The hold that took away our 2 point conversion

[TribalElder]

Happens to Tamba Hali and never gets called

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by Rain Man

Yeah. When I look at the end result, I look at the dropped passes first and foremost, followed immediately by the offensive line losing their battles consistently.

The first thing that will come to my mind is the fact that with a 7-6 lead and Hill lined up man to man on Timmons, our entire section saw that formation and knew - absolutely KNEW - that Hill was about to break this game open with a long TD.

We were watching the route, saw him destroy coverage at the snap and run free downfield with nobody within 10 yards, looked up and saw Smith getting happy feet and rolling the other way. I have never seen such an obvious big play unfold like that - from formation to the play itself, it was the kind of shit you can't even manage to set up on Madden. It was a no-doubter.

Smith played a tolerable game but when there was a chance to make a massive, game-changing play, the guy who makes his bones off pre-snap reads and a firm grasp of the offense evidently missed the fact that he got a bigger mismatch than Brown v. Houston and left 7 on the board. Instead of keying on the pre-snap mis-match, he scrambled about, his lineman leaked downfield (which will happen), the ineligible man downfield penalty put us behind the sticks and of course we threw underneath for 9 yards on a 3rd and 16. It was the kind of sequence that every Smith hater says will keep him from ever winning a championship. It was 'peak Smiff', so to speak.

The Steelers got the punt, walked down the field (again), took the lead and never gave it back. The Chiefs continued to fail to execute basic football shit and simply refuse to take a game that was there for them to win. That's going to be the moment that forever sticks out to me - the moment that the Chiefs had it on their racket and our 'processor' of a quarterback went braindead.

They deserved that loss.

[Rain Man]

Originally Posted by Amnorix

Jesus. Harrison had the outside from the get-go and Fisher hooked him immediately. That's holding all day, every day.

Is it the worst, most egregious hold in the history of football? No. Has worse ever gone uncalled? Yeah, probably. But that is a pretty serious hold, and I would expect it to be called 9 times out of 10.

Did you watch it in real time from the side angle? He's pushing Harrison upfield and Harrison's feet go out from under him.

If you read the rule book carefully, it can be called a holding penalty and in that case the refs should have called 160 other holding penalties during the game to be consistent with the rules.

[suzzer99]

I wonder if all the people who say "It's definitely a hold, I don't believe in the refs swallowing their whistle just because it's late in the game" would feel the same way if a pick had been called on the Clemson WR at the end of the NCG.

Fact is if this holding hadn't been called Pitt fans would whine a little but the controversy would be over in 5 minutes. That should tell you something.

[Dartgod]

Originally Posted by Snica

It was a hold. But so were countless others that never got called in key situations like that in the past. Shit, just pull up pictures of Tamba getting held like that all career long. You can't say it isn't holding 90% of the time and then call it in this situation.

Here are two of them...

[Amnorix]

That TB one is completely ridiculous.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by Amnorix

That TB one is completely ridiculous.

It's par for the course.

Had the Chiefs played adequate football, that hold would've pissed me off. That play happens to Hali all the time. The explanation given has always been that Hali creates the hold through leans that force an otherwise legal block to slide up on him.

Essentially exactly what happened with the Harrison play.

And I think I've seen Hali get that flag once in the last 5-6 years. It just doesn't get called when guys have that kind of lean.

But like I said, I'm not blaming the ref when we played like shattered ass.

[Anyong Bluth]

Enough with the mental gymnastics and excuses to minimize or rationalize things.

Drops or missed chances and the rest happen to both teams every game.

The officials swallowed their whistles until the most critical play of the game. They interjected to change the outcome and negate the score being tied up.

It's about the fundamentals of consistency. They let them play the whole night and didn't flag holds that were clear as day already posted here on Pittsburgh. You have to be an idiot if you think an official who threw the flag on the biggest play of the game didn't understand the significance of deciding arbitrarily that now is the time to call a flag for holding. That's willful intent to change the outcome by directly interceding.

Nevermind the fact that the hold in question when played in slow motion or you freeze frame it looks at first blush like a hold. No question. Then watch it at full speed in real-time, and it's debatable because Harrison appears to have lost his footing and his feet slip out from underneath him.

Which according to the rules is an exception to a holding penalty, so long as the blocker doesn't forcibly keep the defender from getting back up with his arms.

In addition, the ref calling the penalty must observe the entire sequence. He can't look over as a player is going to the ground and assume that it was the result of a penalty and infer a flaggable offense has occured.

Harrison even admitted himself that he ran himself out of the play and he'd draw a flag once in a blue moon.

The rest is conjecture, speculation, and dismissal regarding the events of how the team played up to that point. Same goes with assuming Pittsburgh would have kicked another FG and won regardless. We'll never know because the refs decided at the critical moment of the game to deviate from how they officiated the game up until then, and to do so when knowing the full implication of interjecting right then was tantamount to tipping the scales to favor one team over the other and getting a desired outcome.

Nothing anyone can say will to rationalize or excuse away the circumstances to change my mind in the fact that when the game was on the line it was decided by a subjective and inconsistent application of officiating to get the outcome they wanted plain and simple.
Full stop.

[Ghost of Maslowski]

Originally Posted by Dartgod

Here are two of them...

it's actually easier to recognize Hali on the field by the sight of a lineman's arm around this throat instead of the #91 on his jersey.

[GoShox]

I wish we could've converted the second attempt just to see what BS penalty the refs would've come up with that time.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk

[suzzer99]

It would have been a BS defensive holding (like the refs were letting them get away with all game) on a key 3rd down for Pitt.

[Amnorix]

If the NFL determines who advances and who does not, how the hell have the Cowboys -- the most popular NFL team -- not been to a Super Bowl in 20 years?

And given that the NFL obviously hates the Patriots, how do they keep winning so many games?

[Anyong Bluth]

Originally Posted by Amnorix

If the NFL determines who advances and who does not, how the hell have the Cowboys -- the most popular NFL team -- not been to a Super Bowl in 20 years?

And given that the NFL obviously hates the Patriots, how do they keep winning so many games?

The NFL hates NE?

That's a joke. Tommy got his 4 games to placate other pissed off owners and then acted like a spoiled bitch fighting it for far too long.

As for the Cowboys, they've had shit teams or a QB whose gotten turnover happy in big games. Hard to advance when you piss down your leg. Just ask Peyton - King of the regular season.

By the way, NE and Dallas Aren't THE TOPIC Of Discussion.

[Marcellus]

Originally Posted by Amnorix

If the NFL determines who advances and who does not, how the hell have the Cowboys -- the most popular NFL team -- not been to a Super Bowl in 20 years?

And given that the NFL obviously hates the Patriots, how do they keep winning so many games?

Refs can only influence what they can influence really. Even with the crazy way that Pitt didn't get a single holding penalty the entire game and we got several questionable ones, we still could have won but dropped critical passes.

We screwed ourselves along with the refs.

I don't even know that its intentional bias but I see too much shit like Hali getting raped every other play and then the Pitt game goes down like it does and you have to shake your head and wonder.

[Anyong Bluth]

Originally Posted by Marcellus

Refs can only influence what they can influence really. Even with the crazy way that Pitt didn't get a single holding penalty the entire game and we got several questionable ones, we still could have won but dropped critical passes.

We screwed ourselves along with the refs.

I don't even know that its intentional bias but I see too much shit like Hali getting raped every other play and then the Pitt game goes down like it does and you have to shake your head and wonder.

Perception is reality.

Well, if based on the evidence that is pretty clear and convincing, it would seem that that perception is objectively rooted in fact.

Substitute the Chiefs for say the Giants, and the evidence and chatter would be flooding tv, radio, and print.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by Anyong Bluth

Perception is reality.

Well, if based on the evidence that is pretty clear and convincing, it would seem that that perception is objectively rooted in fact.

Substitute the Chiefs for say the Giants, and the evidence and chatter would be flooding tv, radio, and print.

"Dez caught it!!!"

There's no question the national narrative would be different if a glory team had this happen to them.

We ain't that team.

And we had the game in our grasp a dozen times last night and never capitalized. The Chiefs made far more egregious mistakes than the mistake the officiating crew made on that play (if, in fact, it was a mistake at all).

And again, I don't think there's a chance in hell we stop Pittsburgh anyway, we hadn't all night.

So in a game where the team came out flat, the coaching staff seemed to be guessing and the execution was as poor as you'll ever see it, I'm simply not going to say "the officials screwed us!" and walk away in a huff.

The Chiefs didn't play well. At all. In any area of the game. And when that happens, you're supposed to lose.

They lost.