News Video of Police shooting man 30+ times - Page 10

Mr. Laz · 08-17-2012, 01:06 PM

Video captures Michigan man's shooting by police
http://www.cnn.com/2012/08/16/us/mic...ing/index.html

From Jason Carroll and Sheila Steffen, CNN
updated 10:12 AM EDT, Fri August 17, 2012

Man killed by cops, shot multiple times

STORY HIGHLIGHTS

Milton Hall was killed in a confrontation with police in Saginaw, Michigan
"It appeared to be a firing squad dressed in police uniforms," his mother says
Prosecutors and state police are investigating Hall's killing
His family says he was mentally ill and questions why the probe is taking so long

Saginaw, Michigan (CNN) -- Three days before Independence Day, Milton Hall died in a fusillade of police gunfire outside a strip mall.
He had been arguing with officers in a parking lot next to a shuttered Chinese restaurant when he was shot, in full view of passing motorists and while he was holding some sort of knife. Saginaw County Prosecutor Michael Thomas said later that the squad of police confronting him opened fire "because apparently, at this point in time, he was threatening to assault police."

Thomas' office and the Michigan State Police are investigating Hall's death. Saginaw Police Chief Gerald Cliff said Hall was "known to be an assaultive person" with "a long history" of contacts with law enforcement, "not only with police from our department but with the county."
Hall's cousin, Mike Washington, acknowledged Hall had been jailed for minor offenses like vagrancy in the past, but, "He was not violent." And Hall's mother is growing impatient with the probe and questions why police opened fire so furiously on her son, whom she said was mentally ill.

The chart blog: Mental health

"It appeared to be a firing squad dressed in police uniforms," Jewel Hall told CNN from her hometown of Albuquerque, New Mexico. "There was another way. They did not have to kill him. He had not done anything. He was not violent. He was not a murderer. He was not a criminal."
Jewel Hall said her son had once trained as a civil right activist, been an avid reader and played football. He had lived in Saginaw for 35 years and received Social Security disability payments for a mental illness, but, "He knew his rights."

"Everybody knew him. The police knew him well," she said. "So that's another question: they knew him, so why? Why did they kill him?"

WJRT: Community questions police shooting

The July 1 shooting happened in a parking lot on West Genessee Avenue, a busy commercial strip on the north side of Saginaw. In a video purchased by CNN, shot by a motorist from across the street, the 49-year-old Hall is seen arguing with a half-dozen officers. For more than three minutes, he walks back and forth, and at one time appears to crouch in a "karate stance," according to the man who captured the scene.

Police said Hall had just had a run-in with a convenience store clerk. On the video, he tells police, "My name is Milton Hall, I just called 911. My name is Milton, and I'm p---ed off." When an officer tells him to put the knife down, he responds, "I ain't putting s--t down." He appears unimpressed by a police dog, telling officers, "Let him go. Let the motherf---ing dog go."

Finally, he turns to the left of the frame, where another officer had moved out of view a short time earlier. It's then that the police open fire with a reported 46 shots in a five-second hail of bullets.
"I'm stunned that six human beings would stand in front of one human being and fire 46 shots," Jewel Hall said. "I just don't understand that. It's a lot of pain in that because it only takes one shot, so the question is why?"

She questioned why none of the cameras in the police cars at the scene recorded the shooting -- "none of them work."

"So that's the question I have and the community has is, what's taking so long?" she said. "Why is not being transparent?"

Lou Palumbo, a former Long Island police officer, told CNN's "Anderson Cooper 360" that the video is "a perceptive nightmare" for a police department and could reflect a lack of training by the officers.

"This wasn't a scenario where he was discharging a weapon in their direction," he said.

But Palumbo added that the shooting may yet be determined to be justifiable. "One of the things the public has to understand, an individual wielding a knife at you at about 20 feet can be on top of you in a split second," he said. "The public doesn't know this because they don't do this for a living."

Neither state police nor the prosecutor's office would comment on the investigation. In a written statement to CNN, the state police said, "Our focus is on conducting a complete and thorough investigation, rather than a hasty one."

But Saginaw City Councilman Norman Braddock, who also has criticized the pace of the investigation, said the probe should be a "top priority."
When CNN showed Braddock the video, which he hadn't seen before, he said, "This is disturbing."

"I can see what people are traumatized at, looking at something like that," Braddock said. "We need answers."

Jewel Hall said her family is conducting its own investigation into the shooting, "and at the end of that investigation we will decide what next steps to take with our legal advisors."

BIG_DADDY · 08-17-2012, 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Donger

We don't know if they had any non-lethal means available, except I suppose their night sticks. They probably didn't want their dog to be injured.

Anyway, he'd be alive right now if he'd just followed the lawful order to drop his weapon.

HE was a reerun dude.

at the dog comment. I'll bet that is totally true. They hold them way above the value of human life.

vailpass · 08-17-2012, 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BIG_DADDY

HE was a reerun dude.

at the dog comment. I'll bet that is totally true. They hold them way above the value of human life.

Are they authorized to send the K9 unit at an armed man, knowing the dog is going to get shot or stabbed? I honestly don't know.

crazycoffey · 08-17-2012, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vailpass

Are they authorized to send the K9 unit at an armed man, knowing the dog is going to get shot or stabbed? I honestly don't know.

It should be, dogs have an amazing immunization to knives. This whole mess could have been avoided if the crazy man's mom would have loved on him more....

vailpass · 08-17-2012, 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crazycoffey

It should be, dogs have an amazing immunization to knives. This whole mess could have been avoided if the crazy man's mom would have loved on him more....

Really?

Brock · 08-17-2012, 05:00 PM

I wouldn't have sent the dog either. 2 or 3 cops with sticks would have made short work of this guy and sent him to the nuthouse more or less unharmed. This was just pure laziness combined with stupidity.

vailpass · 08-17-2012, 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brock

I wouldn't have sent the dog either. 2 or 3 cops with sticks would have made short work of this guy and sent him to the nuthouse more or less unharmed. This was just pure laziness combined with stupidity.

I don't blame the officers for not engaging an knife wielding mad man in hand to hand combat. Knife to a gunfight and all of that.

**petegz28** · 08-17-2012, 05:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crazycoffey

five seconds of shooting seems still in a reasonable window of time, but I'm not there, don't know.

I would guess if one of the officers ran up on the man and did a MW3 T-bag move three or four times before shooting the dead man 15 more times in the face and nuts I would be more than inclined to agree with you.

BTW, do you even realize how many rounds can be fired in 5 seconds? I can empty my 15 round clip in 5 seconds. Now multiply that by 6.

**petegz28** · 08-17-2012, 05:03 PM

I wouldn't have released the dog but tazers were definitely called for.

**petegz28** · 08-17-2012, 05:04 PM

Can someone tell if the cops had him surrounded? If not then it seems pretty clear when he took his steps he did not step towards the officers. In fact it looks like he was stepping on the other direction. I am trying to see if he started to turn his back to them.

crazycoffey · 08-17-2012, 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vailpass

Really?

It's true, in the breeding process the skin gets extra leathery and combine that with the long hair of the German Shepard, they are extremely knife resistant.

Brock · 08-17-2012, 05:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vailpass

I don't blame the officers for not engaging an knife wielding mad man in hand to hand combat. Knife to a gunfight and all of that.

There is a reason these type of fatal events are rare. Usually the cops know how to handle it properly. these guys clearly didn't, and they don't deserve to wear a badge.

Kidd Lex · 08-17-2012, 05:07 PM

Sooooo many better ways to handle this....hell run him over with a car ffs...jesus h. christ. 30 shots. Im a big PD supporter, my pops provide a great quality of life being a cop for 40 years, but these guys ****ed up.

Also its tricky with the k9 unit, if these k9 officers get sooo close to their dogs that they won't use them in situations as intended, then wtf is the point.

vailpass · 08-17-2012, 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brock

There is a reason these type of fatal events are rare. Usually the cops know how to handle it properly. these guys clearly didn't, and they don't deserve to wear a badge.

OK but you don't expect police officers to engage in hand to hand combat with a knife wielding mad man do you?

vailpass · 08-17-2012, 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crazycoffey

It's true, in the breeding process the skin gets extra leathery and combine that with the long hair of the German Shepard, they are extremely knife resistant.

I'll be damned, did not know that. Still seems shitty to send them to a certain stabbing but I guess they are service dogs.

**petegz28** · 08-17-2012, 05:08 PM

The more I watch this the more I can say every single officer who participated in this should be charged with murder or manslaughter or whatever. the guy was clearly down on the ground. He had a knife, not a gun so he couldn't potentially shoot them while down which would have justified the contiued shooting.

08-17-2012, 01:06 PM
Mr. Laz Don't Tease Me Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: KS Casino cash: $11047037	Video of Police shooting man 30+ times Video captures Michigan man's shooting by police http://www.cnn.com/2012/08/16/us/mic...ing/index.html From Jason Carroll and Sheila Steffen, CNN updated 10:12 AM EDT, Fri August 17, 2012 Man killed by cops, shot multiple times STORY HIGHLIGHTS Milton Hall was killed in a confrontation with police in Saginaw, Michigan "It appeared to be a firing squad dressed in police uniforms," his mother says Prosecutors and state police are investigating Hall's killing His family says he was mentally ill and questions why the probe is taking so long Saginaw, Michigan (CNN) -- Three days before Independence Day, Milton Hall died in a fusillade of police gunfire outside a strip mall. He had been arguing with officers in a parking lot next to a shuttered Chinese restaurant when he was shot, in full view of passing motorists and while he was holding some sort of knife. Saginaw County Prosecutor Michael Thomas said later that the squad of police confronting him opened fire "because apparently, at this point in time, he was threatening to assault police." Thomas' office and the Michigan State Police are investigating Hall's death. Saginaw Police Chief Gerald Cliff said Hall was "known to be an assaultive person" with "a long history" of contacts with law enforcement, "not only with police from our department but with the county." Hall's cousin, Mike Washington, acknowledged Hall had been jailed for minor offenses like vagrancy in the past, but, "He was not violent." And Hall's mother is growing impatient with the probe and questions why police opened fire so furiously on her son, whom she said was mentally ill. The chart blog: Mental health "It appeared to be a firing squad dressed in police uniforms," Jewel Hall told CNN from her hometown of Albuquerque, New Mexico. "There was another way. They did not have to kill him. He had not done anything. He was not violent. He was not a murderer. He was not a criminal." Jewel Hall said her son had once trained as a civil right activist, been an avid reader and played football. He had lived in Saginaw for 35 years and received Social Security disability payments for a mental illness, but, "He knew his rights." "Everybody knew him. The police knew him well," she said. "So that's another question: they knew him, so why? Why did they kill him?" WJRT: Community questions police shooting The July 1 shooting happened in a parking lot on West Genessee Avenue, a busy commercial strip on the north side of Saginaw. In a video purchased by CNN, shot by a motorist from across the street, the 49-year-old Hall is seen arguing with a half-dozen officers. For more than three minutes, he walks back and forth, and at one time appears to crouch in a "karate stance," according to the man who captured the scene. Police said Hall had just had a run-in with a convenience store clerk. On the video, he tells police, "My name is Milton Hall, I just called 911. My name is Milton, and I'm p---ed off." When an officer tells him to put the knife down, he responds, "I ain't putting s--t down." He appears unimpressed by a police dog, telling officers, "Let him go. Let the motherf---ing dog go." Finally, he turns to the left of the frame, where another officer had moved out of view a short time earlier. It's then that the police open fire with a reported 46 shots in a five-second hail of bullets. "I'm stunned that six human beings would stand in front of one human being and fire 46 shots," Jewel Hall said. "I just don't understand that. It's a lot of pain in that because it only takes one shot, so the question is why?" She questioned why none of the cameras in the police cars at the scene recorded the shooting -- "none of them work." "So that's the question I have and the community has is, what's taking so long?" she said. "Why is not being transparent?" Lou Palumbo, a former Long Island police officer, told CNN's "Anderson Cooper 360" that the video is "a perceptive nightmare" for a police department and could reflect a lack of training by the officers. "This wasn't a scenario where he was discharging a weapon in their direction," he said. But Palumbo added that the shooting may yet be determined to be justifiable. "One of the things the public has to understand, an individual wielding a knife at you at about 20 feet can be on top of you in a split second," he said. "The public doesn't know this because they don't do this for a living." Neither state police nor the prosecutor's office would comment on the investigation. In a written statement to CNN, the state police said, "Our focus is on conducting a complete and thorough investigation, rather than a hasty one." But Saginaw City Councilman Norman Braddock, who also has criticized the pace of the investigation, said the probe should be a "top priority." When CNN showed Braddock the video, which he hadn't seen before, he said, "This is disturbing." "I can see what people are traumatized at, looking at something like that," Braddock said. "We need answers." Jewel Hall said her family is conducting its own investigation into the shooting, "and at the end of that investigation we will decide what next steps to take with our legal advisors."
Posts: 95,626

08-17-2012, 05:00 PM	#140
Brock Say hello to my little friend Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Larryville Casino cash: $9598422	I wouldn't have sent the dog either. 2 or 3 cops with sticks would have made short work of this guy and sent him to the nuthouse more or less unharmed. This was just pure laziness combined with stupidity.
Posts: 47,314

08-17-2012, 05:03 PM	#143
petegz28 Supporter Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Olathe, Ks Casino cash: $-1005873	I wouldn't have released the dog but tazers were definitely called for.
Posts: 132,431

08-17-2012, 05:04 PM	#144
petegz28 Supporter Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Olathe, Ks Casino cash: $-1005873	Can someone tell if the cops had him surrounded? If not then it seems pretty clear when he took his steps he did not step towards the officers. In fact it looks like he was stepping on the other direction. I am trying to see if he started to turn his back to them.
Posts: 132,431

08-17-2012, 05:07 PM	#147
Kidd Lex Veteran Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Kansas City Casino cash: $4442608	Sooooo many better ways to handle this....hell run him over with a car ffs...jesus h. christ. 30 shots. Im a big PD supporter, my pops provide a great quality of life being a cop for 40 years, but these guys **ed up. Also its tricky with the k9 unit, if these k9 officers get sooo close to their dogs that they won't use them in situations as intended, then wtf is the point. __________________ You are not your job, you're not how much money you have in the bank. You are not the car you drive. You're not the contents of your wallet. You are not your **ing khakis. -Fight Club
Posts: 4,160

08-17-2012, 05:08 PM	#150
petegz28 Supporter Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Olathe, Ks Casino cash: $-1005873	The more I watch this the more I can say every single officer who participated in this should be charged with murder or manslaughter or whatever. the guy was clearly down on the ground. He had a knife, not a gun so he couldn't potentially shoot them while down which would have justified the contiued shooting.
Posts: 132,431