them without adversly risking their health, that they won't be able to ignore the fact that steroids are a GOOD thing when used properly. He likens finding out about steroids to people first learning about fire and using basic tools and making herbs and medicine to help them live longer and better. That's exactly what anabolics do. They help men get stronger and healthier and get more bang for their exercise buck. As for side effects and dangers. There are some for steroids, but there are also some for aspirin.
Posts: 3,761