Chiefs vs. Bills discussion thread...

[ToxSocks]

Originally Posted by feldspar

It's pretty much impossible to show you that the Bills are better than the Chiefs, whether it's true or not. Most people have their minds made up already, and the only real way to prove it is on the field. That's why they play the games.

No it's not. Im looking for a fair analysis on why the Bills are better. Position by position, I wanna know why you think the Bills are the stronger team.

[feldspar]

Originally Posted by Detoxing

No it's not. Im looking for a fair analysis on why the Bills are better. Position by position, I wanna know why you think the Bills are the stronger team.

I've laid out a ton of shit about what I think of the Bills and this matchup. Why don't you tell me why you think the Chiefs are the stronger team?

[ToxSocks]

Originally Posted by feldspar

I've laid out a ton of shit about what I think of the Bills. Why don't you tell me why you think the Chiefs are the stronger team?

That's great and all but all I've seen you do is talk up your team. If you honestly think the Bills are going to win, show me how they're going to do it. You think your receivers are going to torch our secondary or something? You think your O-Line is stronger than our D-Line?

Position by position, show me.

[feldspar]

Originally Posted by Detoxing

That's great and all but all I've seen you do is talk up your team. If you honestly think the Bills are going to win, show me how they're going to do it. You think your receivers are going to torch our secondary or something? You think your O-Line is stronger than our D-Line?

Position by position, show me.

To do that properly, it would take me about an hour. I won't do that. If you go back to some of my previous posts, I did some of what you are asking me to do already. I don't just talk up my team, either. There are bad things too, believe me. I just figure I probably know more about the Bills than Chiefs fans do...just like Chiefs fans probably know more about their team than I do.

I don't claim to know exactly what's going to happen. Anything could happen. I've yet to see THIS Bills team play a real game, so I've been talking about the general hope of what is supposed to happen...how they have it geared. Whether it works out that way and to what degree remains to be seen.

Like I said before, I think the key to this game will be the Bills ability to stop the run. That'll be the biggest thing, and it doesn't take any kind of great insight to see that.

Why don't you tell me some things about the Chiefs I may not know?

[Hammock Parties]

Originally Posted by feldspar

I've laid out a ton of shit about what I think of the Bills and this matchup. Why don't you tell me why you think the Chiefs are the stronger team?

1. The Bills literally have no answer for KC's pass rush + secondary. You have no offensive line and one receiver. You won't be able to pass.

2. The Bills don't have a high-level ground game to fall back on. Because of your completely inept passing attack, the Chiefs are going to stack the box and completely shut down the run.

3. Conclusion: The Bills won't be putting together long scoring drives.

I don't care what happens with KC's offense. The Bills have one elite defender, a raw rookie and a bunch of retreads and garbage from last year. They might play OK, but the giant mismatch of Buffalo's offense against KC's defense is going to win this game.

[feldspar]

Originally Posted by Gif Horse

1. The Bills literally have no answer for KC's pass rush + secondary. You have no offensive line and one receiver. You won't be able to pass.

2. The Bills don't have a high-level ground game to fall back on. Because of your completely inept passing attack, the Chiefs are going to stack the box and completely shut down the run.

3. Conclusion: The Bills won't be putting together long scoring drives.

Ah, the dreaded shut-down Kansas City defense...you must know how creative an offensive mind Chan Gailey is. His offensive game-plans are perhaps his biggest strength. There is actually a lot of things we can do. I think the Bills lined up in 4 receiver sets like 25% of the time last year. CJ Spiller can be split wide. Roscoe Parrish is a threat in the slot. Brad Smith will play some Wildcat, which Haley will have to plan against. Stevie Johnson is good. We have several promising young WR prospect, which is the reason we let Evans go. I like your optimism, but

Ryan Fitzpatrick is smart. Sports Illustrated had him ranked as the fifth smartest athlete in sports. The guy can recognize defensive looks and make adjustments and call audibles at the line. He makes the o-line better, which they need. Fitzpatrick completed over 67% of his passes for 382 yards, 4 TDs and 2 INTs against the Baltimore Ravens last year. I think their defense is a little better than the Chiefs. Just sayin'.

Fred Jackson is a very good RB. CJ Spiller will get some touches. They WILL make some plays.

The line is a question mark. We do have a couple of few good guys on it, and a couple of new guys, who actually haven't looked all that bad so far. The LT has been steadily improving, but needs to improve more. We'll see if the negative hype has been deserved. We'll put some TE blocking help in there, and Fred Jackson is a very good blocker too. FB help won't hurt.

There is my positive spin.

Originally Posted by Gif Horse

I don't care what happens with KC's offense. The Bills have one elite defender, a raw rookie and a bunch of retreads and garbage from last year. They might play OK, but the giant mismatch of Buffalo's offense against KC's defense is going to win this game.

The Bills have very good depth up front on the line for a change...rotation won't be a problem. We have some high round picks from last year looking to step up as well. I wouldn't go around calling Dareus a raw rookie either. This kid looks like the real deal. Nick Barnett is new to the team, and he's solid. I don't want to start a whole new Merriman discussion...Our secondary is good and has depth.

Don't underestimate the fact that we are in year 2 of the new system. So many changes were put in place last year that it was impossible to implement them all successfully, especially with the personnel we had. It kicked in later and we went 4-4 down the stretch. Gailey and Nix had their hands full cleaning up the mess left by Dick Jauron. The players had to be evaluated - we started the season off with Trent Edwards at QB, for Christ's sake.

[Hammock Parties]

Originally Posted by feldspar

Ah, the dreaded shut-down Kansas City defense...you must know how creative an offensive mind Chan Gailey is.

YOU SCORED TEN ****ING POINTS ON US LAST YEAR.

You lost Evans, the Chiefs got better on D.

WHAT PART OF LOGIC DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND?

I wouldn't go around calling Dareus a raw rookie either. This kid looks like the real deal.

He's a rookie defensive tackle. Expecting him to be an impact player right away is a pipe dream....9/10 rookie defensive tackles three years to develop.

[O.city]

Originally Posted by Gif Horse

YOU SCORED TEN ****ING POINTS ON US LAST YEAR.

You lost Evans, the Chiefs got better on D.

WHAT PART OF LOGIC DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND?



He's a rookie defensive tackle. Expecting him to be an impact player right away is a pipe dream....9/10 rookie defensive tackles three years to develop.

I could see Dareus being more like McCoy from tampa. He will have a good year but dline is a tough position to learn. And he's no N. Suh.

[feldspar]

Originally Posted by Gif Horse

YOU SCORED TEN ****ING POINTS ON US LAST YEAR.

You lost Evans, the Chiefs got better on D.

WHAT PART OF LOGIC DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND?

LOL, I write a small pamphlet, and you come back with this. Anything could happen in any game. It's fun to revisit last year's matchup, but you could play the same team twice in the same year and have vastly different results. In 2003, the Bills beat the Patriots 31-0 in the opener...then the Patriots beat the Bills 31-0 in the final game. Look at the difference between the two Chargers/Chiefs matchups last year.

The opener can be especially tricky. The trend is to focus on how changes look on paper, cuz that's all you got. You don't really know until you see it on the field. Everybody TRIED to get better this offseason, and everybody is trying to rob the same train.

Evans hasn't made an impact for us in a couple of years now. He should be much better in Baltimore.

Originally Posted by Gif Horse

He's a rookie defensive tackle. Expecting him to be an impact player right away is a pipe dream....9/10 rookie defensive tackles three years to develop.

Dareus is as strong as a bull already. He's a special player, or should be. All he has to do is hold his ground against a couple of lineman without getting pushed backwards on most plays...take on a double team. It's not rocket science. He'll need some time to reach his potential, but make no mistake: he's an immediate improvement to that line. Torrell Troup, our second round pick from last year, needed a year (so far), but Dareus is way ahead of most d-lineman coming into the NFL. He might be that 1 out of 10. We'll see.

[ToxSocks]

Originally Posted by feldspar

Ah, the dreaded shut-down Kansas City defense...

Look, I've been hesitant to enter the debate because I know what it feels like to be in your shoes. We were just there. Still Kinda am there. Rebuilding.

Most of us Chiefs fans were fond of Gailey. We know from experience that he can make Chicken Salad out of Chicken Shit.

But the NFL is about Matchups. And the Bills don't matchup well with the Chiefs right now. Same way the Chiefs don't matchup well with a team like the Ravens.

Here is my take on what will happen:

1. C.J Spiller won't be a factor. Not because he isn't a good player, but because there won't be enough offensive plays ran to utilize him. The Bills will see a lot of 3 and outs.

2. They'll see a lot 3 and outs because of your swiss cheese O-line. We have a premier pass rusher in Tamba Hali. We have run stuffers in Kelly Gregg and Dorsey. We have others up and coming, but you don't know who they are so I won't even talk about them. It'll go in one ear and out the other. Kinda like when you talk about no-name Bills to us. There will be someone in Fitz's face all day.

3. The Chiefs will stack the box. Fitz will be forced to throw short because of the heavy pressure. Holding the Ball and throwing downfield isn't an option here. The Bills will have to dink and dunk their way downfield.

4. Stevie Johnson will likely grab a few balls against Flowers. Flowers has a difficult time dealing with speed. He'll be good for a few first downs but likely not enough to sustain drives.


The bottom line is you guys just don't have enough offensive playmakers to deal with the Chiefs D. Gaily can only scheme so much. Keep in mind who he is scheming against. And no, I am not talking about Haley...

It's not a knock on the Bills, it's just a bad Match up for them. This is going to be a low scoring game.

I don't think the Chiefs will score a lot of points either. I think our offense will be inconsistant. They will struggle to find any sort of rhythem. But at the end of the day, we have more playmakers on both sides of the ball then you guys do.

Chiefs 20
Bills 10

[feldspar]

Originally Posted by Detoxing

Look, I've been hesitant to enter the debate because I know what it feels like to be in your shoes. We were just there. Still Kinda am there. Rebuilding.

Most of us Chiefs fans were fond of Gailey. We know from experience that he can make Chicken Salad out of Chicken Shit.

But the NFL is about Matchups. And the Bills don't matchup well with the Chiefs right now. Same way the Chiefs don't matchup well with a team like the Ravens.

Here is my take on what will happen:

1. C.J Spiller won't be a factor. Not because he isn't a good player, but because there won't be enough offensive plays ran to utilize him. The Bills will see a lot of 3 and outs.

2. They'll see a lot 3 and outs because of your swiss cheese O-line. We have a premier pass rusher in Tamba Hali. We have run stuffers in Kelly Gregg and Dorsey. We have others up and coming, but you don't know who they are so I won't even talk about them. It'll go in one ear and out the other. Kinda like when you talk about no-name Bills to us. There will be someone in Fitz's face all day.

3. The Chiefs will stack the box. Fitz will be forced to throw short because of the heavy pressure. Holding the Ball and throwing downfield isn't an option here. The Bills will have to dink and dunk their way downfield.

4. Stevie Johnson will likely grab a few balls against Flowers. Flowers has a difficult time dealing with speed. He'll be good for a few first downs but likely not enough to sustain drives.


The bottom line is you guys just don't have enough offensive playmakers to deal with the Chiefs D. Gaily can only scheme so much. Keep in mind who he is scheming against. And no, I am not talking about Haley...

It's not a knock on the Bills, it's just a bad Match up for them. This is going to be a low scoring game.

I don't think the Chiefs will score a lot of points either. I think our offense will be inconsistant. They will struggle to find any sort of rhythem. But at the end of the day, we have more playmakers on both sides of the ball then you guys do.

Chiefs 20
Bills 10

I respect your opinion.