Should Penn State Get the Death Penalty?

[Trivers]

http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/481264...lege_football/


Looks like officials are going from Penn State to state pen. (Sorry, I couldn't help myself.)

What say ye? If so, for how long?

[Bearcat]

Originally Posted by Laz

If you murder someone, your company is going to turn you over to the police AND FIRE YOU.

Penn state didn't even fire Sandusky, they let him retire as a “valued member of the Penn State football legacy.” They then let Sandusky continue to work through Penn State with his foundation and continue to rape kids.

now the NCAA needs to do what it does and that is issues sanctions against the University itself for allowing such a situation to occur for such a long time.

EVERY KEY person of power at Penn State University contributed to a conspiracy to commit Child molestation.

The NCAA needs to set a real world standard for such a criminal lack of institutional control.

And after they fire you, do they shutdown the department you were in?

It's actually a bad analogy, because the coaches and admin are employed by PSU, not the NCAA. PSU, just like any employer, may very well have some umbrella statement against anything that is unlawful as determined by the state of PA and federal law. That's PSU's problem, not the NCAA.

A better analogy might be if you worked for General Mills and murdered someone, the FDA isn't going to do anything about it.


The first sentence in the doc regarding "lack of institutional control" states "In determining whether there has been a lack of institutional control when a violation of NCAA
rules has been found..." ...so, it seems like no matter how vague that term is, it still has to fall under NCAA regulations.

[Saulbadguy]

Originally Posted by Bearcat

And after they fire you, do they shutdown the department you were in?

It's actually a bad analogy, because the coaches and admin are employed by PSU, not the NCAA. PSU, just like any employer, may very well have some umbrella statement against anything that is unlawful as determined by the state of PA and federal law. That's PSU's problem, not the NCAA.

A better analogy might be if you worked for General Mills and murdered someone, the FDA isn't going to do anything about it.


The first sentence in the doc regarding "lack of institutional control" states "In determining whether there has been a lack of institutional control when a violation of NCAA
rules has been found..." ...so, it seems like no matter how vague that term is, it still has to fall under NCAA regulations.

another hater

[Chiefnj2]

Originally Posted by Bearcat

The first sentence in the doc regarding "lack of institutional control" states "In determining whether there has been a lack of institutional control when a violation of NCAA
rules has been found..." ...so, it seems like no matter how vague that term is, it still has to fall under NCAA regulations.

NCAA bylaw:
19.01.2 Exemplary Conduct. Individuals employed by or associated with member
institutions for the administration, the conduct or the coaching of intercollegiate athletics
are, in the final analysis, teachers of young people. Their responsibility is an affirmative
one, and they must do more than avoid improper conduct or questionable acts. Their own
moral values must be so certain and positive that those younger and more pliable will be
influenced by a fine example. Much more is expected of them than of the less critically
placed citizen.

[whoman69]

Originally Posted by Bearcat

And after they fire you, do they shutdown the department you were in?

It's actually a bad analogy, because the coaches and admin are employed by PSU, not the NCAA. PSU, just like any employer, may very well have some umbrella statement against anything that is unlawful as determined by the state of PA and federal law. That's PSU's problem, not the NCAA.

A better analogy might be if you worked for General Mills and murdered someone, the FDA isn't going to do anything about it.


The first sentence in the doc regarding "lack of institutional control" states "In determining whether there has been a lack of institutional control when a violation of NCAA
rules has been found..." ...so, it seems like no matter how vague that term is, it still has to fall under NCAA regulations.

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2

NCAA bylaw:
19.01.2 Exemplary Conduct. Individuals employed by or associated with member
institutions for the administration, the conduct or the coaching of intercollegiate athletics
are, in the final analysis, teachers of young people. Their responsibility is an affirmative
one, and they must do more than avoid improper conduct or questionable acts. Their own
moral values must be so certain and positive that those younger and more pliable will be
influenced by a fine example. Much more is expected of them than of the less critically
placed citizen.

One of the things they look at in NCAA penalties, especially for lack of institutional control is arrest records. Certainly covering up a crime so the university would not look bad has to fall under that category.

I've heard arguments that PSU should not be penalized because all the people involved are gone. Doesn't hold water because Reggie Bush wasn't at USC. The entire program is guilty when things like this are coming to the top.

Heinous as this is, its the first infraction for the school so they will not get the death penalty. The school will also be penalized in other ways not connected to the NCAA. There should be penalities, but the death penalty is a knee jerk reaction.

[RaiderH8r]

Originally Posted by Laz

I doubt the NCAA has guts to significantly punish a University the size of Penn State over this. It this was about 'Midlevel State University' or something they would be talking all tough and looking to set an example.

With PSU they will hide behind "it's a legal matter for the law" and go back to counting their money like the gigantic pussies they are.

Maybe the will surprise me, but i doubt it.

Sad but true.

Like I said, no public funds until the university has settled all claims and penalties related to this. DJ thinks it is f'd but he's wrong. The taxpayers have no responsibility to subsidize the rape of children. If the university withers and dies so be it. If the alumni hold a pot luck and pay it all off then happy day for Happy Valley. Hope those Nittany dipshits bake some mean brownies. Just leave the kids at home.

[RaiderH8r]

Originally Posted by Bearcat

Seriously though, it's not against NCAA rules per se, because it's against the law. If you murder someone, your company isn't going to run to HR and look up the 'murder' section of the HR handbook... they're going to turn you over to the police.

My knee-jerk reaction was to vote yes in the poll, but had a 'duh' moment when I realized oh yeah, it has nothing to do with PSU athletes... PSU will be held responsible for the Clery Act.

If you can find an NCAA rule that was broken, post it. It's all on ncaa.org.

Unless you're Penn State and the crime is ass raping children for 14 years on school property. But yeah, immediately turning criminals in for criminal behavior
Would be the low bar for human decency for the rest of humanity.

[RaiderH8r]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

And you are ignoring the idea that football drives a significant chunk of funding for Penn State to make it a strong academic institution. It's not just about punishing the football program. It's about cutting the entire university below its knees. You are making the mistake of suggesting this is just about football. This death penalty affects the entire university, the entire state, and the thousands of students who rely on Penn State to give a quality education at in-state rates.

I've talked numerous times about the millions of people affected by this that didn't cover this up or do anything wrong. Punish badly the ones who ****ed this up. Punish the football program. The death penalty unfortunately reaches way beyond that.

Who gives a rip? Life goes on. Find new jobs. Get new lives. This is JoePa's legacy. The guy who killed Penn State. See how many hoagie shops name subs after that dude.

[Mr. Laz]

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2

NCAA bylaw:
19.01.2 Exemplary Conduct. Individuals employed by or associated with member
institutions for the administration, the conduct or the coaching of intercollegiate athletics are, in the final analysis, teachers of young people. Their responsibility is an affirmative one, and they must do more than avoid improper conduct or questionable acts. Their own moral values must be so certain and positive that those younger and more pliable will be influenced by a fine example. Much more is expected of them than of the less critically placed citizen.

well there you go

basic standard morel conduct is a "rule" of most companies and the people in power at Penn State University completely violated pretty much every reasonable definition of that.

The NCAA can penalize Penn State but will they have the guts to?

[stonedstooge]

Anyone know what the reference in the report was about Senior football leaders on the team? Something about them knowing what was happening, but doing nothing about it? ESPN scrolled it last night

[mlyonsd]

Originally Posted by Laz

well there you go

basic standard morel conduct is a "rule" of most companies and the people in power at Penn State University completely violated pretty much every reasonable definition of that.

The NCAA can penalize Penn State but will they have the guts to?

Nope. If it were in a lesser conference maybe. Too much money involved now.

[Mr. Laz]

3 tweets put together

Stephen A Smith ‏@stephenasmith

Just to reiterate, no of us should let go of this Penn State Story. Not until the Death Penalty is issue to their football program and .... Joe Paterno's statue is removed. Let the players transfer immediately. Attach an extra year of eligibility to their careers. Just make sure ... there's no football at Penn State for the foreseeable future. Minimum next five years.

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[FloridaMan88]

Penn State's football program absolutely deserves the death penalty.

Jerry Sandusky would have no connection to Penn State and wouldn't have been in a position to commit his crimes WITHOUT his association with and protection by the football progam.

[Rausch]

They knew.

For a loooooooooooooooooong time...

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by Laz

3 tweets put together

Stephen A Smith ‏@stephenasmith

Just to reiterate, no of us should let go of this Penn State Story. Not until the Death Penalty is issue to their football program and .... Joe Paterno's statue is removed. Let the players transfer immediately. Attach an extra year of eligibility to their careers. Just make sure ... there's no football at Penn State for the foreseeable future. Minimum next five years.

Expand Reply Retweet Favorite

The death penalty will never happen again.

I don't know how many times I have to repeat that the death penalty is not just a hit to the football program, it is a devastating blow to a public education institution. One that Pennsylvania taxpayers pay for. One that employs thousands of faculty members. And one that provides quality education to students, many of which can't afford a private university because it's too expensive.

I've talked about the millions of people affected by a death penalty. And you keep singing the same tune that these people who did nothing illegal, for some reason, deserve it because some assholes abused power. The point is to punish the football program, not to destroy an otherwise terrific educational institution that provides a major public benefit.

I don't understand what point you're trying to prove. The guys responsible are going to get destroyed for this. Good. The guys you're trying to destroy with a death penalty are taxpayers, and innocent faculty members, students, and Pennsylvania residents who rely on the school. Again, please tell me who the "they" is when you say that "they" will learn a lesson from the death penalty?

[Mr. Laz]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

The death penalty will never happen again.

I don't know how many times I have to repeat that the death penalty is not just a hit to the football program, it is a devastating blow to a public education institution. One that Pennsylvania taxpayers pay for. One that employs thousands of faculty members. And one that provides quality education to students, many of which can't afford a private university because it's too expensive.

I've talked about the millions of people affected by a death penalty. And you keep singing the same tune that these people who did nothing illegal, for some reason, deserve it because some assholes abused power. The point is to punish the football program, not to destroy an otherwise terrific educational institution that provides a major public benefit.

I don't understand what point you're trying to prove. The guys responsible are going to get destroyed for this. Good. The guys you're trying to destroy with a death penalty are taxpayers, and innocent faculty members, students, and Pennsylvania residents who rely on the school. Again, please tell me who the "they" is when you say that "they" will learn a lesson from the death penalty?

you evidently don't understand right,wrong and doing something as a matter of PRINCIPAL.

you're rationalizing and mouthing excuses ... looking for a reason to not do the right thing.

I can find an indirect reason to NEVER PUNISH ANYONE FOR ANYTHING


How can we ever send anyone to jail that has children? The children didn't do anything wrong.