Royals Frank White... GONE *Denny Matthews Voice* - Page 9

Fumblerooski · 12-02-2011, 12:25 PM

Per Royals.com

http://m.mlb.com/kc/news/article/2011120226080776/

milkman · 12-03-2011, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GloryDayz

I'm not sure that being a great orator is a must anymore. Look at the NFL and all you see are analysts. I'm left with the impression that most people are wanting ex-players doing the talking and not somebody who have a degree in journalism/broadcast telling them about the sport... Otherwise we'd have a love fewer Shannon Sharps and Neon Dion Sanders, and a lot more Joe Bucks.... And in the case of a struggling team, the "fans" want to here somebody talk who can tell them what's wrong, not another, "we'll get them next time" goof-ball saying night after night. But if you own a team that has not plans to fix it, then the latter is a must. You need people who spread false sunshine and you squash reality....

Glass wants BS sunshine... Look at Wal-Mart ads then go into most Wal-Marts.....see a difference? He's brought that to Royals base ball...

Color analysis should be done by former players, because they do have an understanding of the game that average fan, and broadcasters with degrees simply do not have.

People don't like Joe Buck because he has a way of making great plays sound boring.

People love a guy like Gus Johnson, even though he's far less polished than a Joe Buck, because he genuinely gets excited.

**kysirsoze** · 12-03-2011, 10:46 AM

Lot of people denouncing their fandom over this. Kind of weird considering A.) We don't know the whole story of why and B.) Fans have made it through almost 30 years of bad to terrible baseball by now. THIS is what has made you drop the Royals?

evenfall · 12-03-2011, 10:59 AM

Where does this "because he was too critical" claim come from? Has that been substantiated anywhere, or are people just pulling that out of thin air?

**kysirsoze** · 12-03-2011, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by evenfall

Where does this "because he was too critical" claim come from? Has that been substantiated anywhere, or are people just pulling that out of thin air?

Easy way to put it on DM's fragile ego.

evenfall · 12-03-2011, 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kysirsoze

Easy way to put it on DM's fragile ego.

"fragile ego"?

**kysirsoze** · 12-03-2011, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by evenfall

"fragile ego"?

Playing Devil's advocate, here. When a franchise is bad, people will look for any excuse to bash management.

**wazu** · 12-03-2011, 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kysirsoze

Lot of people denouncing their fandom over this. Kind of weird considering A.) We don't know the whole story of why and B.) Fans have made it through almost 30 years of bad to terrible baseball by now. THIS is what has made you drop the Royals?

When a team stinks it up for as long as the Royals have, the only thing the fan base can hold onto is the past. So what do the Royals do? Turn around and crush that, too.

I am sure Frank White has his own part in this, but I don't believe it was something that couldn't be worked out through more open communication on both sides. The thing is, I, as an average fan, freaking LOVE Frank White. I don't have any love for the Royals front office. Every single one of them could be fired tomorrow and I wouldn't care. Wouldn't be excited since I would just expect another iteration of what we have watched for the last 20 years, but I don't feel we would lose much. (I know, I know, we are always just 2-3 years away from not being totally shitty.)

Frank White and Ryan Lefebre were a great match in the booth, making the best out of the shitty product on the field day after day. Royals could have at the very least continued status quo there. And more importantly should have been working to build bridges with Frank.

**kysirsoze** · 12-03-2011, 11:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wazu

When a team stinks it up for as long as the Royals have, the only thing the fan base can hold onto is the past. So what do the Royals do? Turn around and crush that, too.

I am sure Frank White has his own part in this, but I don't believe it was something that couldn't be worked out through more open communication on both sides. The thing is, I, as an average fan, freaking LOVE Frank White. I don't have any love for the Royals front office. Every single one of them could be fired tomorrow and I wouldn't care. Wouldn't be excited since I would just expect another iteration of what we have watched for the last 20 years, but I don't feel we would lose much. (I know, I know, we are always just 2-3 years away from not being totally shitty.)

Frank White and Ryan Lefebre were a great match in the booth, making the best out of the shitty product on the field day after day. Royals could have at the very least continued status quo there. And more importantly should have been working to build bridges with Frank.

I understand wanting to hold on to good memories wanting the organization to do right by Frank. The problem is it doesn't sound like he was negative at all. If he was, the "he got fired for telling it like it is" crowd would have more ammo. As it is, it sounds like he is a beloved Royals legend who probably wasn't that great at commentary. He's already butthurt by the organization for not bringing him in in a coaching capacity and has finally had it. It sucks, because everybody wants their favorite players to stay close to home, but that doesn't mean the the front office blew this. (Other than from a PR perspective)

P.S. I am basing my opinion of his commentary on what I've read in this thread since I don't get the games out here.

**gblowfish** · 12-03-2011, 11:29 AM

I've been giving a lot of thought to the Frank White firing this morning. If you haven't read Sam Mellinger's take on it, I think he's spot on:

http://www.kansascity.com/2011/12/02...als-frank.html

Messy divorces always have valid points on both sides of the equation. Baseball is a business, yes. But major league sports are different businesses, unique in the lifetime love and devotion generated by fans. The only non-sports companies I can think of that have similar followings are Apple, Coca-Cola, Chevrolet, Harley-Davidson, etc.

Frank White and George Brett are the faces of this franchise. Frank is KC's equivalent to Frank Robinson in Baltimore, or Bill Mazaroski in Pittsburgh, or Willie Mays in San Francisco. He grew up a KC kid. He went to high school in the shadow of old Municipal Stadium. He literally helped build Kauffman Stadium. He was the star graduate of the historic Royals "baseball academy." He won eight gold gloves. He was the first second baseman in the history of the World Series to hit clean up. He saved the Royals' bacon in game three of the 1985 series by providing a clutch game winning homer, a homer that kept the Royals series hopes alive. A loss would have put them down three games to zero. KC retired his number and put a statue of him in Kauffman Stadium. He is the defensive standard by which all second basemen are measured. He is unique, and special, and beloved in KC.

The Royals have been living off 1985 nostalgia for the last twenty years. Frank White was a major component of that nostalgia. The Royals PR wanks put his face on a Pepsi Zero can last year. The Royals have used his nostalgia value to their advantage time and time again, and Frank has been a good soldier and company man.

I'm sure he was disappointed by being passed over for Trey Hillman during the manager search after Bell quit. He did that three year stretch in Wichita to prove his commitment to managing and pay his dues. In retrospect, it's probably a good thing he didn't get the job. The lack of talent on the team would have killed any manager, and surely would have tarnished Frank's image in the eyes of Royals fans - The same fate that befell Hal McRae and John Wathan.

On the TV side, yes, Frank is NOT a polished, slick broadcaster. But that's a big part of his appeal. What you get is an unvarnished baseball coach and spot on insight. I've watched literally hundreds of Royals baseball games. Frank White was never overly negative -believe me, NOBODY is more overly negative about Royals Baseball than George Blowfish- and he was always honest. Refreshingly honest in an era of sports public relations where everything is about hiding that man behind the curtain. It's hard to be a rah-rah guy when you're an ex-world champion and your team is losing 90 to 100 or more games year after year after year. The Royals as a team may have been in the gutter, but Frank was always a class act.

The actual contract for baseball broadcasters works like this: Fox Sport Midwest chooses the talent and negotiates the contract. The candidate is chosen with the vetted approval of the Kansas City Royals. Apparently, both Fox and the Royals were in agreement that they want to overhaul the TV broadcast. My understanding is they're moving Ryan to radio with Denny, and that's OK. Frank did Fox a great service by filling in when Splitt got sick. I guess they had enough exposure to Frank's broadcast style that the suits wanted somebody who's more blindly optimistic, like Bob Davis. I personally HATE Bob Davis and think he's a brown nosing assbag, but that's a different discussion for a different day.

The elephant in the room for me is, the Royals would NEVER treat George Brett this way. Brett's star shines brighter because he's a hall of famer. White is approachable, has a sunny disposition and he has always displayed a genuine love for Royals fans. Brett's reputation is more checkered. He has a reputation of being grumpy and rude to fans. That's OK, that's just who he is. But Brett has had this mafia-like untouchability in the Royals family. I don't think it's a "George is white and Frank is black" thing. I think it's a "George is in the Hall of Fame and Frank is not" thing. The HOF is a big, huge deal to baseball people. It makes you a "made man.".

It's sad that if the Royals wanted to move Frank off of TV, that they couldn't have found a tangible, mutually beneficial spot for him in the organization. Frank is 61, so he's getting close to retirement age. He may have been happy with a job for a year or two as a roving instructor, or in talent evaluation, or some other baseball nuts and bolts position inside the organization. But divorces are messy. This one may never be resolved and that is a damn sad and lousy shame.

**Rausch** · 12-03-2011, 11:32 AM

$3it.

I was all prepared for a Frank Black thread...

**gblowfish** · 12-03-2011, 11:42 AM

Here's a good take:
http://justincaseyouwerewondering.co...-pr-nightmare/

Cool pics of Frank over the years from the KC Star:
http://www.kansascity.com/2011/12/02...the-years.html

rageeumr · 12-03-2011, 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by evenfall

Where does this "because he was too critical" claim come from? Has that been substantiated anywhere, or are people just pulling that out of thin air?

Frank said it himself during his interview with Nick Wright last night. Mellinger has similar quotes from Frank in his article.

CaliforniaChief · 12-03-2011, 11:47 AM

I hate this. I thought, from the few broadcasts I did watch, that Frank White was a very good commentator. Not to mention what George posted about his legendary status in Kansas City with this franchise. It tarnishes what has been, so far, a great off-season IMHO.

**kysirsoze** · 12-03-2011, 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rageeumr

Frank said it himself during his interview with Nick Wright last night. Mellinger has similar quotes from Frank in his article.

I would like to hear it from someone other than the guy who got fired.

**DeezNutz** · 12-03-2011, 11:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gblowfish

Here's a good take:
http://justincaseyouwerewondering.co...-pr-nightmare/

Cool pics of Frank over the years from the KC Star:
http://www.kansascity.com/2011/12/02...the-years.html

Great line from the first link:

"The biggest mistake a company can make is to decide on a direction without its customers in mind."

Exactly what happened here. Firing White is the Betancourt decision of PR moves at the absolute worst time (team about to be genuinely competitive and the All-Star game looming in 2012).

12-02-2011, 12:25 PM
Fumblerooski Bolly 'wood' Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Gardner,KS Casino cash: $10004900	Frank White... GONE Denny Matthews Voice Per Royals.com http://m.mlb.com/kc/news/article/2011120226080776/
Posts: 630

12-03-2011, 10:46 AM	#122
kysirsoze SNAP THE ****ING BALL!!! Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: KCMO Casino cash: $246946	Lot of people denouncing their fandom over this. Kind of weird considering A.) We don't know the whole story of why and B.) Fans have made it through almost 30 years of bad to terrible baseball by now. THIS is what has made you drop the Royals?
Posts: 11,955

12-03-2011, 10:59 AM	#123
evenfall Starter Join Date: Jul 2011 Casino cash: $10004900	Where does this "because he was too critical" claim come from? Has that been substantiated anywhere, or are people just pulling that out of thin air?
Posts: 945

12-03-2011, 11:29 AM	#129
gblowfish Be Kind To Your Pets Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Glorious Independence, MO Casino cash: $16896178 VARSITY	I've been giving a lot of thought to the Frank White firing this morning. If you haven't read Sam Mellinger's take on it, I think he's spot on: http://www.kansascity.com/2011/12/02...als-frank.html Messy divorces always have valid points on both sides of the equation. Baseball is a business, yes. But major league sports are different businesses, unique in the lifetime love and devotion generated by fans. The only non-sports companies I can think of that have similar followings are Apple, Coca-Cola, Chevrolet, Harley-Davidson, etc. Frank White and George Brett are the faces of this franchise. Frank is KC's equivalent to Frank Robinson in Baltimore, or Bill Mazaroski in Pittsburgh, or Willie Mays in San Francisco. He grew up a KC kid. He went to high school in the shadow of old Municipal Stadium. He literally helped build Kauffman Stadium. He was the star graduate of the historic Royals "baseball academy." He won eight gold gloves. He was the first second baseman in the history of the World Series to hit clean up. He saved the Royals' bacon in game three of the 1985 series by providing a clutch game winning homer, a homer that kept the Royals series hopes alive. A loss would have put them down three games to zero. KC retired his number and put a statue of him in Kauffman Stadium. He is the defensive standard by which all second basemen are measured. He is unique, and special, and beloved in KC. The Royals have been living off 1985 nostalgia for the last twenty years. Frank White was a major component of that nostalgia. The Royals PR wanks put his face on a Pepsi Zero can last year. The Royals have used his nostalgia value to their advantage time and time again, and Frank has been a good soldier and company man. I'm sure he was disappointed by being passed over for Trey Hillman during the manager search after Bell quit. He did that three year stretch in Wichita to prove his commitment to managing and pay his dues. In retrospect, it's probably a good thing he didn't get the job. The lack of talent on the team would have killed any manager, and surely would have tarnished Frank's image in the eyes of Royals fans - The same fate that befell Hal McRae and John Wathan. On the TV side, yes, Frank is NOT a polished, slick broadcaster. But that's a big part of his appeal. What you get is an unvarnished baseball coach and spot on insight. I've watched literally hundreds of Royals baseball games. Frank White was never overly negative -believe me, NOBODY is more overly negative about Royals Baseball than George Blowfish- and he was always honest. Refreshingly honest in an era of sports public relations where everything is about hiding that man behind the curtain. It's hard to be a rah-rah guy when you're an ex-world champion and your team is losing 90 to 100 or more games year after year after year. The Royals as a team may have been in the gutter, but Frank was always a class act. The actual contract for baseball broadcasters works like this: Fox Sport Midwest chooses the talent and negotiates the contract. The candidate is chosen with the vetted approval of the Kansas City Royals. Apparently, both Fox and the Royals were in agreement that they want to overhaul the TV broadcast. My understanding is they're moving Ryan to radio with Denny, and that's OK. Frank did Fox a great service by filling in when Splitt got sick. I guess they had enough exposure to Frank's broadcast style that the suits wanted somebody who's more blindly optimistic, like Bob Davis. I personally HATE Bob Davis and think he's a brown nosing assbag, but that's a different discussion for a different day. The elephant in the room for me is, the Royals would NEVER treat George Brett this way. Brett's star shines brighter because he's a hall of famer. White is approachable, has a sunny disposition and he has always displayed a genuine love for Royals fans. Brett's reputation is more checkered. He has a reputation of being grumpy and rude to fans. That's OK, that's just who he is. But Brett has had this mafia-like untouchability in the Royals family. I don't think it's a "George is white and Frank is black" thing. I think it's a "George is in the Hall of Fame and Frank is not" thing. The HOF is a big, huge deal to baseball people. It makes you a "made man.". It's sad that if the Royals wanted to move Frank off of TV, that they couldn't have found a tangible, mutually beneficial spot for him in the organization. Frank is 61, so he's getting close to retirement age. He may have been happy with a job for a year or two as a roving instructor, or in talent evaluation, or some other baseball nuts and bolts position inside the organization. But divorces are messy. This one may never be resolved and that is a damn sad and lousy shame.
Posts: 41,011

12-03-2011, 11:42 AM	#131
gblowfish Be Kind To Your Pets Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Glorious Independence, MO Casino cash: $16896178 VARSITY	Here's a good take: http://justincaseyouwerewondering.co...-pr-nightmare/ Cool pics of Frank over the years from the KC Star: http://www.kansascity.com/2011/12/02...the-years.html
Posts: 41,011

12-03-2011, 11:47 AM	#133
CaliforniaChief #RIPAce Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: So Cal Casino cash: $10675899	I hate this. I thought, from the few broadcasts I did watch, that Frank White was a very good commentator. Not to mention what George posted about his legendary status in Kansas City with this franchise. It tarnishes what has been, so far, a great off-season IMHO.
Posts: 17,444