Great question asked on Arrowhead Pride:

[Direckshun]

This is the 3rd year of Haley's 4-yr contract. Barring the unforseen, Haley will be going into 2012 without a contract extension and be in the final year of his 4-yr contract. Guaranteed he won't be on a death march ala Jon Fox and the 2010 Panthers, but, what do you want to see Haley achieve in 2011 in order to be rewarded with a contract extension beyond 2012? I think barring a 1-15 season Haley will be back in 2012 as Clark doesn't wan't to pay another coach $4million to sit at home ala Herm in 2009, but what do you think Clark should look for to open up his checkbook for Haley?

So let's put that on the floor for discussion here.

What needs to happen in 2011 for you to be willing to extend Todd Haley?

What would have to happen to cause you to forego the fourth year and fire his ass?

[Dr. Johnny Fever]

Originally Posted by Vanilla Thunder

I wouldn't bet on it happening anytime soon or ever again. But us teams without franchise QBs have to have something to hold on to so we throw out the Brad Johnson and Trent Dilfer cripple argument.

OK man. Obviously it takes more than a game manager to win a SB. A dominant defense is a given. It's happened before and I have no doubt it will likely happen again. I never said Cassel/Chiefs/our defense would do it... but I wouldn't speak in absolutes and say it won't happen again soon or ever again.

[Chiefs Pantalones]

Originally Posted by beer me

OK man. Obviously it takes more than a game manager to win a SB. A dominant defense is a given. It's happened before and I have no doubt it will likely happen again. I never said Cassel/Chiefs/our defense would do it... but I wouldn't speak in absolutes and say it won't happen again soon or ever again.

Dude I don't care how we do it lol i just want us to win another Super Bowl before we all die. I won't complain

[cdcox]

Originally Posted by Vanilla Thunder

Game managers don't win Super Bowls. I share the same opinion as Steve Young and that is the only coaches jobs that are safe in the NFL are the ones that have franchise QBs. I have thought that from the moment that I came to the conclusion that Cassel isn't a franchise QB that he would get Haley fired. A franchise QB and a well rounded team with talent around him makes the coaches job much easier. It's not that I don't like Haley it's just unfortunate for him that Cassel isn't going to cut it.

Bart Starr, Len Dawson, Bob Giese, Troy Aikman and early Tom Brady are examples of elite game managers that I would call franchise QBs. I don't expect Cassel to reach this level, but that would be his high end. The biggest problem is accuracy, coolness in the pocket, and decision making. Trent Green and Rich Gannon are the only two that I can think of that figured it out at age 29 or later.

But I agree that Cassel will probably sooner or later be Haley's downfall, which is a shame because 1) he didn't pick him and 2) I have a feeling that overall Haley is a pretty good coach.

[RippedmyFlesh]

Originally Posted by Vanilla Thunder

Can you name any recently? Exactly. And those teams had monster defenses. Don't kid yourself. They were the exception not the rule.

This is why I came here.
After going to the Coalition first and posting the numbers showing
what an anomaly Baltimore and Tampa Bay were it fell on deaf ears there.
Game managers are once in a blue moon.
Franchise qb's make you a SB contender every year.

[Chiefs Pantalones]

Originally Posted by RippedmyFlesh

This is why I came here.
After going to the Coalition first and posting the numbers showing
what an anomaly Baltimore and Tampa Bay were it fell on deaf ears there.
Game managers are once in a blue moon.
Franchise qb's make you a SB contender every year.

Welcome man!

[RippedmyFlesh]

Originally Posted by cdcox

Bart Starr, Len Dawson, Bob Giese, Troy Aikman and early Tom Brady are examples of elite game managers that I would call franchise QBs. I don't expect Cassel to reach this level, but that would be his high end. The biggest problem is accuracy, coolness in the pocket, and decision making. Trent Green and Rich Gannon are the only two that I can think of that figured it out at age 29 or later.

But I agree that Cassel will probably sooner or later be Haley's downfall, which is a shame because 1) he didn't pick him and 2) I have a feeling that overall Haley is a pretty good coach.

Are all franchise qb's.
I don't penalize a qb because he had a good running team.
Aikman on a more qb friendly offense would have had sick numbers.


To me it's simple.

Franchise qb
Can we win a sb with this guy? F ya and we prob will.

Game manager same question.
If our defense plays well and we get the running game going....blah blah blah.

[RippedmyFlesh]

Originally Posted by Vanilla Thunder

Welcome man!

I grew up on smash mouth football.
I went to some of Larry Csonka's college games as a kid but you have to do what wins today.
And a franchise qb is number one priority.

[Dr. Johnny Fever]

Originally Posted by Vanilla Thunder

Dude I don't care how we do it lol i just want us to win another Super Bowl before we all die. I won't complain

Considering they last won the SB 1 month before I was born......... I'd take another even with Glenn Dorsey at QB.

[Titty Meat]

So what happens if Cassel takes a step back this year? Haley has to be eager to replace him right? He isn't going to place his possible last year with the team on a 5th round pick who hasn't started in the NFL.

[Direckshun]

Originally Posted by Bo's Pelini

So what happens if Cassel takes a step back this year? Haley has to be eager to replace him right? He isn't going to place his possible last year with the team on a 5th round pick who hasn't started in the NFL.

Pioli trades a 2nd to Green Bay for Matt Flynn.

Boom. Another 7th round pick who overachieved in a backup role behind a HOF quarterback on an elite team.

ITS THE CIRCLEEEEEEEEEEEE OF LIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIFE

[NJChiefsFan]

Originally Posted by Bo's Pelini

So what happens if Cassel takes a step back this year? Haley has to be eager to replace him right? He isn't going to place his possible last year with the team on a 5th round pick who hasn't started in the NFL.

Thats the interesting situation IMO. If Cassel doesn't stand up to this schedule, what does Haley and Pioli do? Haley wouldn't want to depend on Stanzi to save his job would he? What other options are there? Other problem is, if the team improves all around except QB, doesn't that make a QB switch to a guy thats got a learning curve even worse for Haley?

Haley really may have his coaching life stuck to a guy that Pioli brought in. That or he is going to have to hope that either Stanzi or whoever replaces Cassel, if need be, steps up. With the rest of this roster hopefully ready for a serious push in 2012, Haley can't afford to have QB issues.

[RippedmyFlesh]

Originally Posted by beer me

Considering they last won the SB 1 month before I was born......... I'd take another even with Glenn Dorsey at QB.

I was 11.
I won $5 from a friend who was a viking fan.
That was serious cash for an 11 yr old back then.
Cigarettes were about 30 40 cents a pack at the time.
Spent it on bowling foosball and pinball and had enough left over to get a grocery bag of junk food.

[NJChiefsFan]

Now if we have a horrible season and Haley puts Matt on the bench, using Palko to mop up the season over Stanzi would put him in some major hot water. I really don't see anything he can do to cost himself 2012 unless he really craps out. Even a bad record probably wouldn't do it, unless he was making tons of mistakes.

[RippedmyFlesh]

I am biased because I like Haley but I don't want Haley being a lame duck coach in 12.
If Haley had insisted on Cassel then his fate may possibly be linked to him.
We all know that wasn't the case.
Even if Cassel doesn't work out he deserves a shot with Stanzi or whomever else we draft.
I always looked at Cassel as a bridge from horrible to respectable and figured the next guy was going to be the one.

[NJChiefsFan]

Originally Posted by RippedmyFlesh

I am biased because I like Haley but I don't want Haley being a lame duck coach in 12.
If Haley had insisted on Cassel then his fate may possibly be linked to him.
We all know that wasn't the case.
Even if Cassel doesn't work out he deserves a shot with Stanzi or whomever else we draft.
I always looked at Cassel as a bridge from horrible to respectable and figured the next guy was going to be the one.

Im a huge Haley guy. There are plenty of things I feel he needs to work on, but I have liked him from the start. Im just afraid that his fate may be tied to Cassel, unfair as it may be.