Chiefs Alleged bad advice from Bill Parcells may help sink Chiefs' Scott Pioli, - Page 2

**bevischief** · 10-09-2012, 12:33 PM

Alleged bad advice from Bill Parcells may help sink Chiefs' Scott Pioli, Dolphins' Jeff Ireland

This is an interesting time in the legacy of Bill Parcells. He may finally get into the Pro Football Hall of Fame in February.

Before then, he may also have to help his son-in-law and a couple of close friends find jobs.

Kansas City Chiefs general manager Scott Pioli, who is married to Parcells' daughter, is the poster boy for what I like to call the Great Fraud of Parcells. This has nothing to do with football itself even though that would seem to be at the heart of Pioli's problems in Kansas City, where a banner calling for his firing and quarterback Matt Cassel's benching was flown before Sunday's game. The discontent was more apparent later that day as some fans cheered when Cassel got injured.

Fans have a legitimate reason to be bitter with the Chiefs' performance under the four-year leadership of Pioli. Aside from the Chiefs' AFC West title in 2010, Kansas City finished in last place in 2009 and 2011, and is currently in last at 1-4. Not helping matters is the incomprehensibly stupid approach that general managers shouldn't talk to the media – advice from former NFL coach and Miami Dolphins head of football operations Bill Parcells to Pioli and others, according to two sources familiar with the relationships. General managers should exist but not be heard, goes the theory. They should work in the shadows rather than the spotlight.

That advice was so good that people in Miami are still asking whether GM Jeff Ireland, a guy Parcells hired himself when he was running the Dolphins, will survive this season. I know this because I was asked that very question Tuesday morning during a radio interview.

Like Pioli's Chiefs, Ireland's Dolphins have been embroiled in misery. After winning the AFC East in 2008, Miami finished below .500 in each of the next three seasons. Making matters worse were Ireland's dreadful query to Dez Bryant prior to the 2010 NFL draft and the club's botched coaching pursuits in 2011 and earlier this year.

Conversely, Ireland just drafted quarterback Ryan Tannehill, a guy who looks like he's going to be a franchise quarterback for the next 12 to 15 years, and played a part in the hiring of coach Joe Philbin, who is looking pretty solid right now. Still, this may not be enough to alter public perception that he's the wrong man for the job.

The same appears to be true in Kansas City, where there is unheard of vitriol in its fan base. This is, after all, the same fan base that showed so much patience with former GM/President Carl Peterson, a guy who guided the team to three playoff wins in 20 years. On top of that, Peterson never once drafted a quarterback in the first round.

Peterson survived two decades and it was even a mild shock when owner Clark Hunt forced him out after the 2008 season. Yet after only four years, Pioli is persona non grata.

When did Kansas City become Philadelphia?

The answer comes back to Parcells, who for all his greatness as a football man (Parcells deserves to be in the Hall, no question), doesn't really understand one thing: Football is an entertainment business.

This is not some tech company where secrets must be guarded for survival. Yeah, a certain amount of secrecy and subterfuge is necessary in this game, but that doesn't mean that the people in charge can hide. Not if they want to survive the rough times, that is.

In fairness to Pioli, he has tried to change this offseason. He was available more this offseason than at any time in the first three years. Some of that was in reaction to heavy criticism of his methods (the Kansas City Star reported at length about Pioli's tense relationship with former coach Todd Haley and the divisive atmosphere in the organization). But at least Pioli, who is traveling this week to scout college players, has actually made a change.

The problem is that it may be too late and that's where Parcells and his misbegotten logic are to blame. To a man, Parcells' apprentices-turned-GMs around the league are a standoffish, fearful lot. Pioli, Ireland and New York Jets GM Mike Tannenbaum have all apparently taken Parcells' advice about staying out of the limelight.

[More: Terrell Owens to struggling Jets: 'I’m available! I'm ready, willing, and able!']

Even Parcells himself, during his days with the Dolphins, would barely come up for air. He spoke to a handful of reporters whom he felt he could trust and that was it.

The joke is that Parcells did exactly the opposite during the most successful days of his long and storied career. As New York Giants head coach, Parcells liked to portray himself as a tough guy, snarling when the cameras and TV reporters were around on Wednesday and Thursday.

By Friday, however, Parcells would sit in the media room for hours. The key was that Fridays, particularly back in the 1980s, were when the beat reporters were the only ones left. Parcells would sit and develop relationships with those guys, allowing him to survive the rough patches (and when you had to deal with Lawrence Taylor on a weekly basis, there were plenty of rough patches).

In fact, the GM who Parcells worked for, the late, great George Young, was a media-friendly man who understood the relationship between the team and the public. Young believed in answering questions. The fans might not like the answers, but they never could accuse him of ducking. In fact, it was Young who would point toward the media room and tell his coaches: "You see those reporters in there? They were here before you got here and they'll be here after you leave."

One of those coaches who Young lectured long ago was Parcells. Somehow the message got lost in translation.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nfl--al...-ireland.html;

mcaj22 · 10-09-2012, 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cyborgtable

Tannenbaum has build a joke of a roster.
No receivers, a pitiful interior line.
Depth problems everywhere.
Slowest linebacking core in the NFL.
No pass-rushers to speak of.
And a bunch of projects in the early rounds

kind of sounds like how Pioli built our team

project receivers
depth problems everywhere
acquired 1 good LBer/pass rushr
no d-lineman that can pass rush all projects/busts/stiffs/take too much time for development
projects in early rounds everwhere
injury prone secondary with no depth
letting homegrown talent walk in FA for cheaper and worse FA alternatives

Chiefs and Jets football

BigRock · 10-09-2012, 01:30 PM

This article has nothing to do with Parcells.

This is the same guy who wrote the column last week where "a source close to Pioli" acted like Scott knew all along that Cassel wasn't any good.

Now he's saying Pioli's problem is that he doesn't do enough interviews. He stays out of the limelight too much. And it's not even Pioli's fault, because it was bad advice he got.

WE NEED MORE PIOLI
MORE PIOLI WILL FIX EVERYTHING

COchief · 10-09-2012, 01:31 PM

This "secrecy with the media" philosophy is so simple and stupid it makes my head literally hurt everytime I see it.

Parcells and Belicheck got away with it because they were winning superbowls, no fan gives a single shit about what the GM is saying or doing if they are winning superbowls. This philosophy sucks if your team sucks, which is why anyone trying to use it immediately goes down in flames.

Basically if you win, no one gives a shit. If you're losing we want to know why and what are you going to do about it.

It really is that simple.

Michael Jordan has always been a huge asshole, but god damn did everyone in Chicago love him.

Deberg_1990 · 10-09-2012, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cassel's Reckoning

http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?p=8991145

he wrote that? I just assumed you did so i skipped it.

jimhitter · 10-09-2012, 01:36 PM

Parcells would also advise you to run some "jap plays, no disrespect".

Tophawk36 · 10-09-2012, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fritz88

How do you reconcile this with BB being a shitty coach whose nothing without Brady?

I blame Tom Brady for all the Chiefs problems. If he weren't so good all these idiots running the Chiefs wouldn't be here screwing up this team and if he didn't get hurt Cassel would still be some anonymous back up somewhere or more likely working in the real world by now instead of screwing up the Chiefs. Seriously Tom Brady should be getting a cut of all these dopes paychecks who have high paying jobs because of his success.

Amnorix · 10-09-2012, 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cassel's Reckoning

Belichick isn't a shitty coach.

He's been completely overrated because of Tom Brady, though. For sure.

Question, which NFL coach isn't overrated because of his quarterback?

Lombardi -- Bart Starr
Landry -- Staubach
Walsh -- Montana

Frankly, you show me a multiple SB winning coach, and I'll show you EITHER a great QB or a ridiculously talented defense/run game combo (Noll, Gibbs).

Amnorix · 10-09-2012, 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tophawk36

I blame Tom Brady for all the Chiefs problems. If he weren't so good all these idiots running the Chiefs wouldn't be here screwing up this team and if he didn't get hurt Cassel would still be some anonymous back up somewhere or more likely working in the real world by now instead of screwing up the Chiefs. Seriously Tom Brady should be getting a cut of all these dopes paychecks who have high paying jobs because of his success.

So a huge part of your problem is karma for YOUR OWN GUY hurting Brady in 2008? Can't say it isn't self-inflicted then, right?

Amnorix · 10-09-2012, 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sfeihc

Didn't Parcells Pats beat Belichick and the Browns in the playoffs in 94?

No. Belichick's Browns won that game. Think that's the last playoff win the Browns have, now that you mention it.

**DaneMcCloud** · 10-09-2012, 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amnorix

Question, which NFL coach isn't overrated because of his quarterback?

Lombardi -- Bart Starr
Landry -- Staubach
Walsh -- Montana

Frankly, you show me a multiple SB winning coach, and I'll show you EITHER a great QB or a ridiculously talented defense/run game combo (Noll, Gibbs).

Landry wasn't overrated due to his QB. He put a competitive team on the field for decades and while I think it was time for him to go in 1988, there's no doubt in my mind that he would have won with the early 90's Cowboys roster.

Sorter · 10-09-2012, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amnorix

So a huge part of your problem is karma for YOUR OWN GUY hurting Brady in 2008? Can't say it isn't self-inflicted then, right?

This. Pollard ****ed the Chiefs over.

**ChiefGator** · 10-09-2012, 04:36 PM

Could also be that Tom Brady is benefiting from Bill Belichick. Not like we have any other evidence to disprove that. Hell, Cassel even blossomed under Bill.

Sorter · 10-09-2012, 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChiefGator

Could also be that Tom Brady is benefiting from Bill Belichick. Not like we have any other evidence to disprove that. Hell, Cassel even blossomed under Bill.

It is both IMO. The two are perfect for each other. Personalities mesh well, they have genuine trust in one another, and both believe in their philosophies that helped them obtain success.

displacedinMN · 10-09-2012, 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChiefsCountry

Bill Parcells never won a single playoff game without Bill Belichick on his coaching staff. He is a fat ****ing fraud.

I have said it a few times since last week.

Watched the Cleavland '95 on NFLNET last week. I think Belichek is the master of all of that. He trained all of what to do. He micromanaged everything. He had a plan.

There are a few that can pull off what he has-even though the football gods have been teasing him the last 4 years.

Without BB, few succeed. But none as well as him.

DTLB58 · 10-09-2012, 07:45 PM

So if Haley would have stuck around and won 2 SB's but Romeo was the DC, years later it wasn't because of Haley?

Grasping at straws. We can look thru the record books and switch the numbers around lots of ways with all the fricking coaching trees that are out there now, and there are a lot out there. Bottom line is BP won 2 SB as a HC took another team to a SB and was successful in turning other franchises around from ashes. The dude could flat out coach!

If you don't like him fine, but he was good, his record says so. If he would have been with the Chiefs during that run with the Giants everyone here would have him in there F****** avatar so shut the hell up!

10-09-2012, 12:33 PM
bevischief .... Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Somewhere Kansas Casino cash: $7749352 VARSITY	Alleged bad advice from Bill Parcells may help sink Chiefs' Scott Pioli, Alleged bad advice from Bill Parcells may help sink Chiefs' Scott Pioli, Dolphins' Jeff Ireland This is an interesting time in the legacy of Bill Parcells. He may finally get into the Pro Football Hall of Fame in February. Before then, he may also have to help his son-in-law and a couple of close friends find jobs. Kansas City Chiefs general manager Scott Pioli, who is married to Parcells' daughter, is the poster boy for what I like to call the Great Fraud of Parcells. This has nothing to do with football itself even though that would seem to be at the heart of Pioli's problems in Kansas City, where a banner calling for his firing and quarterback Matt Cassel's benching was flown before Sunday's game. The discontent was more apparent later that day as some fans cheered when Cassel got injured. Fans have a legitimate reason to be bitter with the Chiefs' performance under the four-year leadership of Pioli. Aside from the Chiefs' AFC West title in 2010, Kansas City finished in last place in 2009 and 2011, and is currently in last at 1-4. Not helping matters is the incomprehensibly stupid approach that general managers shouldn't talk to the media – advice from former NFL coach and Miami Dolphins head of football operations Bill Parcells to Pioli and others, according to two sources familiar with the relationships. General managers should exist but not be heard, goes the theory. They should work in the shadows rather than the spotlight. That advice was so good that people in Miami are still asking whether GM Jeff Ireland, a guy Parcells hired himself when he was running the Dolphins, will survive this season. I know this because I was asked that very question Tuesday morning during a radio interview. Like Pioli's Chiefs, Ireland's Dolphins have been embroiled in misery. After winning the AFC East in 2008, Miami finished below .500 in each of the next three seasons. Making matters worse were Ireland's dreadful query to Dez Bryant prior to the 2010 NFL draft and the club's botched coaching pursuits in 2011 and earlier this year. Conversely, Ireland just drafted quarterback Ryan Tannehill, a guy who looks like he's going to be a franchise quarterback for the next 12 to 15 years, and played a part in the hiring of coach Joe Philbin, who is looking pretty solid right now. Still, this may not be enough to alter public perception that he's the wrong man for the job. The same appears to be true in Kansas City, where there is unheard of vitriol in its fan base. This is, after all, the same fan base that showed so much patience with former GM/President Carl Peterson, a guy who guided the team to three playoff wins in 20 years. On top of that, Peterson never once drafted a quarterback in the first round. Peterson survived two decades and it was even a mild shock when owner Clark Hunt forced him out after the 2008 season. Yet after only four years, Pioli is persona non grata. When did Kansas City become Philadelphia? The answer comes back to Parcells, who for all his greatness as a football man (Parcells deserves to be in the Hall, no question), doesn't really understand one thing: Football is an entertainment business. This is not some tech company where secrets must be guarded for survival. Yeah, a certain amount of secrecy and subterfuge is necessary in this game, but that doesn't mean that the people in charge can hide. Not if they want to survive the rough times, that is. In fairness to Pioli, he has tried to change this offseason. He was available more this offseason than at any time in the first three years. Some of that was in reaction to heavy criticism of his methods (the Kansas City Star reported at length about Pioli's tense relationship with former coach Todd Haley and the divisive atmosphere in the organization). But at least Pioli, who is traveling this week to scout college players, has actually made a change. The problem is that it may be too late and that's where Parcells and his misbegotten logic are to blame. To a man, Parcells' apprentices-turned-GMs around the league are a standoffish, fearful lot. Pioli, Ireland and New York Jets GM Mike Tannenbaum have all apparently taken Parcells' advice about staying out of the limelight. [More: Terrell Owens to struggling Jets: 'I’m available! I'm ready, willing, and able!'] Even Parcells himself, during his days with the Dolphins, would barely come up for air. He spoke to a handful of reporters whom he felt he could trust and that was it. The joke is that Parcells did exactly the opposite during the most successful days of his long and storied career. As New York Giants head coach, Parcells liked to portray himself as a tough guy, snarling when the cameras and TV reporters were around on Wednesday and Thursday. By Friday, however, Parcells would sit in the media room for hours. The key was that Fridays, particularly back in the 1980s, were when the beat reporters were the only ones left. Parcells would sit and develop relationships with those guys, allowing him to survive the rough patches (and when you had to deal with Lawrence Taylor on a weekly basis, there were plenty of rough patches). In fact, the GM who Parcells worked for, the late, great George Young, was a media-friendly man who understood the relationship between the team and the public. Young believed in answering questions. The fans might not like the answers, but they never could accuse him of ducking. In fact, it was Young who would point toward the media room and tell his coaches: "You see those reporters in there? They were here before you got here and they'll be here after you leave." One of those coaches who Young lectured long ago was Parcells. Somehow the message got lost in translation. http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nfl--al...-ireland.html;
Posts: 27,771

10-09-2012, 01:30 PM	#17
BigRock Pritay Pritay Pritay Good Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: The State of Euphoria Casino cash: $795412	This article has nothing to do with Parcells. This is the same guy who wrote the column last week where "a source close to Pioli" acted like Scott knew all along that Cassel wasn't any good. Now he's saying Pioli's problem is that he doesn't do enough interviews. He stays out of the limelight too much. And it's not even Pioli's fault, because it was bad advice he got. WE NEED MORE PIOLI MORE PIOLI WILL FIX EVERYTHING
Posts: 6,987

10-09-2012, 01:31 PM	#18
COchief Blame it on the Henne Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Donk-town Casino cash: $6283231	This "secrecy with the media" philosophy is so simple and stupid it makes my head literally hurt everytime I see it. Parcells and Belicheck got away with it because they were winning superbowls, no fan gives a single shit about what the GM is saying or doing if they are winning superbowls. This philosophy sucks if your team sucks, which is why anyone trying to use it immediately goes down in flames. Basically if you win, no one gives a shit. If you're losing we want to know why and what are you going to do about it. It really is that simple. Michael Jordan has always been a huge asshole, but god damn did everyone in Chicago love him.
Posts: 2,982

10-09-2012, 01:36 PM	#20
jimhitter Starter Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Arlington, TX Casino cash: $10004900	Parcells would also advise you to run some "jap plays, no disrespect". __________________ Der Kommisars in town
Posts: 73

10-09-2012, 04:36 PM	#27
ChiefGator Can these boys not play? Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Northcentral Florida Casino cash: $6472956	Could also be that Tom Brady is benefiting from Bill Belichick. Not like we have any other evidence to disprove that. Hell, Cassel even blossomed under Bill. __________________ - Mark
Posts: 4,700

10-09-2012, 07:45 PM	#30
DTLB58 DT CARD COLLECTOR Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: ManCave Casino cash: $10005837	So if Haley would have stuck around and won 2 SB's but Romeo was the DC, years later it wasn't because of Haley? Grasping at straws. We can look thru the record books and switch the numbers around lots of ways with all the fricking coaching trees that are out there now, and there are a lot out there. Bottom line is BP won 2 SB as a HC took another team to a SB and was successful in turning other franchises around from ashes. The dude could flat out coach! If you don't like him fine, but he was good, his record says so. If he would have been with the Chiefs during that run with the Giants everyone here would have him in there F****** avatar so shut the hell up! __________________ 667 Different DT cards and counting
Posts: 7,574