Chiefs tried to trade Charles

[FAX]

Originally Posted by DeezNutz

I think we need to turn the page on many of these debates.

The first year for the new regime did NOT go well. There's simply no getting around that. There were failures in the draft, FA, and talent evaluation. Game management was often a travesty.

That said, Pioli and Haley are going to be around in 2010. I'm hopeful they'll have learned from their mistakes, and I'm also ready to start evaluating new decisions from here on out.

I told all the guys that you were smart, Mr. DeezNutz. You can have some of my prop things for this most excellent post.

We're going to be okay. We just need a good kicker and a running back.

FAX

[DeezNutz]

Originally Posted by FAX

We're going to be okay. We just need a good kicker and a running back.

FAX

[BigMeatballDave]

Originally Posted by DeezNutz

I think we need to turn the page on many of these debates.

The first year for the new regime did NOT go well. There's simply no getting around that. There were failures in the draft, FA, and talent evaluation. Game management was often a travesty.

That said, Pioli and Haley are going to be around in 2010. I'm hopeful they'll have learned from their mistakes, and I'm also ready to start evaluating new decisions from here on out.

This. I know if they make the same stupid decisions this yr, I'm done. I won't trust single thing they do. Most of us are skeptical of them anyway. I know I am now. I was drinking the Pioli Kool-aid last yr. After a season of fail, they need to show us something.

[wild1]

I was campaigning for Charles to be the starter over Larry Johnson. I wanted Johnson cut before the season so he wouldn't collect his salary this year. I posted a thread early in the season begging for the change.

But, I can't claim it was because I recognizes Charles was a Chris Johnson. It was just because I realized Larry Johnson is washed up earlier than some.

[TheGuardian]

If Hamas said that Charles was nothing more than a 3rd down back then he needs to st.f.u about the player evaluation skills of the front office and bitching about the OP story that so far, doesn't have any teeth. It's ridiculous.

Nevermind, just saw it........

He's going to be our third down back

So there it is. Now about it.

[OnTheWarpath15]

Originally Posted by TheGuardian

If Hamas said that Charles was nothing more than a 3rd down back then he needs to st.f.u about the player evaluation skills of the front office and bitching about the OP story that so far, doesn't have any teeth. It's ridiculous.

Nevermind, just saw it........



So there it is. Now about it.

You have quite a way with words, and well, actually reading them.

Nowhere in that post does he claim that Charles was nothing more than a 3rd down back, or that he'd never be more than a 3rd down back, only that he would serve that purpose. Implying that he'd be a 3rd down back his rookie year. Nothing referencing the future.

Again, the post in question is from right after we drafted him.

Reading is fundamental.

[TheGuardian]

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

You have quite a way with words, and well, actually reading them.

Nowhere in that post does he claim that Charles was nothing more than a 3rd down back, or that he'd never be more than a 3rd down back, only that he would serve that purpose. Implying that he'd be a 3rd down back his rookie year. Nothing referencing the future.

Again, the post in question is from right after we drafted him.

Reading is fundamental.

I read it. Stating that a guy is going to be our third down back isn't really saying anything other than........he's going to be our third down back.

I don't recall a single person in here calling for Charles to be the starter opening day. I'm sick of people bitching just to bitch.

find another MF'ing team since you hate everything/anything to do with this one.

[OnTheWarpath15]

Originally Posted by TheGuardian

I read it. Stating that a guy is going to be our third down back isn't really saying anything other than........he's going to be our third down back.

I don't recall a single person in here calling for Charles to be the starter opening day. I'm sick of people bitching just to bitch.

find another MF'ing team since you hate everything/anything to do with this one.

Wow, nice change of direction there.

If Hamas said that Charles was nothing more than a 3rd down back then he needs to st.f.u about the player evaluation skills of the front office and bitching about the OP story that so far, doesn't have any teeth. It's ridiculous.

Stating that a guy is going to be our third down back isn't really saying anything other than........he's going to be our third down back.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Originally Posted by TheGuardian

If Hamas said that Charles was nothing more than a 3rd down back then he needs to st.f.u about the player evaluation skills of the front office and bitching about the OP story that so far, doesn't have any teeth. It's ridiculous.

Nevermind, just saw it........



So there it is. Now about it.

Third down backs and change of pace guys are very valuable. There is no one who expected Charles to rush for 260 yards in a game, but I can damn sure tell you that there were several people who didn't want to sell him off for a late second day pick.

I've been as high on Charles as anyone on this site from the time he was a rookie, even if that ceiling was even higher than I'd imagined.

Hell, I had a disagreement with Mecca in the '08 draft thread about Felix Jones vs. Charles, arguing that Charles was the same kind of player and could be had later....turns out, Charles is better than Jones.

[DaWolf]

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

Third down backs and change of pace guys are very valuable. There is no one who expected Charles to rush for 260 yards in a game, but I can damn sure tell you that there were several people who didn't want to sell him off for a late second day pick.

I've been as high on Charles as anyone on this site from the time he was a rookie, even if that ceiling was even higher than I'd imagined.

Hell, I had a disagreement with Mecca in the '08 draft thread about Felix Jones vs. Charles, arguing that Charles was the same kind of player and could be had later....turns out, Charles is better than Jones.

I've called him a 3rd down back as well, and still have concerns about what a full season of "feature back" pounding would do for him. It's good to see him be one of the guys to step up and grab his opportunity to do something. He's certainly exceeded what I think most anyone, including the coaches, expected. But that's usually the story in the NFL when guys aren't first rounders...

[TheGuardian]

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

Third down backs and change of pace guys are very valuable. There is no one who expected Charles to rush for 260 yards in a game, but I can damn sure tell you that there were several people who didn't want to sell him off for a late second day pick.

And here is my issue with you. No where has this story been confirmed by a legit source! Yet you ran with it like it was from the lips of God himself. The point is, you and some others have complained most of the season about EVERYTHING, or have looked for something to complain about.

Even when we win you are finding something to bitch about. When we win IN DENVER IN DOMINATING FASHION! You still find SOMETHING to complain about.

Do you really think it warrants it? Because I sure as hell don't. When things are looking like shit, I say so. But I don't cherry pick shit just to find a reason to bitch.

We just hung up 44 points on Dungver in their house, a place we haven't won at since 2000 and all you can talk about is player evaluations! From a first year coaching and front office that isn't familiar with these players. Damn, I at least give someone a chance to learn from their mistakes. Try it out.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Originally Posted by TheGuardian

And here is my issue with you. No where has this story been confirmed by a legit source! Yet you ran with it like it was from the lips of God himself. The point is, you and some others have complained most of the season about EVERYTHING, or have looked for something to complain about.

Even when we win you are finding something to bitch about. When we win IN DENVER IN DOMINATING FASHION! You still find SOMETHING to complain about.

Do you really think it warrants it? Because I sure as hell don't. When things are looking like shit, I say so. But I don't cherry pick shit just to find a reason to bitch.

We just hung up 44 points on Dungver in their house, a place we haven't won at since 2000 and all you can talk about is player evaluations! From a first year coaching and front office that isn't familiar with these players. Damn, I at least give someone a chance to learn from their mistakes. Try it out.

Do you see me bitching about the outcome of the game? No.

Do you see me bitching about Jamaal Charles? No.

Do you see me bitching about Brandon Flowers, Derrick Johnson, or Glenn Dorsey? No.

I'm bitching about one thing, and one thing only: talent evaluation. There is no ****ing way that a sane person would think that LJ was the best back for this team, and the results of the entire season bear that out completely. And yet, these same people, who missed so horribly on evaluating our RBs, who call plays like the Castille pass, who give Matt Cassel $63 million before he has taken a snap for us are also the ones who are in charge of rebuilding this team from the ash heap.

Being happy with the results of yesterday (and I am) does not mean that you can't also look forward to the future. That's the entire point of a rebuild. I honestly can't believe that you cannot comprehend this.

When a team is as bereft as we are, you always need to have your eye towards the future. If we were in a Vermeil-esque, win now mode, I can see the point in putting blinders on, but we've got 11 picks in the draft and a free agency period coming up.

How do the moves of this regime, especially in light of what happened yesterday, inspire any confidence in the future?

[OnTheWarpath15]

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

Do you see me bitching about the outcome of the game? No.

Do you see me bitching about Jamaal Charles? No.

Do you see me bitching about Brandon Flowers, Derrick Johnson, or Glenn Dorsey? No.

I'm bitching about one thing, and one thing only: talent evaluation. There is no ****ing way that a sane person would think that LJ was the best back for this team, and the results of the entire season bear that out completely. And yet, these same people, who missed so horribly on evaluating our RBs, who call plays like the Castille pass, who give Matt Cassel $63 million before he has taken a snap for us are also the ones who are in charge of rebuilding this team from the ash heap.

Being happy with the results of yesterday (and I am) does not mean that you can't also look forward to the future. That's the entire point of a rebuild. I honestly can't believe that you cannot comprehend this.

When a team is as bereft as we are, you always need to have your eye towards the future. If we were in a Vermeil-esque, win now mode, I can see the point in putting blinders on, but we've got 11 picks in the draft and a free agency period coming up.

How do the moves of this regime, especially in light of what happened yesterday, inspire any confidence in the future?

I am quoting this post to show my agreement.

[TheGuardian]

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

Do you see me bitching about the outcome of the game? No.

Do you see me bitching about Jamaal Charles? No.

Do you see me bitching about Brandon Flowers, Derrick Johnson, or Glenn Dorsey? No.

I'm bitching about one thing, and one thing only: talent evaluation. There is no ****ing way that a sane person would think that LJ was the best back for this team, and the results of the entire season bear that out completely. And yet, these same people, who missed so horribly on evaluating our RBs, who call plays like the Castille pass, who give Matt Cassel $63 million before he has taken a snap for us are also the ones who are in charge of rebuilding this team from the ash heap.

Being happy with the results of yesterday (and I am) does not mean that you can't also look forward to the future. That's the entire point of a rebuild. I honestly can't believe that you cannot comprehend this.

But you can't even wait a week after the game to start this shit. that's the point. Why not just about it now, let everyone enjoy the win instead of bitching? Why? Because you have such a hard on for Haley and Pioli. So no matter what happens, the first thing you do is look for SOMETHING to bitch about.

I get that you're saying that we put Charles behind Larry, but I've explained that already. LJ was a former 2 time pro bowl back making a lot of money. He's going to be given every chance. This is NOT unusual in the NFL, on ANY team. Period. So saying that the staff has terrible evaluation skills based on that alone is horseshit. So is the Cassel thing. The guy played outstanding in New England last year. This year he was in a new system, new players, a rotating WR corps who couldn't catch, a bad line, and for most of the season no running game. But I don't see you giving the guy the benefit of the doubt based on that. Nope. So you really don't have any "fair" "unbiased" analysis of all of this at all.

When a team is as bereft as we are, you always need to have your eye towards the future. If we were in a Vermeil-esque, win now mode, I can see the point in putting blinders on, but we've got 11 picks in the draft and a free agency period coming up.

How do the moves of this regime, especially in light of what happened yesterday, inspire any confidence in the future?

I can name a few...............

Last year this team quit with a few games left to go in the season. I never saw this team quit. We walked into Denver yesterday like OUR playoff lives were on the line. Regardless of what you think, that is a CHANGE in attitude, and a big one. And the only way that happens is if a coach wins the players over. So regardless of what you or Mecca or any complainer here thinks of Haley, the guys are playing hard for him. And my guy on the roster says so too, so that outweighs anything you or anyone else here has to say about it anyway.

They eventually got the O-line thing worked out. Even if it took a few injuries, they got it worked out. Again, vets generally get the benefit of the doubt over rookies. I'm not even saying it's right, I'm saying it is what it is. You better look like some kind of all world bad ass if you are going to unseat a 8,9,10 year vet who has been starting most all of that time.

This team never quit, and to me that means the attitude of the team changed from last year in a positive way. I think the double amount of wins reflects that too. Haley could have won more than 4 easily with the dropped passes cut in half. Did he make some mistakes? Sure thing. But so did ****ing Bill Belichik and he's won 3 super bowls.

the point is, I've seen good and bad stuff but since both Pioli and Haley are new here, I am going to give them a chance to sink or swim before I start finding every little thing to bitch about. Esp when we just won in Denver for the first time in 9 years. Or I'll at least wait a ****ing week.

[alpha_omega]

No way....even I know that JC is worth more than a 5!