Chiefs Get of Mark Castle's back! - Page 14

**pr_capone** · 11-10-2009, 01:08 AM

First and foremost... I am no Cassel apologist but I am tired of reading posts just bashing Matt left and right.

Here are the numbers. And before I get started... **** all this "garbage time" bullshit. EVERY QB in the league has garbage time stats so let's not get too wrapped up in that. It's not like teams have replaced all their starters with 2nd and 3rd stringers at the end of games on us.

This is a statistical comparison of current QB's 2nd season as full time starters. Cassel, Ryan, & Flacco's stats are projected numbers of 16 games played in a season.

Pay special attention to the TD, INT, and Sack numbers.

Completions
Cassel - 286
Ryan - 312
Flacco - 366
Brady - 373
McNabb - 285
Rivers - 277

Attempts
Cassel - 514
Ryan - 514
Flacco - 564
Brady - 601
McNabb - 493
Rivers - 460

Completion Percentage
Cassel - 55.6
Ryan - 60.9
Flacco - 64.9
Brady - 62.1
McNabb - 57.8
Rivers - 60.2

Yards
Cassel - 2871
Ryan - 3568
Flacco - 4088
Brady - 3764
McNabb - 3233
Rivers - 3152

TDs
Cassel - 23
Ryan - 26
Flacco - 24
Brady - 23
McNabb - 25
Rivers - 21

INTs
Cassel - 11
Ryan - 20
Flacco - 14
Brady - 14
McNabb - 12
Rivers - 15

Sacks
Cassel - 62
Ryan - 24
Flacco - 32
Brady - 31
McNabb - 39
Rivers - 22

What I get out of the stats.

While Cassel could certainly stand to improve his completion percentage and total yardage, he is doing a damn fine job of producing in this ****tarded offense. His completion and total yardage stats have been killed due to the fact that the man has zero time to set up and find an open receiver as shown by the sack numbers. I would love to know the number of times each QB was hurried and forced to run but if the sack numbers are any indication, Cassel would nearly double the amount of any of the QB's listed in this comparison. His mobility has likely saved him from another dozen or so sacks at the halfway mark.

People dog Cassel for being unable to throw the deep ball. Hopefully that argument was squelched a bit after the long pass to Chambers today whom he hit in stride for a TD. It is amazing what a competent QB can do when he has a bit of time and a receiver with reliable hands & a touch of speed.

Lastly, and probably of most importance for a team like the Chiefs who are in transition on both sides of the ball, Cassel takes care of the damn ball while still throwing TD's. Cassel is on pace to throw fewer interceptions than any of the QB's listed in the comparison despite his o-line's inability to keep him on his feet. In fact, he has thrown interceptions in only 2 of his 7 games played so far this season. Oh yeah... and though he has been sacked more than any of the QB's listed he has yet to lose a fumble.

I don't know what more you want from the guy.

It's not his fault 3/5 of his offensive line would not start on ANY other team in the NFL.

Its not his fault that his coach is calling a limp dick game offensively.

Its not his fault that his featured RB averaged a whopping 2.7 yards per carry with 0 TDs prior to his suspension and release.

Its not his fault his receivers can't get open.

Its not his fault he is having to pick himself up off the ground on half the passing plays.

I'm not claiming that this guy will be the next Manning, Brees, or Brady. I'm saying this guy COULD be a solid QB for seasons to come if he only had some protection.

I like to bitch about the team as much as the next feller but let's bitch about the players that deserved to be bitched about.

[/rant]

**doomy3** · 11-11-2009, 12:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raised On Riots

I ask again; what was the Casshole sales-pitch against drafting a rookie?

I really wish you could get it through your pea-sized brain to realize it wasn't about "drafting a rookie." It was about drafting Mark Sanchez. Many, myself included, simply didn't think he was worth the pick. I still believe that.

**BossChief** · 11-11-2009, 12:54 AM

This thread and all of the zombies statements remind me of one of my favorite sayings:

"never argue with an idiot, they will just drag you down to their level and beat you with experience."

Sweet Daddy Hate · 11-11-2009, 12:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by doomy3

I really wish you could get it through your pea-sized brain to realize it wasn't about "drafting a rookie." It was about drafting Mark Sanchez. Many, myself included, simply didn't think he was worth the pick. I still believe that.

Of course you do.

**BossChief** · 11-11-2009, 01:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raised On Riots

Of course you do.

I was not a Sanchez supporter one bit, but I bet he ends up a much better qb than Cassel. I hope this ends up being dead wrong.

|Zach| · 11-11-2009, 01:02 AM

This team has about a billion more problems before QB

Sweet Daddy Hate · 11-11-2009, 01:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BossChief

I was not a Sanchez supporter one bit, but I bet he ends up a much better qb than Cassel. I hope this ends up being dead wrong.

I can understand your position. I mean, what was there to like?

**BossChief** · 11-11-2009, 01:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raised On Riots

I can understand your position. I mean, what was there to like?

here we go:

I wasn't on board because of the bust factor of him only having such a small sample to go off in college, he also played on a very talented team.

This is also why I didn't like the Cassel acquisition in the first place.

To be honest, I wanted to sign Jeff Garcia and wait till next year to draft a QB. I hoped Gailey would stick and that we would draft Bradford this year with our first.

I was torn about our first rounder and taking Jackson to force the 3-4 was disapointing, but change was in order. Drastic change.

I would have rather drafted Orakpo and Mauluga with our top two and go with that plan at qb, than do what we did. No, that isnt saying that is what I wanted to do, just that it would have been better than what we did IMHO.

Orakpo(yeah I said it)
Dorsey
Tank
Hali

DJ
Rey
Williams

Flowers
Morgan
Pollard
Carr

is better than

Dorsey
Edwards
Jackson

Hali
Williams
Mays
Vrabel

Flowers
Morgan
Brown
Carr

...easily IMHO and that would have been a failure of a draft, but at least would have made us better immediately and long term as well. At least that defense could pressure opposing qbs and play good rush defense.

Pair that to an upgraded mobile qb that has good leadership and veteran presence and spend some money on Jason Brown and use some picks between rounds 3-5 on olinemen and another receiver to pair with Bowe and keep Tony G.

That puts the offense at
Garcia/Thigpen/Croyle
Cox
LJ/Charles/Battle/Kolby

Albert/Taylor
Waters/draft pick
Brown/Wade Smith
Rudy/draft pick
Taucher/fa

Tony G/Cottam/fa
Bowe
draft pick

We might have a chance at winning a few with that lineup.

What do I know.

Sweet Daddy Hate · 11-11-2009, 02:12 AM

I'm down with going the route of Sanchez/Garcia. I think that would have been a good combination of stop-gap/mentor, and building for the future. I do but I don't understand the concept of throwing these guys out on the field in their rookie years like Detroit and NYJ have done. It wouldn't have killed either of those guys to sit this year, especially Stafford. But what's done is done.
You can't look at what Mark has done and not be impressed. Even with the bumps in the road, the NFL learning-curve, and the lumps he's taken, the kid absolutely refuses to roll over and wilt.
As to the rest of our 09 draft and direction of the team, you should ask Hamas to re-post his board; it'll make you ****ing cringe and bang your head at how awesome and complete it is.

**BossChief** · 11-11-2009, 02:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raised On Riots

I'm down with going the route of Sanchez/Garcia. I think that would have been a good combination of stop-gap/mentor, and building for the future. I do but I don't understand the concept of throwing these guys out on the field in their rookie years like Detroit and NYJ have done. It wouldn't have killed either of those guys to sit this year, especially Stafford. But what's done is done.
You can't look at what Mark has done and not be impressed. Even with the bumps in the road, the NFL learning-curve, and the lumps he's taken, the kid absolutely refuses to roll over and wilt.
As to the rest of our 09 draft and direction of the team, you should ask Hamas to re-post his board; it'll make you ****ing cringe and bang your head at how awesome and complete it is.

I see eye to eye with Hamas more than any other poster on the board on most issues since I have been here. We dont agree on everything, but I respect his opinion more than most on here, that is for sure! I am also sure he watches more college ball than me so his opinion on matters reguarding the players in the draft should hold a lot more weight than mine would if I doubled how much I watch college ball outside of a few teams.

You could definitely say take out Orakpo from my "bad example" and place Sanchez on the bench behind Garcia. I could see that. I wouldnt be against it 100% But it would be handcuffing us to him no matter what and I think that if we kept gailey, we also kept the "Arrowspread" and that Bradford would be a much better fit than Sanchez would be to it. JMO I may be wrong.

We need/ed a pass rusher and Orakpo was the best one out there and would have at least fit a need is all I am really saying.

Its really disappointing/disturbing to think how many different directions we could have gone other than the one we did.

Sweet Daddy Hate · 11-11-2009, 02:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BossChief

I see eye to eye with Hamas more than any other poster on the board on most issues since I have been here. We dont agree on everything, but I respect his opinion more than most on here, that is for sure! I am also sure he watches more college ball than me so his opinion on matters reguarding the players in the draft should hold a lot more weight than mine would if I doubled how much I watch college ball outside of a few teams.

You could definitely say take out Orakpo from my "bad example" and place Sanchez on the bench behind Garcia. I could see that. I wouldnt be against it 100% But it would be handcuffing us to him no matter what and I think that if we kept gailey, we also kept the "Arrowspread" and that Bradford would be a much better fit than Sanchez would be to it. JMO I may be wrong.

We need/ed a pass rusher and Orakpo was the best one out there and would have at least fit a need is all I am really saying.

Its really disappointing/disturbing to think how many different directions we could have gone other than the one we did.

Well here's the thing, and I believe this to be true; Pioli was less interested in a build or "rebuild" than he was in trying to introduce a paradigm-shift to the operation as a whole.
Unfortunately, many things were underplayed, unnoticed, and quite frankly neglected as a result.
These guys are in a ****ing hole and desperately trying to get out of it.
Not because they suck, not because they have no talent or the proper mentoring necessary to begin the new jobs and task that they've undertaken, but because their first consensus as a partnership was the Wrong Call.
Fortunately, we're in a good place cap-wise to start turning it around. But the reality is; this year is lost, and the upcoming off season is where it truly begins for the "new face" of this franchise.
On many fronts.

People here and elsewhere complain about "lack of patience". To accuse a Chiefs fan of having "no patience" is to call the Earth flat; it's an absolute ****ing joke.
Are you ****ing kidding me?!?!?
If Chiefs fans were a Monastic Order, we'd more than likely be named "Disciples of Job" for ****'s sake.
But that doesn't mean we have to sit idly by and just "hope that people know what they're doing", and that everything is going to be alright.

Besides, where's the fun in that?

I submit that this fan base needs to get a little tougher and darker; the festive era of 60's Chiefs are over and we're dealing with guys who are more or less straight-up east coast.
It's time for the Chiefs Nation to grow eyes in the back and sleep with one eye open.

**SAUTO** · 11-11-2009, 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by milkman

That ball was a rainbow, and Chambers had to come to a virtual stop to make that catch.

Hell, you had time to go take a dump while waiting for it to come down.

milkman this is just soo wrong. i have watched it 20 times and he never slows down

cookster50 · 11-11-2009, 08:13 AM

Not reading all 14 pages of this, so if this has been said, who cares.

I wish everyone would get of everyone else's back.

milkman · 11-11-2009, 08:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JASONSAUTO

milkman this is just soo wrong. i have watched it 20 times and he never slows down

This is a play that needs to be giffed.

**SAUTO** · 11-11-2009, 08:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by milkman

This is a play that needs to be giffed.

i agree. there are so many people wrong about this. the pass was a rainbow. that part is right. BUT chambers never slowed down to catch it.

the rainbow part doesnt bother me so much because a lot of qbs throw the ball with that type of trajectory. but the pass was spot on the money

**SAUTO** · 11-11-2009, 08:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by milkman

This is a play that needs to be giffed.

oh and paging clay, clay we need some giffin action page 14

11-10-2009, 01:08 AM
pr_capone THREEPEAT!!! Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: NWMO Casino cash: $9948214	Get of Mark Castle's back! First and foremost... I am no Cassel apologist but I am tired of reading posts just bashing Matt left and right. Here are the numbers. And before I get started... ** all this "garbage time" bullshit. EVERY QB in the league has garbage time stats so let's not get too wrapped up in that. It's not like teams have replaced all their starters with 2nd and 3rd stringers at the end of games on us. This is a statistical comparison of current QB's 2nd season as full time starters. Cassel, Ryan, & Flacco's stats are projected numbers of 16 games played in a season. Pay special attention to the TD, INT, and Sack numbers. Completions Cassel - 286 Ryan - 312 Flacco - 366 Brady - 373 McNabb - 285 Rivers - 277 Attempts Cassel - 514 Ryan - 514 Flacco - 564 Brady - 601 McNabb - 493 Rivers - 460 Completion Percentage Cassel - 55.6 Ryan - 60.9 Flacco - 64.9 Brady - 62.1 McNabb - 57.8 Rivers - 60.2 Yards Cassel - 2871 Ryan - 3568 Flacco - 4088 Brady - 3764 McNabb - 3233 Rivers - 3152 TDs Cassel - 23 Ryan - 26 Flacco - 24 Brady - 23 McNabb - 25 Rivers - 21 INTs Cassel - 11 Ryan - 20 Flacco - 14 Brady - 14 McNabb - 12 Rivers - 15 Sacks Cassel - 62 Ryan - 24 Flacco - 32 Brady - 31 McNabb - 39 Rivers - 22 What I get out of the stats. While Cassel could certainly stand to improve his completion percentage and total yardage, he is doing a damn fine job of producing in this **tarded offense. His completion and total yardage stats have been killed due to the fact that the man has zero time to set up and find an open receiver as shown by the sack numbers. I would love to know the number of times each QB was hurried and forced to run but if the sack numbers are any indication, Cassel would nearly double the amount of any of the QB's listed in this comparison. His mobility has likely saved him from another dozen or so sacks at the halfway mark. People dog Cassel for being unable to throw the deep ball. Hopefully that argument was squelched a bit after the long pass to Chambers today whom he hit in stride for a TD. It is amazing what a competent QB can do when he has a bit of time and a receiver with reliable hands & a touch of speed. Lastly, and probably of most importance for a team like the Chiefs who are in transition on both sides of the ball, Cassel takes care of the damn ball while still throwing TD's. Cassel is on pace to throw fewer interceptions than any of the QB's listed in the comparison despite his o-line's inability to keep him on his feet. In fact, he has thrown interceptions in only 2 of his 7 games played so far this season. Oh yeah... and though he has been sacked more than any of the QB's listed he has yet to lose a fumble. I don't know what more you want from the guy. It's not his fault 3/5 of his offensive line would not start on ANY other team in the NFL. Its not his fault that his coach is calling a limp dick game offensively. Its not his fault that his featured RB averaged a whopping 2.7 yards per carry with 0 TDs prior to his suspension and release. Its not his fault his receivers can't get open. Its not his fault he is having to pick himself up off the ground on half the passing plays. I'm not claiming that this guy will be the next Manning, Brees, or Brady. I'm saying this guy COULD be a solid QB for seasons to come if he only had some protection. I like to bitch about the team as much as the next feller but let's bitch about the players that deserved to be bitched about. [/rant]
Posts: 19,897

11-11-2009, 12:54 AM	#197
BossChief SuperBowl or bust Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: BF Iowa Casino cash: $-1675912	This thread and all of the zombies statements remind me of one of my favorite sayings: "never argue with an idiot, they will just drag you down to their level and beat you with experience." __________________ Dreams do come true... http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showp...postcount=1407
Posts: 47,896

11-11-2009, 01:02 AM	#200
\|Zach\| For The Glory Of The City Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Kansas City Casino cash: $3106768	This team has about a billion more problems before QB
Posts: 54,724

11-11-2009, 02:12 AM	#203
Sweet Daddy Hate Unsparing Join Date: Aug 2008 Casino cash: $10004900	I'm down with going the route of Sanchez/Garcia. I think that would have been a good combination of stop-gap/mentor, and building for the future. I do but I don't understand the concept of throwing these guys out on the field in their rookie years like Detroit and NYJ have done. It wouldn't have killed either of those guys to sit this year, especially Stafford. But what's done is done. You can't look at what Mark has done and not be impressed. Even with the bumps in the road, the NFL learning-curve, and the lumps he's taken, the kid absolutely refuses to roll over and wilt. As to the rest of our 09 draft and direction of the team, you should ask Hamas to re-post his board; it'll make you **ing cringe and bang your head at how awesome and complete it is. __________________ 1. Merciless, severe. 2. Given freely and generously. 100% refusal to overrate 20 year Head Coaches with ZERO ing rings as a Head Coach. CP's Official Professor of 'Dem Blues for 2019/2020!**
Posts: 77,135

11-11-2009, 08:13 AM	#207
cookster50 Supreme Commander of My House Join Date: Apr 2004 Casino cash: $13622	Not reading all 14 pages of this, so if this has been said, who cares. I wish everyone would get of everyone else's back.
Posts: 3,445