Life Ocala Florida fines business owner for flying "Dont Tread on Me" flag - Page 4

Deberg_1990 · 09:52 AM

A Florida small business owner said Monday the city of Ocala has threatened to fine him if he does not immediately take down a Gadsden flag currently displayed outside his store.

Gear Barrel owner Keith Greenberg told TheBlaze that the city said he was permitted to fly the American flag outside his store, but prohibited from displaying anything else outside his business which specializes in selling knives.

“This is a shock,” he said. “Honestly, I feel like this is Russia. I’ve been around the world … this is what you expect in really closed countries where there is no freedom of expression. Not here — so it’s shocking.”

“This is a shock. Honestly, I feel like this is Russia.”
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The flying of the flag appears to be prohibited under the city code of ordinance, section 110-131.

Greenberg told TheBlaze he faces being fined up to $250-$500 per day if he does not comply. He said the potential fines would be devastating to his young small business, which he opened in May.

“The city of Ocala is demanding I take this down,” he told TheBlaze.

Greenberg posted a video to YouTube earlier this month trying to raise awareness of the move being made by the city.

“We find ourselves in a sad place where local municipalities are stepping all over people’s freedom with the signing of a pen,” he said.

Greenberg told TheBlaze he was even more perplexed by the city’s demands because he has spotted other flags being flown at nearby establishments.

Photographs forwarded to TheBlaze show an Ocala car dealership flying the Mexican flag and an Irish bar displaying the Irish flag. It was not clear whether or not the city had also issued similar notices to the other businesses.

The city’s code enforcement office could not immediately be reached Monday night for comment by TheBlaze.

The small business owner said his next move will be to address the city council at their next meeting.

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2014...his-is-russia/

Coochie liquor · 09-10-2014, 06:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigMeatballDave

Ocala

This. It even says the name in the article. Fail!

DenverChief · 09-10-2014, 06:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kysirsoze

I would say freedom of speech supercedes said law. Still, not able to get too worked up about this.

Thats what I was thinking - First Amendment - on private property - what reasonable argument could the city make for restricting his right to fly that flag.

DenverChief · 09-10-2014, 06:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cosmo20002

Based on the pic in the OP, this looks like a size issue.

200 Inches = 16 feet - If thats a 16 foot flag I have a wife

DenverChief · 09-10-2014, 06:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kysirsoze

It's hard to say without knowing the language of the ordinance. If it is as he says, and only official American flags are allowed, then that's allowing a particular form of political expression and not another.

Again, I think he should just protest to the city and get it handled that way. Still, I think I understand the source of the outrage, if not the degree.

I'd bet the ACLU would handle the lawsuit

Randallflagg · 09-10-2014, 07:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kysirsoze

Only allowing people to fly American flags? Flying a flag (which in this case is patriotic anyway, not that it should matter) isn't protected free speech? The anti-outrage crowd is every bit as crazy as the pro-outrage crowd.

That's sort of the rub here.....there are American flags with Mexican flags all over the business district. He's merely flying a flag that is as much a part of America as the American flag. The "city" doesn't like it.

Frankly, I say sue the city.

Randallflagg · 09-10-2014, 07:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saul Good

This isn't a free speech issue if it applies to all flags rather than just political ones.

It's illegal for me to build a fence across my sidewalk. Freedom of speech doesn't give me the right to build a fence across my sidewalk as long as I write a political message on it.

Having this flag up isn't illegal because of what it says. It's illegal because it's a flag, and there is a law against having flags.

If that is truly the case, the city had better begin enforcing their "law" among every other business in the city and, oh, while they're at it, better take that flag down at City Hall....

Jesus, what is happening to this country.....

**Saul Good** · 09-10-2014, 07:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DenverChief

200 Inches = 16 feet - If thats a 16 foot flag I have a wife

I guess that's true if the flag is one inch wide. 16 inches long by 12.5 inches wide is 200 square inches. The flag in this picture looks to be a standard 3' by 5', which is 2,160 square inches...11 times the permissible size.

What's the point in getting worked up over this? It's not a political issue. It has nothing to do with the image/verbiage on the flag. It's a simple city ordinance limiting the size of flags outside buildings. It's not like they're stopping him from displaying the biggest Gadsden flag on Earth inside his building. You just don't get to turn a little shopping district into Tijuana by blocking the sidewalk/walkway with giant signs, flags, etc.

cosmo20002 · 09-10-2014, 09:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DenverChief

200 Inches = 16 feet - If thats a 16 foot flag I have a wife

200 SQUARE inches.

Sweet Daddy Hate · 09-10-2014, 09:53 AM

Hate speech!

Eleazar · 09-10-2014, 09:54 AM

That means a 12" x 18" flag would be just slightly too large for a city ordinance. That appears to be a standard size 3' by 5' flag, so it's safe to say he is in violation.

**Gonzo** · 09-10-2014, 10:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coochie liquor

This. It even says the name in the article. Fail!

I fixed it... It confused me.

Beef Supreme · 09-10-2014, 12:05 PM

In the spirit of the flag he is flying, he should tell them to shove it up their ass and fly it anyway.

Valiant · 09-10-2014, 12:06 PM

Reddit posted a supreme Court case on this in California. California lost. Will happen here also. Just depends how quick.

ghak99 · 09-10-2014, 02:10 PM

I only watched ~10 seconds.

I'm guessing the ordinance was originally to keep people from flogging the pedestrians with bedsheets as they walked down the sidewalk, but 200 square inches sounds awfully small.

I would hope they enforced this ordinance equally among the rest of the businesses and didn't just single out killer pricing on knives boy.

mikey23545 · 09-10-2014, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ghak99

I only watched ~10 seconds.

I'm guessing the ordinance was originally to keep people from flogging the pedestrians with bedsheets as they walked down the sidewalk, but 200 square inches sounds awfully small.

I would hope they enforced this ordinance equally among the rest of the businesses and didn't just single out killer pricing on knives boy.

He was singled out I'm sure, for an obvious reason that everyone seems to be tip-toeing around.

Everyone knows what political movement this flag has become associated with.

09-09-2014, 08:16 PM
Deberg_1990 In Search of a Life Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: San Antonio Tx. Casino cash: $224454	Ocala Florida fines business owner for flying "Dont Tread on Me" flag A Florida small business owner said Monday the city of Ocala has threatened to fine him if he does not immediately take down a Gadsden flag currently displayed outside his store. Gear Barrel owner Keith Greenberg told TheBlaze that the city said he was permitted to fly the American flag outside his store, but prohibited from displaying anything else outside his business which specializes in selling knives. “This is a shock,” he said. “Honestly, I feel like this is Russia. I’ve been around the world … this is what you expect in really closed countries where there is no freedom of expression. Not here — so it’s shocking.” “This is a shock. Honestly, I feel like this is Russia.” Share: The flying of the flag appears to be prohibited under the city code of ordinance, section 110-131. Greenberg told TheBlaze he faces being fined up to $250-$500 per day if he does not comply. He said the potential fines would be devastating to his young small business, which he opened in May. “The city of Ocala is demanding I take this down,” he told TheBlaze. Greenberg posted a video to YouTube earlier this month trying to raise awareness of the move being made by the city. “We find ourselves in a sad place where local municipalities are stepping all over people’s freedom with the signing of a pen,” he said. Greenberg told TheBlaze he was even more perplexed by the city’s demands because he has spotted other flags being flown at nearby establishments. Photographs forwarded to TheBlaze show an Ocala car dealership flying the Mexican flag and an Irish bar displaying the Irish flag. It was not clear whether or not the city had also issued similar notices to the other businesses. The city’s code enforcement office could not immediately be reached Monday night for comment by TheBlaze. The small business owner said his next move will be to address the city council at their next meeting. http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2014...his-is-russia/ Last edited by Gonzo; 09-10-2014 at 09:52 AM..
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09-10-2014, 09:53 AM	#54
Sweet Daddy Hate Unsparing Join Date: Aug 2008 Casino cash: $10004900	Hate speech! __________________ 1. Merciless, severe. 2. Given freely and generously. 100% refusal to overrate 20 year Head Coaches with ZERO **ing rings as a Head Coach. CP's Official Professor of 'Dem Blues for 2019/2020!**
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09-10-2014, 09:54 AM	#55
Eleazar Beyond the Rapids Join Date: May 2003 Location: Langley, VA Casino cash: $-370000	That means a 12" x 18" flag would be just slightly too large for a city ordinance. That appears to be a standard size 3' by 5' flag, so it's safe to say he is in violation.
Posts: 80,659

09-10-2014, 12:05 PM	#57
Beef Supreme MVP Join Date: Oct 2010 Casino cash: $10019560	In the spirit of the flag he is flying, he should tell them to shove it up their ass and fly it anyway.
Posts: 11,000

09-10-2014, 12:06 PM	#58
Valiant Valiant 'The Thread Killer' Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Kansas City Casino cash: $4542380	Reddit posted a supreme Court case on this in California. California lost. Will happen here also. Just depends how quick.
Posts: 18,552

09-10-2014, 02:10 PM	#59
ghak99 MVP Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Missouri Casino cash: $-1827750	I only watched ~10 seconds. I'm guessing the ordinance was originally to keep people from flogging the pedestrians with bedsheets as they walked down the sidewalk, but 200 square inches sounds awfully small. I would hope they enforced this ordinance equally among the rest of the businesses and didn't just single out killer pricing on knives boy.
Posts: 9,042