Chiefs ***OFFICIAL 2012 KC Chiefs Training Camp Thread*** - Page 258

Kylo Ren · 08:51 AM

Discuss everything Chiefs / training camp related here......

Enjoy!

Mark Cassell sucks!

-King- · 08-14-2012, 01:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackBob

We should draft someone every year. Stanzi needs to shit or get off the pot. "Project Players" need to show something to remain "Project Players." It doesn't matter what position they play.

Deeznuts,

Pocket presence is not his biggest problem. He's got good enough presence to win and he's shown that. With a decent o-line and the ability to change plays, he will be better. He changed 7 out of 16 plays on Friday night. Haley didn't let him do this. Haley was holding him back. He's got a good o-line and a ton of weapons. This will be his last shot. I believe he will say "**** it" and just let it rip this year. My only fear is his ability in close games. He's not the least bit clutch and you can't coach that. Every once in a while it comes out in a veteran like it did for Alex Smith last year but, that is very rare.

I bet Cassel has a career year and a new contract by this time next year.

Black Bob · 08-14-2012, 01:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aturnis

How so? Cassel has none. Period.

Listen to yourself man. You saw Palko last year right?

**BossChief** · 08-14-2012, 01:05 PM

I'll say it again because people seemingly ignored it when I posted it yesterday.

Go back and watch all 7 throws Stanzi makes against the Cardinals and place Bowe, Baldwin and Breaston on the receiving end of them.

Now, give me a legitimate stat line of his under that hypothetical.

I firmly believe that he is 5/7 with a touchdown and just under 100 yards and that he lead two touchdown drives.

If these coaches ever give the kid a chance on a level surface to Quinn and Cassel, he will outperform them.

But, yeah...I have genuine hope Cassel turns things around and lights it up this year. Apparently, I don't have a choice.

-King- · 08-14-2012, 01:06 PM

Blackbob was right.

Quote:

Matt Cassel's Freedom At The Line Of Scrimmage

by Joel Thorman on Aug 14, 2012 11:21 AM CDT

Denny Medley-US PRESSWIRE - PresswireMore photos »

The voice of the Kansas City Chiefs Mitch Holthus talked on the Border Patrol yesterday morning and had some interesting points on Matt Cassel's play. Cassel was in the game for two drives -- a total of 16 plays -- and the Chiefs scored touchdowns on both drives.

As Holthus explains, it was how they got it done that's interesting.

"We counted, between Kendall [Gammon], Lenny [Dawson] and I, in those 16 snaps between those two drives, we're thinking Matt changed the play probably seven of the 16 gimes," Holthus said.

Interesting. I hadn't picked up on that, although I should have. Cassel's freedom at the line of scrimmage is something that's been talked about before, the "check with me" offense.

This works because, as Steven St. John noted, Cassel has time before and after the play. On the front end, the Chiefs got the play call in efficiently all night long so they looked like they were on top of their game, moving in and out of the huddle. That gives Cassel enough time to analyze the defense and determine what the best play call is. On the back side, the Chiefs offensive line was good enough on Friday night to give Cassel plenty of time to make a throw.

This is something I'll keep an eye out for next week.

durtyrute · 08-14-2012, 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackBob

We should draft someone every year. Stanzi needs to shit or get off the pot. "Project Players" need to show something to remain "Project Players." It doesn't matter what position they play.

Deeznuts,

Pocket presence is not his biggest problem. He's got good enough presence to win and he's shown that. With a decent o-line and the ability to change plays, he will be better. He changed 7 out of 16 plays on Friday night. Haley didn't let him do this. Haley was holding him back. He's got a good o-line and a ton of weapons. This will be his last shot. I believe he will say "**** it" and just let it rip this year. My only fear is his ability in close games. He's not the least bit clutch and you can't coach that. Every once in a while it comes out in a veteran like it did for Alex Smith last year but, that is very rare.

I bet Cassel has a career year and a new contract by this time next year.

7 passes is hardly enough to judge a QB by.

**DeezNutz** · 08-14-2012, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BossChief

I'll say it again because people seemingly ignored it when I posted it yesterday.

Go back and watch all 7 throws Stanzi makes against the Cardinals and place Bowe, Baldwin and Breaston on the receiving end of them.

Now, give me a legitimate stat line of his under that hypothetical.

I firmly believe that he is 5/7 with a touchdown and just under 100 yards and that he lead two touchdown drives.

If these coaches ever give the kid a chance on a level surface to Quinn and Cassel, he will outperform them.

But, yeah...I have genuine hope Cassel turns things around and lights it up this year. Apparently, I don't have a choice.

He's absolutely getting the same chances in camp as Quinn, based on most reports from St. Joe. Neither, of course, can replicate the place that Cassel has in Pioli's heart.

ShowtimeSBMVP · 08-14-2012, 01:09 PM

Bob Fescoe ‏@bobfescoe

Crennel said Hemingway is moving #chiefs Gray has a hamstring injury

Black Bob · 08-14-2012, 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BossChief

I'll say it again because people seemingly ignored it when I posted it yesterday.

Go back and watch all 7 throws Stanzi makes against the Cardinals and place Bowe, Baldwin and Breaston on the receiving end of them.

Now, give me a legitimate stat line of his under that hypothetical.

I firmly believe that he is 5/7 with a touchdown and just under 100 yards and that he lead two touchdown drives.

If these coaches ever give the kid a chance on a level surface to Quinn and Cassel, he will outperform them.

But, yeah...I have genuine hope Cassel turns things around and lights it up this year. Apparently, I don't have a choice.

Not with Peterson, Gay, Wilson, and Rhodes out there. There is no way and you are crazy. He might be 4/7 with an Int on a good day. Essentially, you are saying you know more than Zorn, who was a good NFL quarterback and has been evaluating and coaching Stanzi since he was drafted.

aturnis · 08-14-2012, 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChiefsDJ56

It's hard to really judge. Stanzi was making his reads against 3rd teamers and guys who will probably not even be in the league in a couple weeks. he throws a nice ball, but 2-7 doesn't impress anyone. Now on the flip side he is throwing to guys who probably won't be in the league also, but most guys on an NFL team can catch a pass that is well thrown.

Have you paid any attention to this team in the last 5 yrs. Outside of Terence Copper, what 2nd or 3rd team receiver could catch a ball for this team for years?

Would you feel better if the receiver got his feet down on the perfectly thrown fade and Stanzi went 3-7 with a TD?

How about if the sideline route that should have been caught? 4-7 for 80-100 yds and a TD in the air while leading the team to another setting up a rushing TD with his feet for 7 yds and a first down?

-King- · 08-14-2012, 01:10 PM

From yesterday. (This training camp thread is an abortion

)

Chiefs Practice Report: Monday, August 13th

From the FanPosts. Lots of detail, great stuff. -Joel

Conditions were perfect for a trip to training camp in St. Joe today. When practice began, it was in the mid to lower 70's and the clouds were providing some nice shade.

After some walk-through style drills for position groups and the punting team, the whole team lined up for warm ups. Romeo Crennel called the team together at that point and addressed everyone. Whatever he was saying lasted about two minutes, and then the team spread out on the sideline of the field closest to the bleachers and got ready to do sprints across the width of the field. They showed some team comraderie after Romeo's speech. A handful of the players yelled like warriors as they headed to their place on the line. Matt Cassel and wide receiver Jamar Newsome were among those running fastest during this opening warm-up exercise.

Cameron Sheffield, Brandon Flowers, and Travis Daniels were not in pads or a helmet, but did participate in all the warm-ups including the running. After that, they headed over to the rehab area. They were on bikes for at least part of practice. Flowers did a little one on one hand work with a coach on the sideline later in practice.

Star-divide

After warm-ups and stretching, most of the the offense worked on a drill that seemed to be about conditioning and fundamentals. Without a defense to line up against (they were on the other field), the offense would line up with more than usual o-linemen with their hand on the ground. The QB would snap the ball and the whole offense including the QB would run forward about 20 yards... Then they would turn around and do the same thing in the other direction before taking a break for another group to rotate in.

Nick Sirianni set up some cones and explained to the wide receivers how he wanted them to run through them. Each player would start off by hitting a cushion that Sirianni was holding and then would turn through the cone exercise and catch a pass from Jim Bob Cooter during their last turn in the cones. Brian Daboll watched this drill and would occasionally pull a player aside before the went through the rotation again.

While this was going on, Jim Zorn was leading the QBs in the exercise ball drill. This has been described a number of times on AP, but one QB stands in the middle and tries to avoid three exercise balls that are being thrown from three different angels by Zorn and the other three QBs. Alex Tanney was the last QB to do the drill. After the drill was clearly over and he had started to relax, Cassel jokingly threw an exercise ball at his back. That got a big laugh out of everyone in the stands.

The receivers started another drill in which they would run off the line of scrimmage and go around Nick Sirianni and then try to catch a pass. Daboll told Sirianni to give the players some contact off the line. Sirianni asked Daboll how far he wanted him to run with them and Daboll jokingly replied "I want you to beat them up the whole way, Nick." Sirianni gave a lot of contact to the first receiver to go through the drill but after that stood around 10 yards back off the line and usually moved out of their way. Brian Daboll's nickname for Dexter McCluster seems to be "twos."

A few minutes later, Sirianni led the receivers (yeah, the receivers were doing a lot of work in the area of the field I was near) in which they started off working on catching under thrown passes. Jim Bob Cooter would throw a pass and Sirianni instructed the receivers to slow down, plant their front legs, and jump back for the ball. He compared the action needed to catch an underthrown pass to getting the rebound in basketball. He used the phrase "attacking the ball" in this part of the exercise. They moved onto catching "normal" passes. Sirianni kept telling the players "Don't anticipate it!" I think he was telling them not to anticipate the ball coming their way so much with their bodies too early so as to give too much away to a nearby defender too soon. The receiver then moved on to catching the types of floater passes that go to the back corner of the endzone a lot. Jonathan Baldwin's long arms helped him catch a pass from Jim Bob Cooter in this drill that looked tough to catch. During all of this, the QBs were throwing to the tight ends who were running routes.

In 7 on 7 (I think I actually counted 8 on offense but I could be wrong), the crowd reacted when Jamaal Charles found a hole on the left side to move through with a burst. On the next play, Peyton Hillis had a nice looking run to the right... Of course, there was no tackling.

When Brady Quinn was in on 7 on 7, he called out "Obama" twice at the line of scrimmage. This brought chuckles from the crowd and people said "Did he say Obama?" I have no idea what it meant.

Later, in a special teams practice portion of the practice, Tamba Hali was in on the punt blocking team. Sometimes he would line up on the edge and sometimes in the middle. On one play off the edge, he made a nice play that probably would have pressured the punter.

Later, there was a drill in which one defensive lineman or OLB would line up against a few offensive linemen. It looked as if the o-line guys did not always know which of them the d linemen would try to take on, but once he did - the other o line guys backed off and it became a one on one thing. Sometimes it was obvious who the d line guy would go against - especially when it was an OLB. When Hali lined up, Donald Stephenson had to hold him to contain him and not let him get to the imaginary QB in the backfield. But Hali is used to that. It was fun to watch Brandon Albert and Justin Houston in this drill. They were a good match. Neither was letting up.

In 11 on 11, Kevin Boss caught a nice pass from Cassel in the middle of the field in traffic near Kendrick Lewis and Jalil Brown. Stanzi played with the second team.

Pioli visited with the strength and conditioning coach on the sideline for a good little while. He may have been getting tips about his own ongoing muscle makeover - but it didn't appear that way. Pioli also spent a few minutes visiting with Allen Bailey during a water break.

During another special teams session, the team focused on blocking punts. You can tell the new special teams coach wants to emphasize blocking punts - which the Chiefs nearly did on Friday night against Arizona During a drill, the special teams coach would have his own "punt" blocked intentionally and then yell "Scoop and score! Scoop and score!" Players from each side would try to come up with the free ball.

The practice ended with some conditioning. The team sprinted the width of the field again. They were broken up into three groups and each group ran the width of the field and back five times. The first group was offensive and defensive linemen. Brandon Bair was the fastest in this group by far. Each time it was the linemen's turn to run, the defensive guys would finish just a few steps ahead of the offensive guys. The second group consisted of QB's, tight ends, and special teams players. The third group had running backs, DB's, and WR's. It was a tough exercise especially at the end of the practice. At the end of the exercise (each group had done it five times), Romeo let out a loud "GOOD!" And then brought the team together to huddle up.

Jim Zorn rode a bike up the path to the building from the practice field.

Black Bob · 08-14-2012, 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by durtyrute

7 passes is hardly enough to judge a QB by.

Play better and you get to throw more than 7 passes.

**DeezNutz** · 08-14-2012, 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackBob

We should draft someone every year. Stanzi needs to shit or get off the pot. "Project Players" need to show something to remain "Project Players." It doesn't matter what position they play.

Deeznuts,

Pocket presence is not his biggest problem. He's got good enough presence to win and he's shown that. With a decent o-line and the ability to change plays, he will be better. He changed 7 out of 16 plays on Friday night. Haley didn't let him do this. Haley was holding him back. He's got a good o-line and a ton of weapons. This will be his last shot. I believe he will say "**** it" and just let it rip this year. My only fear is his ability in close games. He's not the least bit clutch and you can't coach that. Every once in a while it comes out in a veteran like it did for Alex Smith last year but, that is very rare.

I bet Cassel has a career year and a new contract by this time next year.

Regarding the bold:

No, he hasn't shown that. He panics under pressure, putting himself and the entire offense in poor positions. This book is out on Cassel, and I believe that enough discussion has proven that Cassel makes his O-lines look worse than they actually are.

Lack of instincts and presence are also why he struggles to go through progressions.

aturnis · 08-14-2012, 01:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiefs Pantalones

Flowers has a "bruised" foot?

You're an idiot. Every had a severely bruised foot? Hurts to walk, you will limp. Any idea how hard it would be to plant and cut on that foot?

Unless he has a tiny tear somewhere, what else could it be? No cast, no boot, no nothing.

ChiefsCountry · 08-14-2012, 01:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aturnis

Have you paid any attention to this team in the last 5 yrs. Outside of Terence Copper, what 2nd or 3rd team receiver could catch a ball for this team for years?

Would you feel better if the receiver got his feet down on the perfectly thrown fade and Stanzi went 3-7 with a TD?

How about if the sideline route that should have been caught? 4-7 for 80-100 yds and a TD in the air while leading the team to another setting up a rushing TD with his feet for 7 yds and a first down?

Dude you are arguing with a true fan type.

durtyrute · 08-14-2012, 01:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BossChief

I'll say it again because people seemingly ignored it when I posted it yesterday.

Go back and watch all 7 throws Stanzi makes against the Cardinals and place Bowe, Baldwin and Breaston on the receiving end of them.

Now, give me a legitimate stat line of his under that hypothetical.

I firmly believe that he is 5/7 with a touchdown and just under 100 yards and that he lead two touchdown drives.

If these coaches ever give the kid a chance on a level surface to Quinn and Cassel, he will outperform them.

But, yeah...I have genuine hope Cassel turns things around and lights it up this year. Apparently, I don't have a choice.

I don't know why people want to ignore this. Why don't some people even want the kid to get even a little chance.

Even with how it played out, didn't we score 10 points with him in? Regardless of field position or whatever. 10 is 10

07-26-2012, 08:51 AM
Kylo Ren Grandson of Darth Vader Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Starkiller Base Casino cash: $10015175	*OFFICIAL 2012 KC Chiefs Training Camp Thread* Discuss everything Chiefs / training camp related here...... Enjoy! Mark Cassell sucks! Last edited by Kylo Ren; 07-26-2012 at 08:51 AM.. Reason: Wrong year!
Posts: 10,197

08-14-2012, 01:05 PM	#3858
BossChief SuperBowl or bust Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: BF Iowa Casino cash: $-1675912	I'll say it again because people seemingly ignored it when I posted it yesterday. Go back and watch all 7 throws Stanzi makes against the Cardinals and place Bowe, Baldwin and Breaston on the receiving end of them. Now, give me a legitimate stat line of his under that hypothetical. I firmly believe that he is 5/7 with a touchdown and just under 100 yards and that he lead two touchdown drives. If these coaches ever give the kid a chance on a level surface to Quinn and Cassel, he will outperform them. But, yeah...I have genuine hope Cassel turns things around and lights it up this year. Apparently, I don't have a choice. __________________ Dreams do come true... http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showp...postcount=1407
Posts: 47,898

08-14-2012, 01:09 PM	#3862
ShowtimeSBMVP Chiefs Join Date: Feb 2009 Casino cash: $1256009	Bob Fescoe ‏@bobfescoe Crennel said Hemingway is moving #chiefs Gray has a hamstring injury
Posts: 23,832

08-14-2012, 01:10 PM	#3865
-King- ▓▓▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▓▓ Join Date: Jan 2009 Casino cash: $-1324257	From yesterday. (This training camp thread is an abortion ) Chiefs Practice Report: Monday, August 13th From the FanPosts. Lots of detail, great stuff. -Joel Conditions were perfect for a trip to training camp in St. Joe today. When practice began, it was in the mid to lower 70's and the clouds were providing some nice shade. After some walk-through style drills for position groups and the punting team, the whole team lined up for warm ups. Romeo Crennel called the team together at that point and addressed everyone. Whatever he was saying lasted about two minutes, and then the team spread out on the sideline of the field closest to the bleachers and got ready to do sprints across the width of the field. They showed some team comraderie after Romeo's speech. A handful of the players yelled like warriors as they headed to their place on the line. Matt Cassel and wide receiver Jamar Newsome were among those running fastest during this opening warm-up exercise. Cameron Sheffield, Brandon Flowers, and Travis Daniels were not in pads or a helmet, but did participate in all the warm-ups including the running. After that, they headed over to the rehab area. They were on bikes for at least part of practice. Flowers did a little one on one hand work with a coach on the sideline later in practice. Star-divide After warm-ups and stretching, most of the the offense worked on a drill that seemed to be about conditioning and fundamentals. Without a defense to line up against (they were on the other field), the offense would line up with more than usual o-linemen with their hand on the ground. The QB would snap the ball and the whole offense including the QB would run forward about 20 yards... Then they would turn around and do the same thing in the other direction before taking a break for another group to rotate in. Nick Sirianni set up some cones and explained to the wide receivers how he wanted them to run through them. Each player would start off by hitting a cushion that Sirianni was holding and then would turn through the cone exercise and catch a pass from Jim Bob Cooter during their last turn in the cones. Brian Daboll watched this drill and would occasionally pull a player aside before the went through the rotation again. While this was going on, Jim Zorn was leading the QBs in the exercise ball drill. This has been described a number of times on AP, but one QB stands in the middle and tries to avoid three exercise balls that are being thrown from three different angels by Zorn and the other three QBs. Alex Tanney was the last QB to do the drill. After the drill was clearly over and he had started to relax, Cassel jokingly threw an exercise ball at his back. That got a big laugh out of everyone in the stands. The receivers started another drill in which they would run off the line of scrimmage and go around Nick Sirianni and then try to catch a pass. Daboll told Sirianni to give the players some contact off the line. Sirianni asked Daboll how far he wanted him to run with them and Daboll jokingly replied "I want you to beat them up the whole way, Nick." Sirianni gave a lot of contact to the first receiver to go through the drill but after that stood around 10 yards back off the line and usually moved out of their way. Brian Daboll's nickname for Dexter McCluster seems to be "twos." A few minutes later, Sirianni led the receivers (yeah, the receivers were doing a lot of work in the area of the field I was near) in which they started off working on catching under thrown passes. Jim Bob Cooter would throw a pass and Sirianni instructed the receivers to slow down, plant their front legs, and jump back for the ball. He compared the action needed to catch an underthrown pass to getting the rebound in basketball. He used the phrase "attacking the ball" in this part of the exercise. They moved onto catching "normal" passes. Sirianni kept telling the players "Don't anticipate it!" I think he was telling them not to anticipate the ball coming their way so much with their bodies too early so as to give too much away to a nearby defender too soon. The receiver then moved on to catching the types of floater passes that go to the back corner of the endzone a lot. Jonathan Baldwin's long arms helped him catch a pass from Jim Bob Cooter in this drill that looked tough to catch. During all of this, the QBs were throwing to the tight ends who were running routes. In 7 on 7 (I think I actually counted 8 on offense but I could be wrong), the crowd reacted when Jamaal Charles found a hole on the left side to move through with a burst. On the next play, Peyton Hillis had a nice looking run to the right... Of course, there was no tackling. When Brady Quinn was in on 7 on 7, he called out "Obama" twice at the line of scrimmage. This brought chuckles from the crowd and people said "Did he say Obama?" I have no idea what it meant. Later, in a special teams practice portion of the practice, Tamba Hali was in on the punt blocking team. Sometimes he would line up on the edge and sometimes in the middle. On one play off the edge, he made a nice play that probably would have pressured the punter. Later, there was a drill in which one defensive lineman or OLB would line up against a few offensive linemen. It looked as if the o-line guys did not always know which of them the d linemen would try to take on, but once he did - the other o line guys backed off and it became a one on one thing. Sometimes it was obvious who the d line guy would go against - especially when it was an OLB. When Hali lined up, Donald Stephenson had to hold him to contain him and not let him get to the imaginary QB in the backfield. But Hali is used to that. It was fun to watch Brandon Albert and Justin Houston in this drill. They were a good match. Neither was letting up. In 11 on 11, Kevin Boss caught a nice pass from Cassel in the middle of the field in traffic near Kendrick Lewis and Jalil Brown. Stanzi played with the second team. Pioli visited with the strength and conditioning coach on the sideline for a good little while. He may have been getting tips about his own ongoing muscle makeover - but it didn't appear that way. Pioli also spent a few minutes visiting with Allen Bailey during a water break. During another special teams session, the team focused on blocking punts. You can tell the new special teams coach wants to emphasize blocking punts - which the Chiefs nearly did on Friday night against Arizona During a drill, the special teams coach would have his own "punt" blocked intentionally and then yell "Scoop and score! Scoop and score!" Players from each side would try to come up with the free ball. The practice ended with some conditioning. The team sprinted the width of the field again. They were broken up into three groups and each group ran the width of the field and back five times. The first group was offensive and defensive linemen. Brandon Bair was the fastest in this group by far. Each time it was the linemen's turn to run, the defensive guys would finish just a few steps ahead of the offensive guys. The second group consisted of QB's, tight ends, and special teams players. The third group had running backs, DB's, and WR's. It was a tough exercise especially at the end of the practice. At the end of the exercise (each group had done it five times), Romeo let out a loud "GOOD!" And then brought the team together to huddle up. Jim Zorn rode a bike up the path to the building from the practice field. __________________ 🏁
Posts: 65,460