Chiefs Why are the Chargers that much better? - Page 16

synthesis2 · 09-08-2010, 04:58 PM

I know I'm going to get a lot of flack for saying this and I even put money on the under for the chargers and the over on the chiefs because of this but I just don't see where they are that great of a team, especially with the changes.

Comparisons:

QB Chargers - B/B+ (not elite) Chiefs C (average at best)
RB Chargers - B- Chiefs A (may have best in league with combo)
WR Chargers - C+/B- (with holdout) Chiefs C+/B-
Oline Chargers - B Chiefs - B
TE Chargers - A Chiefs - D/C ( still not sure on 3rd round pick)
DL Chargers - B Chiefs - C/C+
LB Chargers - B Chiefs - B
Sec Chargers - C Chiefs - B+
Spec Chargers - B Chiefs - A
coaching Chargers -C Chiefs - B (with new off and def cord)

I guess we will see Monday but I just don't see it with the Chargers this year, besides QB, they are very pedestrian and we are better in several areas.

B_Ambuehl · 09-10-2010, 12:03 AM

Quote:

Tell me ONE thing that will make a difference between losing by 30 or more points.

Don't give me Weis or Crennel. Coaches don't make NEARLY the difference people think it will make.

Hence, Herm to Haley.

Eric Berry can't shut down Matthews and Gates by himself.

McCluster will be lucky if he breaks 50 yards total.

Cassel sucks ****ing ass.

The "crowd", in the end, doesn't mean jackshit.

So, what does that leave us with?

Peeholi?

baitism · 09-10-2010, 12:10 AM

Goddamn, all of you are reeruned. Just get out of this thread until Monday night.

B_Ambuehl · 09-10-2010, 12:45 AM

Seriously, I'm a fan of both teams, they're the only 2 teams I follow each and every week, and they have a considerable amount in common. Both teams have hard assed front offices that in recent history routinely make terrible personnel decisions. Both teams run 3-4 defenses and both have practice squad caliber defensive fronts and undermanned inside linebackers. Both have lackluster offensive tackle play. Both teams have pretty good corners and both have (or should have) 1 good safety. Both have a scheme built around a strong running game.

The main difference is QB, TE, scheme, and things a QB allows them to do in scheme. I'm sure Haley would love to get down the field but Cassell can't throw anything deeper than 10 yards. Rivers is accurate with the deep ball, has Gates to draw congestion to the middle, has a dynamite safety valve in Sproles, and all that allows Norv a lot of versatility in play calling.

The other main difference I see is D coordinator. Ron Rivera schemed the chargers D to a top 15 ranking in points allowed with nothing to work with other than smoke and mirrors. That team defensively had no business being 13-3 last year. They've been dead last or 2nd to last in QB pressures the prior 3 years and gave up nearly 5 yds/carry on the ground to at least one rusher in the majority of games they played, the majority of their defense grades out at well below average, but they were still able to make enough plays when it counted because of the way Rivera used them.

I saw nothing in preseason to indicate any major change in scheme or approach for the Chiefs 3-4. Crennell still has Ron Edwards playing a 2-gap role but he can be effectively blocked with just a center. Tyson Jackson is a 4-3 left defensive end playing out of position. Dorsey tries but he's not big enough to effectively be a force doing what they're asking him to do. The end result is an easy ~5 yards thru the a-gaps on the majority of inside runs.

The Parcells 3-4 (which Romeo runs) is outdated and has been for a couple of years now. That's why Miami brought in Mike Nolan. That's largely why the Pats got gutted for 250 on the ground against the Ravens and knocked out of the playoffs.

For an alternate 1-shade/1-gap approach (which the personnel is better suited for) watch the Cowboys under Phillips.

When your front line is overmatched you concede yards on the ground, concede TOP and generally have to get a lot of quick scores to win. The Saints & Pats can get away with it because of their offense.

The basic problem with the chiefs is their approach offensively doesn't match up to what they can do defensively. They might be able to pressure the QB a bit and hold up on the back end in the passing game, but being a team that runs to win they need to be able to stop the run and force teams into consistent 3rd and long situations so they can get after the QB and let their secondary fly around and make plays.

Notice around the league virtually all the teams that run the ball for high yardage are generally very good at stopping the run. Most of the teams that throw the ball for big yardage are good at pressuring the QB. Until the Chiefs get to the point where their O and D complement each other opposing teams will be able to play day 1 install and drive the ball, run the clock, play conservative D and know that Cassell & the passing game will eventually shit the bed. Last year it generally didn't take much longer than a quarter or so for that to happen. We'll see.

synthesis2 · 09-11-2010, 12:36 PM

I'm just saying that with their best WR out as well as their best OLine man who happens to be the left tackle and with all of the upgrades we have done over the season, I think we have a real shot at beating them. We will see come Monday night if I'm way off or not but looking at it on paper, its looks very close.

**the Talking Can** · 09-11-2010, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Meat Dragon

well he did take an 11 win Matt Cassel led team and turned them into a ... 10 win team.

which means nothing, you flaming dipshit

chiefs fans and stats

always a deadly mix

synthesis2 · 09-11-2010, 03:55 PM

Go F### yourself A-hole

-King- · 09-11-2010, 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by synthesis2

Go F### yourself A-hole

Self censoring is frowned upon on Chiefs Planet.

synthesis2 · 09-11-2010, 06:44 PM

Just responding to talking can, people that try and put others down, I have zero patience for...

Chiefs Pantalones · 09-11-2010, 06:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by synthesis2

Just responding to talking can, people that try and put others down, I have zero patience for...

Let's get naked.

**DaneMcCloud** · 09-11-2010, 06:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by synthesis2

Just responding to talking can, people that try and put others down, I have zero patience for...

Then you're on the wrong website

**the Talking Can** · 09-11-2010, 06:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by synthesis2

Just responding to talking can, people that try and put others down, I have zero patience for...

your mom is my toilet

Chiefs Pantalones · 09-11-2010, 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the Talking Can

your mom is my toilet

**the Talking Can** · 09-11-2010, 06:52 PM

i mean, you're defending hootie for christ sake

the man likes to pee on his friends in the shower

**Rausch** · 09-11-2010, 07:00 PM

If we have any shot at beating the Chargers it's this game...

Chiefs Pantalones · 09-11-2010, 07:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rausch

If we have any shot at beating the Chargers it's this game...

I agree. I think we can wear them down with our running game, control the clock, long drives.

09-08-2010, 04:58 PM
synthesis2 synthesis2 Join Date: Mar 2005 Casino cash: $9245401	Why are the Chargers that much better? I know I'm going to get a lot of flack for saying this and I even put money on the under for the chargers and the over on the chiefs because of this but I just don't see where they are that great of a team, especially with the changes. Comparisons: QB Chargers - B/B+ (not elite) Chiefs C (average at best) RB Chargers - B- Chiefs A (may have best in league with combo) WR Chargers - C+/B- (with holdout) Chiefs C+/B- Oline Chargers - B Chiefs - B TE Chargers - A Chiefs - D/C ( still not sure on 3rd round pick) DL Chargers - B Chiefs - C/C+ LB Chargers - B Chiefs - B Sec Chargers - C Chiefs - B+ Spec Chargers - B Chiefs - A coaching Chargers -C Chiefs - B (with new off and def cord) I guess we will see Monday but I just don't see it with the Chargers this year, besides QB, they are very pedestrian and we are better in several areas.
Posts: 577

09-10-2010, 12:10 AM	#227
baitism Starter Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Overland Park, KS Casino cash: $3579551	Goddamn, all of you are reeruned. Just get out of this thread until Monday night.
Posts: 274

09-10-2010, 12:45 AM	#228
B_Ambuehl Veteran Join Date: Apr 2005 Casino cash: $9705405	Seriously, I'm a fan of both teams, they're the only 2 teams I follow each and every week, and they have a considerable amount in common. Both teams have hard assed front offices that in recent history routinely make terrible personnel decisions. Both teams run 3-4 defenses and both have practice squad caliber defensive fronts and undermanned inside linebackers. Both have lackluster offensive tackle play. Both teams have pretty good corners and both have (or should have) 1 good safety. Both have a scheme built around a strong running game. The main difference is QB, TE, scheme, and things a QB allows them to do in scheme. I'm sure Haley would love to get down the field but Cassell can't throw anything deeper than 10 yards. Rivers is accurate with the deep ball, has Gates to draw congestion to the middle, has a dynamite safety valve in Sproles, and all that allows Norv a lot of versatility in play calling. The other main difference I see is D coordinator. Ron Rivera schemed the chargers D to a top 15 ranking in points allowed with nothing to work with other than smoke and mirrors. That team defensively had no business being 13-3 last year. They've been dead last or 2nd to last in QB pressures the prior 3 years and gave up nearly 5 yds/carry on the ground to at least one rusher in the majority of games they played, the majority of their defense grades out at well below average, but they were still able to make enough plays when it counted because of the way Rivera used them. I saw nothing in preseason to indicate any major change in scheme or approach for the Chiefs 3-4. Crennell still has Ron Edwards playing a 2-gap role but he can be effectively blocked with just a center. Tyson Jackson is a 4-3 left defensive end playing out of position. Dorsey tries but he's not big enough to effectively be a force doing what they're asking him to do. The end result is an easy ~5 yards thru the a-gaps on the majority of inside runs. The Parcells 3-4 (which Romeo runs) is outdated and has been for a couple of years now. That's why Miami brought in Mike Nolan. That's largely why the Pats got gutted for 250 on the ground against the Ravens and knocked out of the playoffs. For an alternate 1-shade/1-gap approach (which the personnel is better suited for) watch the Cowboys under Phillips. When your front line is overmatched you concede yards on the ground, concede TOP and generally have to get a lot of quick scores to win. The Saints & Pats can get away with it because of their offense. The basic problem with the chiefs is their approach offensively doesn't match up to what they can do defensively. They might be able to pressure the QB a bit and hold up on the back end in the passing game, but being a team that runs to win they need to be able to stop the run and force teams into consistent 3rd and long situations so they can get after the QB and let their secondary fly around and make plays. Notice around the league virtually all the teams that run the ball for high yardage are generally very good at stopping the run. Most of the teams that throw the ball for big yardage are good at pressuring the QB. Until the Chiefs get to the point where their O and D complement each other opposing teams will be able to play day 1 install and drive the ball, run the clock, play conservative D and know that Cassell & the passing game will eventually shit the bed. Last year it generally didn't take much longer than a quarter or so for that to happen. We'll see.
Posts: 2,613

09-11-2010, 12:36 PM	#229
synthesis2 synthesis2 Join Date: Mar 2005 Casino cash: $9245401	I'm just saying that with their best WR out as well as their best OLine man who happens to be the left tackle and with all of the upgrades we have done over the season, I think we have a real shot at beating them. We will see come Monday night if I'm way off or not but looking at it on paper, its looks very close.
Posts: 577

09-11-2010, 03:55 PM	#231
synthesis2 synthesis2 Join Date: Mar 2005 Casino cash: $9245401	Go F### yourself A-hole
Posts: 577

09-11-2010, 06:44 PM	#233
synthesis2 synthesis2 Join Date: Mar 2005 Casino cash: $9245401	Just responding to talking can, people that try and put others down, I have zero patience for...
Posts: 577

09-11-2010, 06:52 PM	#238
the Talking Can Supporter Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: street Casino cash: $9122208	i mean, you're defending hootie for christ sake the man likes to pee on his friends in the shower __________________ Clark Hunt: "Thank god for the Dominican pool boy"
Posts: 51,585