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Old 02-04-2012, 04:44 PM  
kcxiv kcxiv is offline
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Hall of Fame show (Roaf in, Shields out)
Anyone watching it? Got some Chiefs in the finals.
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Old 02-04-2012, 05:51 PM   #31
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Did you hear Jack Butler? He played in the 50s, and he said that when he played, a player who went down could get back up and run as long as the play hadn't been blown dead. I've never heard that before.

I guess 99 percent of the time the whistle would be blown pretty much immediately, but it's still odd. Were there times when the ref didn't pay attention back in the 50s? Why would the whistle not be blown immediately?
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Old 02-04-2012, 05:57 PM   #32
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Did you hear Jack Butler? He played in the 50s, and he said that when he played, a player who went down could get back up and run as long as the play hadn't been blown dead. I've never heard that before.

I guess 99 percent of the time the whistle would be blown pretty much immediately, but it's still odd. Were there times when the ref didn't pay attention back in the 50s? Why would the whistle not be blown immediately?
I've seen footage of those old games. You kind of had to hold the guy down after you tackled him. If a defender collided with the ball carrier forcing him to stumble to the ground, he wasn't really down. He could get back up or crawl along the ground for extra yardage.
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Old 02-04-2012, 06:03 PM   #33
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Congrats Wille Roaf.

You should have gone in last year, but the NFL is too stupid to properly respect your position and level of play, it's their fault not yours.

You were the greatest Left Tackle I've ever seen in my entire life.
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Old 02-04-2012, 06:14 PM   #34
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I've seen footage of those old games. You kind of had to hold the guy down after you tackled him. If a defender collided with the ball carrier forcing him to stumble to the ground, he wasn't really down. He could get back up or crawl along the ground for extra yardage.
Was the rule that you had to stop the guy from being able to make progress?

I remember reading in the very early days of football that a touchdown wasn't scored until the ball carrier literally touched the ball to the turf, which is why you see in some of the really old films a guy would cross the goal line and then bend at the waist and make the ball kiss the ground. Generally there was a gentleman's agreement to let the guy touch the ball down if he crossed the goal line, but occasionally if a guy bulled his way in there would be a wrestling match as the defender tried to keep the ball carrier from touching the ball. The rule was something like any defender who touched the guy once he was across the goal line could try to keep him from "touching it down". I don't remember if it was in college or the pros, but apparently there was one stalemate where one or two defenders literally kept a runner from touching the ball down for some enormous amount of time, and there was no rule that let the refs stop the play.
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Old 02-04-2012, 06:36 PM   #35
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Was the rule that you had to stop the guy from being able to make progress?

I remember reading in the very early days of football that a touchdown wasn't scored until the ball carrier literally touched the ball to the turf, which is why you see in some of the really old films a guy would cross the goal line and then bend at the waist and make the ball kiss the ground. Generally there was a gentleman's agreement to let the guy touch the ball down if he crossed the goal line, but occasionally if a guy bulled his way in there would be a wrestling match as the defender tried to keep the ball carrier from touching the ball. The rule was something like any defender who touched the guy once he was across the goal line could try to keep him from "touching it down". I don't remember if it was in college or the pros, but apparently there was one stalemate where one or two defenders literally kept a runner from touching the ball down for some enormous amount of time, and there was no rule that let the refs stop the play.
Football is a derivative of Rugby. Soccer and Rugby were once known as Association Football and Rugby Football, respectively. American football began as merely another form of football which resembled rugby football.

Touching the ball down past the "try line" is still a rule in rugby today.
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Old 02-04-2012, 06:50 PM   #36
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Lake Dawson made the HOF????
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Old 02-04-2012, 07:21 PM   #37
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Willie Roaf makes the HOF
Here is the link:

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/75...all-fame-class


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Old 02-04-2012, 07:51 PM   #38
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Probably the best O-Lineman ever to play the game with Shields coming in at top 5. Definitely part of the best O-line ever to take the field, IMO.
Can you all imagine what a true HOF running back like Sanders, Emmitt Smith, L.T. or even Marcus Allen could have done behind them? 2300 yards and 30+ TD's is not unthinkable. Preist was a good running back in his own right, just not like the others mentioned.
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Old 02-04-2012, 08:06 PM   #39
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Nah. Dude wasn't a flashy or sexy back but he's #4 on the all-time rushing list behind Smith, Payton, and Sanders. If he had 4 more years in him, he could have owned #1 over Smith; who set that mark in 14 years.

He also averages 103 yards from scrimmage per game. Averages.... over a 10 year career. Name two other HOF backs who did that. Faulk? Nope. Dickerson? Nope. Thurman Thomas? Nope.
Jim Brown comes to mind immediately.

Did Barry Sanders average more than 100 yards a game?
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Old 02-04-2012, 08:11 PM   #40
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Just looked it up, and Barry Sanders avereged 99.8 ypg, but Curtis Martin only averaged 83.9.
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Old 02-04-2012, 08:15 PM   #41
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Am happy for Roaf & he is deserving. Altho I would have been more thrilled if it was Shields getting in. Shields can get in next year.
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Old 02-04-2012, 08:17 PM   #42
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The thought of Roaf makes me sad. I mean, I'm happy for him and all ... it just reminds me of how good our offense used to be.

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Old 02-04-2012, 08:23 PM   #43
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Just looked it up, and Barry Sanders avereged 99.8 ypg, but Curtis Martin only averaged 83.9.
From scrimmage not just rushing.
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Old 02-04-2012, 08:24 PM   #44
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Curtis Martin's induction is a tribute to his logevity and durability, and the direct result of the fact that he played a skill position.

There's no way in hell he was better at his job than Will Shields was at his.

And the fact is, Chris Carter is far more deserving than Martin.

But then, the HoF voting process has always been a joke.
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Old 02-04-2012, 08:26 PM   #45
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Curtis Martin's induction is a tribute to his logevity and durability, and the direct result of the fact that he played a skill position.

There's no way in hell he was better at his job than Will Shields was at his.

And the fact is, Chris Carter is far more deserving than Martin.

But then, the HoF voting process has always been a joke.
Agree with all of this.

I also find it annoying that the top X% of QBs get in, but with CBs or safeties you have to be the top (X/5)% or whatever. It should be the same percentage of players at every position.
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