***Official 2015 STL Cardinals Thread***

[BigRedChief]

2011 World Series Championship
2012 NLCS. One win from another WS appearance.
2013 World Series. Two wins from another World Series Championship
2014 NLCS. Three wins from another WS appearance

• Made the postseason 10 times in the last 14 seasons.
• Only 1 losing season since 2000.
• Reached the World Series 4 times since 2004 and won as many championships (two) the past eight seasons as it did from 1965 to 2005.
• Made the NLCS 9 times including the last 4 years 2011-2014
• Three million attendance? Take it to the bank.
• 65 post season wins since 2004. 22+ wins more than any other team.

[raybec 4]

Originally Posted by O.city

Brc, at this point, Bourjos could do what Heyward is doing right Now in the field and at the dish especially.

Love Bourjos speed but he's not going to make the throws Heyward makes

[BigRedChief]

Heard Mo doing an interview on the radio today.

Marco will probably have two rehab starts

Talked about Reyes.......... Throwing 94-97mph in the 6th-7th inning. He has improved his work ethic. Some of the current staff is working with him to teach him what he needs to do to have a successful long career. Mo said there is no one to compare him to. We have never had anyone with his skill set on our MLB staffs or farm system. When pressed on his ceiling he said....."On one of the best pitching staffs in MLB, he would be the #1 starter."

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

Heard Mo doing an interview on the radio today.

Marco will probably have two rehab starts

Talked about Reyes.......... Throwing 94-97mph in the 6th-7th inning. He has improved his work ethic. Some of the current staff is working with him to teach him what he needs to do to have a successful long career. Mo said there is no one to compare him to. We have never had anyone with his skill set on our MLB staffs or farm system. When pressed on his ceiling he said....."On one of the best pitching staffs in MLB, he would be the #1 starter."

Yeah - the kid's going to be damn good.

I wouldn't trade him for Hamels. Hamels and all of Hamels contract? Sure, I'd probably do that. But there's just not enough value added with his contract in tow to make it worth dealing the only true ace-level prospect we have in this system.

The Cards aren't going to suddenly start putting up 5 runs/gm - the guys we have and the guys behind them in the system just aren't those kinds of hitters. They're going to have to win by simply keeping guys off the board.

If we can answer their Bryant with a Jose Fernandez kind of talent, then we've neutralized their best shot. Sure, it's not as sexy as big flies, but it wins ballgames.

We have Carpenter in his prime for 2 more seasons. Behind him we have Wong and Adams at the big league level with Piscotty as an okay prospect and Grichuk as an interesting but flawed player. After Holliday/Molina are no longer difference makers and Carpenter begins his decline phase, this team's going to be pretty lean offensively in fairly short order. They'll have to win games on the arms of Wacha, Martinez, Reyes, Marco and Kaminsky.

I said he could be the next Matt Harvey and I absolutely believe it. You can't deal Reyes.

[O.city]

Don't worry dj, by then Heyward will be the man.

[BigRedChief]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

Yeah - the kid's going to be damn good.

I wouldn't trade him for Hamels. Hamels and all of Hamels contract? Sure, I'd probably do that. But there's just not enough value added with his contract in tow to make it worth dealing the only true ace-level prospect we have in this system.

The Cards aren't going to suddenly start putting up 5 runs/gm - the guys we have and the guys behind them in the system just aren't those kinds of hitters. They're going to have to win by simply keeping guys off the board.

If we can answer their Bryant with a Jose Fernandez kind of talent, then we've neutralized their best shot. Sure, it's not as sexy as big flies, but it wins ballgames.

We have Carpenter in his prime for 2 more seasons. Behind him we have Wong and Adams at the big league level with Piscotty as an okay prospect and Grichuk as an interesting but flawed player. After Holliday/Molina are no longer difference makers and Carpenter begins his decline phase, this team's going to be pretty lean offensively in fairly short order. They'll have to win games on the arms of Wacha, Martinez, Reyes, Marco and Kaminsky.

I said he could be the next Matt Harvey and I absolutely believe it. You can't deal Reyes.

I've been asking just what are we going to do in 2017?

Holiday/Peralta/Molina/Waino are done

Lynn gets a big deal or he's gone

Jay, Grichuk, Bourjas, Martinez and Adams rookie deals are up.

Carp is on the decline.

That said..........I'm not in favor of a win now at all costs with our two year window. Trade Reyes/Kaminsky for a top level pitcher now.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

I've been asking just what are we going to do in 2017?

Holiday/Peralta/Molina/Waino are done

Lynn gets a big deal or he's gone

Jay, Grichuk, Bourjas, Martinez and Adams rookie deals are up.

Carp is on the decline.

That said..........I'm not in favor of a win now at all costs with our two year window. Trade Reyes/Kaminsky for a top level pitcher now.

I presume you mean "I'm now in favor..." because that sentence is contradictory otherwise.

Personally, I'm in my early 30s still - I'm going to live for a long time yet. Moreover, I've realized that getting to the playoffs is far far more important than having a 100 win ballclub. If you get to the playoffs 4 times with 90 win teams, you'll be the hot/lucky team and win a pennant in one of them. If you get to the playoffs twice with 100 win teams...well the odds say you're still likely not going to win the pennant. Once you get there, the difference in the teams is largely inconsequential.

I want to maximize the number of times we're in the dance. Selling out to give yourself an incrementally better shot at success over the next 2 years while all but assuring you have a much smaller chance of even getting there over the next 5 is just a bad gamble.

I'm not 80 and I'll have decades of watching this team ahead of me. I'm not okay with pissing away several years and scorching the earth for the instant gratification of having a 35% chance of making the WS instead of a 30% chance for the next 2 seasons.

[seclark]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

I presume you mean "I'm now in favor..." because that sentence is contradictory otherwise.

Personally, I'm in my early 30s still - I'm going to live for a long time yet. Moreover, I've realized that getting to the playoffs is far far more important than having a 100 win ballclub. If you get to the playoffs 4 times with 90 win teams, you'll be the hot/lucky team and win a pennant in one of them. If you get to the playoffs twice with 100 win teams...well the odds say you're still likely not going to win the pennant. Once you get there, the difference in the teams is largely inconsequential.

I want to maximize the number of times we're in the dance. Selling out to give yourself an incrementally better shot at success over the next 2 years while all but assuring you have a much smaller chance of even getting there over the next 5 is just a bad gamble.

I'm not 80 and I'll have decades of watching this team ahead of me. I'm not okay with pissing away several years and scorching the earth for the instant gratification of having a 35% chance of making the WS instead of a 30% chance for the next 2 seasons.

I'm w/dj except for the early 30's part.
sec

[O.city]

I would tend to think Reyes, especially with the trade of Miller and Jenkins, is untouchable.

[BigRedChief]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

I presume you mean "I'm now in favor..." because that sentence is contradictory otherwise..

I'm not in favor of blowing the future, for a 2 year window. All those things I listed are just facts. The Cardinals and Mo have proven they know how to put together a club.

I've seen my team win 4 world series's. Including seeing one won live with my son a 5th generation Cardinal fan. Thats more than the average fan will ever experience. So, I have no expediency in my fandom.

I agree there is no need to be average for 5 years just to give us a better % chance these next two years.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

I'm not in favor of blowing the future, for a 2 year window. All those things I listed are just facts. The Cardinals and Mo have proven they know how to put together a club.

I've seen my team win 4 world series's. Including seeing one won live with my son a 5th generation Cardinal fan. Thats more than the average fan will ever experience. So, I have no expediency in my fandom.

I agree there is no need to be average for 5 years just to give us a better % chance these next two years.

Ah.

So:

"That said..........I'm not in favor of a win now at all costs with our two year window. Trade Reyes/Kaminsky for a top level pitcher now"

probably should have had a semi-colon where the period is? Or do you not believe that Trading Reyes/Kaminsky is a win now at all costs move?

[BigRedChief]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

Ah.

So:

"That said..........I'm not in favor of a win now at all costs with our two year window. Trade Reyes/Kaminsky for a top level pitcher now"

probably should have had a semi-colon where the period is? Or do you not believe that Trading Reyes/Kaminsky is a win now at all costs move?

Should just put a "or trade our top talent". Trading a Reyes is defintely a win now **** the future move.

[jd1020]

Seems like a pretty generously wide strike zone tonight.

[jd1020]

Who needs a challenge anyway, right?

[Mi_chief_fan]

"Tying run at 2nd base, Pete Kozma up to bat."

ugh.....

[jd1020]

Originally Posted by Mi_chief_fan

"Tying run at 2nd base, Pete Kozma up to bat."

ugh.....

Can't be as bad as what the Cubs do to **** shit up and allow the first run to not only get on base but score from 1st.

It's confirmed that Lester can't throw to or catch at 1st.