Cardinals 2018 STL Cardinals Thread - Page 123

**BigRedChief** · 02:21 PM

Opening day lineup

Fowler RF
Pham CF
Carpenter 3B
Ozuna LF
Martinez 1B
Molina C
Dejong SS
Wong 2B
Pitcher

Edit:
Matheny fired 07/14/2018

Opening Day Roster

Spoiler!

**BigRedChief** · 07-05-2018, 06:49 AM

I ****ing hate this team. We are going to play .500 ball. Be in the hunt for thew wild card late in the season and nothing changes next season. Other than another wasted season.

Cubs beat writer:
The bottom line is, the Cardinals were once known as a model organization. But what we’ve seen of late has been a jarring juxtaposition to the St. Louis teams of just a few years ago. The fundamentals on defense and the base paths are gone, and issues that normally should be handled in house are being discussed publicly on a podcast with a current team broadcaster, and by the team’s top baseball executive, no less.

St. Louis looks nothing like the franchise it once was. Giancarlo Stanton enacted his no-trade clause and refused to be traded to St. Louis. Jason Heyward took less money to sign with the Cubs. The Cardinals lack any semblance of the franchise Theo Epstein once suggested the Cubs must mimic in order to find sustained success.

USA Today Nightengale:
PHOENIX - The good folks of St. Louis can feel it. They sense it. And they can certainly see it. Groundhog Day.

The Cardinals, one of baseball’s proudest and most prestigious franchises, winners of 11 World Series championships, with 12 playoff berths since 2000, are stuck on the treadmill of mediocrity.

They are 43-41 entering the July 4th holiday, nearly closer to the last-place Cincinnati Reds as the first-place Milwaukee Brewers in the NL Central, 6 ½ games out of first place.

They are in danger of missing the playoffs for the third consecutive season, for the first time since 1996-99.

“That’s embarrassing,’’ says Cardinals outfielder Tommy Pham, one of the Cardinals’ team leaders. “You never want to see something like that happen to this franchise. That’s on us.’’
Or, as Cardinals Nation might tell you, it’s on manager Mike Matheny. Or hitting coach John Mabry. Or club president John Mozeliak. Or owner Bill DeWitt.

They want someone to pay for this era of mediocrity. And no one is feeling the heat more than Matheny.“People who tell you they’re used to it,’’ Matheny tells USA TODAY Sports, “are lying. There’s a very small percentage of people in this world that can truly say they don’t care when it comes to stuff like that, and truly mean it. Unfortunately, I’m not in that small percentage.
“I’m not in the business of gaining public approval, but to say you’re completely unfazed by it, that’s hard to say.’’

It’s hardly Matheny’s fault his team is littered with guys who can’t field, but can hit. Guys who can hit, but can’t field.

Marco Polo · 07-05-2018, 07:24 AM

Given that the Orioles are terrible and that pending free agent Manny Machado is the opposite of terrible, it seems highly likely that the star infielder will be moved in advance of the non-waiver trade deadline.

Machado in his age-25 season is batting .311/.378/.565 (160 OPS+) with 21 home runs in 83 games. That's on pace to be easily a career year for Machado, and he's also proved himself capable of returning to the shortstop position in 2018. He's going to get paid this coming offseason, and he may wind up fetching a bigger contract than Bryce Harper does.

In the here and now, though, Machado is very likely on his way to a contender. Here's what CBS Sports HQ MLB analyst Jim Bowden says about the quickly development market for Machado ...

"I've talked to people involved in this over the last 24 hours, and I've talked to teams. Eight teams have confirmed to me that they've had discussions with the Orioles on Machado over the last 10 days. This is heating up. I've also been told, for people that are skeptical if the Angelos family will approve a deal, I've been told they are going to approve a deal. Their intent is to trade the player. When they get the package they like, they will move him."

So, yes, Machado is almost certainly going to be traded. At this point, you're no doubt wondering who those eight teams are. Straight from Bowden and CBS Sports HQ, here they are ...

Some teams would have Machado in mind as a shortstop (the Diamondbacks, for instance), and others would target him for his stronger position of third base (the Indians, for instance, who would then move Jose Ramirez to second base). The Cubs don't really have a clear need for him, as Kris Bryant is entrenched at third and shortstop Addison Russell has been producing at a solid clip this season. As for the heavily hyped Dodgers, Bowden says: "My intel says no, that they're not even close." The Braves and Brewers, meantime, don't like the current asking price.
That leaves us with this key takeaway from Bowden:

"I look at this and I go Phillies, Cardinals -- probably the frontrunners right now."

In terms of production to date, the Phillies' most glaring need is at short. Machado would also be an upgrade at third over Maikel Franco, who himself has been the subject of trade rumors. As for St. Louis, they're already giving Jose Martinez time in the outfield because of his sub-par defense at first base. Installing Machado at third base would allow Matt Carpenter to be the primary first baseman.

Whatever the case, expect some clarity on this front soon -- possibly several days in advance of the deadline.

Pasta Little Brioni · 07-05-2018, 07:59 AM

They aren't getting Machado

**BigRedChief** · 07-05-2018, 08:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pasta Giant Meatball

They aren't getting Machado

And shouldn't if we are give up Hudson/Kelley/JMartinez to get a 6 week rental. Manny alone will make us a contender but then he moves on next year and we are stuck with Meathead.

jd1020 · 07-05-2018, 09:15 AM

If you honestly believed that Machado would be the key to making the Cardinals a legitimate contender and WS threat and all you had to do was give up a catcher that hasn't proven he can swing a bat at a MLB level, a first baseman with an .850 OPS but struggles to even get on the field because he can't even play first base, and your 3rd best prospect that has yet to crack into the top 100 and you said no to one of the games elite players because you were worried he wouldnt re-sign after the season then you should be fired on the spot.

There are pitchers that hit every 5 games that manage to be better at it than Carson Kelly. I don't care how good your defense is, if you can't hit close to respectable you won't be on the field.

**BigRedChief** · 07-05-2018, 09:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jd1020

If you honestly believed that Machado would be the key to making the Cardinals a legitimate contender and WS threat and all you had to do was give up a catcher that hasn't proven he can swing a bat at a MLB level, a first baseman with an .850 OPS but struggles to even get on the field because he can't even play first base, and your 3rd best prospect that has yet to crack into the top 100 and you said no to one of the games elite players because you were worried he wouldnt re-sign after the season then you should be fired on the spot.

There are pitchers that hit every 5 games that manage to be better at it than Carson Kelly. I don't care how good your defense is, if you can't hit close to respectable you won't be on the field.

you miss the point I thought I made clear. The cause and effect. The effect of having Manny means Meathead stays.

Has Trout, Arendo and Harper been able to win shit by themselfs? Even Manny can’t overcome the ineptitude of Meathead.

I’d rather lose a chance at maybe some playoff wins than have Meathead for another year.

I’d rather have Meathead gone and then trade for Arenado with a new manager in charge.

jd1020 · 07-05-2018, 09:42 AM

3 playoff teams last season changed managers in the offseason. If Machado means the Cardinals keep Matheny then they were never going to fire him.

Pasta Little Brioni · 07-05-2018, 09:47 AM

They aren't a contender WITH Manny this year. No point.

Dogshit defense, terrible bullpen. Lineup full of streak, junk ball hitters.

Marco Polo · 07-05-2018, 10:41 AM

Cardinals acquired LHP Elniery Garcia from the Phillies for international bonus pool money.

Garcia has an ugly 6.38 ERA, 1.91 WHIP, and 29/21 K/BB ratio in 42 1/3 innings (nine starts, one relief appearance) this season at Double-A Reading, but the 23-year-old left-hander put up promising numbers in the lower minors. He was suspended 80 games last April after testing positive for a performance-enhancing drug. Garcia will presumably report to Double-A Springfield.

**BigRedChief** · 07-05-2018, 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marco Polo

Cardinals acquired LHP Elniery Garcia from the Phillies for international bonus pool money.

Garcia has an ugly 6.38 ERA, 1.91 WHIP, and 29/21 K/BB ratio in 42 1/3 innings (nine starts, one relief appearance) this season at Double-A Reading, but the 23-year-old left-hander put up promising numbers in the lower minors. He was suspended 80 games last April after testing positive for a performance-enhancing drug. Garcia will presumably report to Double-A Springfield.

Bullpen issues solved!

Jewish Rabbi · 07-05-2018, 09:45 PM

Weaver going along pretty well right now.

'Hamas' Jenkins · 07-05-2018, 09:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jewish Rabbi

Weaver going along pretty well right now.

Callate!

Frazod · 07-05-2018, 10:22 PM

Wow, 11 runs. They normally don't score that many in a week.

**BigRedChief** · 07-06-2018, 06:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frazod

Wow, 11 runs. They normally don't score that many in a week.

Cueto was throwing 83-89 mph. He needs TJ surgery. Then it was a washed up Holland.

'Hamas' Jenkins · 07-06-2018, 09:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

Cueto was throwing 83-89 mph. He needs TJ surgery. Then it was a washed up Holland.

His average fb velocity has been 91 for years. He had no arm strength because he took two months off and had one rehab start. Dan and McCarver were talking out of their asses.

01-02-2018, 05:51 PM
BigRedChief Has a particular set of skills Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: On the water Casino cash: $2829627 VARSITY	2018 STL Cardinals Thread Opening day lineup Fowler RF Pham CF Carpenter 3B Ozuna LF Martinez 1B Molina C Dejong SS Wong 2B Pitcher Edit: Matheny fired 07/14/2018 Opening Day Roster Spoiler! St. Louis has opted to carry 12 position players and 13 pitchers to begin the new season, with a four-man bench and eight-man bullpen. Outfielders: Dexter Fowler Tommy Pham Marcell Ozuna Infielders: Matt Carpenter Paul DeJong Kolten Wong Catchers: Yadier Molina Francisco Pena Utility: Jose Martinez Greg Garcia Yairo Munoz Jedd Gyrko Starters: Carlos Martinez Michael Wacha Luke Weaver Miles Mikolas Jack Flaherty Relievers: Dominic Leone Tyler Lyons Bud Norris Brett Cecil Sam Tuivailala Matt Bowman Jordan Hicks Mike Mayers On the DL: Adam Wainwright Luke Gregerson Last edited by BigRedChief; 07-17-2018 at 02:21 PM..
Posts: 79,238

07-05-2018, 06:49 AM	#1831
BigRedChief Has a particular set of skills Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: On the water Casino cash: $2829627 VARSITY	I ****ing hate this team. We are going to play .500 ball. Be in the hunt for thew wild card late in the season and nothing changes next season. Other than another wasted season. Cubs beat writer: The bottom line is, the Cardinals were once known as a model organization. But what we’ve seen of late has been a jarring juxtaposition to the St. Louis teams of just a few years ago. The fundamentals on defense and the base paths are gone, and issues that normally should be handled in house are being discussed publicly on a podcast with a current team broadcaster, and by the team’s top baseball executive, no less. St. Louis looks nothing like the franchise it once was. Giancarlo Stanton enacted his no-trade clause and refused to be traded to St. Louis. Jason Heyward took less money to sign with the Cubs. The Cardinals lack any semblance of the franchise Theo Epstein once suggested the Cubs must mimic in order to find sustained success. USA Today Nightengale: PHOENIX - The good folks of St. Louis can feel it. They sense it. And they can certainly see it. Groundhog Day. The Cardinals, one of baseball’s proudest and most prestigious franchises, winners of 11 World Series championships, with 12 playoff berths since 2000, are stuck on the treadmill of mediocrity. They are 43-41 entering the July 4th holiday, nearly closer to the last-place Cincinnati Reds as the first-place Milwaukee Brewers in the NL Central, 6 ½ games out of first place. They are in danger of missing the playoffs for the third consecutive season, for the first time since 1996-99. “That’s embarrassing,’’ says Cardinals outfielder Tommy Pham, one of the Cardinals’ team leaders. “You never want to see something like that happen to this franchise. That’s on us.’’ Or, as Cardinals Nation might tell you, it’s on manager Mike Matheny. Or hitting coach John Mabry. Or club president John Mozeliak. Or owner Bill DeWitt. They want someone to pay for this era of mediocrity. And no one is feeling the heat more than Matheny.“People who tell you they’re used to it,’’ Matheny tells USA TODAY Sports, “are lying. There’s a very small percentage of people in this world that can truly say they don’t care when it comes to stuff like that, and truly mean it. Unfortunately, I’m not in that small percentage. “I’m not in the business of gaining public approval, but to say you’re completely unfazed by it, that’s hard to say.’’ It’s hardly Matheny’s fault his team is littered with guys who can’t field, but can hit. Guys who can hit, but can’t field. __________________ Time is worth more than money.
Posts: 79,238

07-05-2018, 07:24 AM	#1832
Marco Polo Veteran Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: 41°59.4′N 87°39.6'W Casino cash: $5708908	Given that the Orioles are terrible and that pending free agent Manny Machado is the opposite of terrible, it seems highly likely that the star infielder will be moved in advance of the non-waiver trade deadline. Machado in his age-25 season is batting .311/.378/.565 (160 OPS+) with 21 home runs in 83 games. That's on pace to be easily a career year for Machado, and he's also proved himself capable of returning to the shortstop position in 2018. He's going to get paid this coming offseason, and he may wind up fetching a bigger contract than Bryce Harper does. In the here and now, though, Machado is very likely on his way to a contender. Here's what CBS Sports HQ MLB analyst Jim Bowden says about the quickly development market for Machado ... "I've talked to people involved in this over the last 24 hours, and I've talked to teams. Eight teams have confirmed to me that they've had discussions with the Orioles on Machado over the last 10 days. This is heating up. I've also been told, for people that are skeptical if the Angelos family will approve a deal, I've been told they are going to approve a deal. Their intent is to trade the player. When they get the package they like, they will move him." So, yes, Machado is almost certainly going to be traded. At this point, you're no doubt wondering who those eight teams are. Straight from Bowden and CBS Sports HQ, here they are ... Phillies Cardinals Cubs Dodgers Indians Braves Diamondbacks Brewers Some teams would have Machado in mind as a shortstop (the Diamondbacks, for instance), and others would target him for his stronger position of third base (the Indians, for instance, who would then move Jose Ramirez to second base). The Cubs don't really have a clear need for him, as Kris Bryant is entrenched at third and shortstop Addison Russell has been producing at a solid clip this season. As for the heavily hyped Dodgers, Bowden says: "My intel says no, that they're not even close." The Braves and Brewers, meantime, don't like the current asking price. That leaves us with this key takeaway from Bowden: "I look at this and I go Phillies, Cardinals -- probably the frontrunners right now." In terms of production to date, the Phillies' most glaring need is at short. Machado would also be an upgrade at third over Maikel Franco, who himself has been the subject of trade rumors. As for St. Louis, they're already giving Jose Martinez time in the outfield because of his sub-par defense at first base. Installing Machado at third base would allow Matt Carpenter to be the primary first baseman. Whatever the case, expect some clarity on this front soon -- possibly several days in advance of the deadline.
Posts: 2,508

07-05-2018, 07:59 AM	#1833
Pasta Little Brioni Consuming CP souls Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: U.S.A. Casino cash: $3678880	They aren't getting Machado __________________ **Official TFWdemB Trivia Commisioner**
Posts: 68,917

07-05-2018, 09:15 AM	#1835
jd1020 In Search of a Life Join Date: Nov 2010 Casino cash: $7702645	If you honestly believed that Machado would be the key to making the Cardinals a legitimate contender and WS threat and all you had to do was give up a catcher that hasn't proven he can swing a bat at a MLB level, a first baseman with an .850 OPS but struggles to even get on the field because he can't even play first base, and your 3rd best prospect that has yet to crack into the top 100 and you said no to one of the games elite players because you were worried he wouldnt re-sign after the season then you should be fired on the spot. There are pitchers that hit every 5 games that manage to be better at it than Carson Kelly. I don't care how good your defense is, if you can't hit close to respectable you won't be on the field. Last edited by jd1020; 07-05-2018 at 09:20 AM..
Posts: 24,336

07-05-2018, 09:42 AM	#1837
jd1020 In Search of a Life Join Date: Nov 2010 Casino cash: $7702645	3 playoff teams last season changed managers in the offseason. If Machado means the Cardinals keep Matheny then they were never going to fire him.
Posts: 24,336

07-05-2018, 09:47 AM	#1838
Pasta Little Brioni Consuming CP souls Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: U.S.A. Casino cash: $3678880	They aren't a contender WITH Manny this year. No point. Dogshit defense, terrible bullpen. Lineup full of streak, junk ball hitters. __________________ **Official TFWdemB Trivia Commisioner**
Posts: 68,917

07-05-2018, 10:41 AM	#1839
Marco Polo Veteran Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: 41°59.4′N 87°39.6'W Casino cash: $5708908	Cardinals acquired LHP Elniery Garcia from the Phillies for international bonus pool money. Garcia has an ugly 6.38 ERA, 1.91 WHIP, and 29/21 K/BB ratio in 42 1/3 innings (nine starts, one relief appearance) this season at Double-A Reading, but the 23-year-old left-hander put up promising numbers in the lower minors. He was suspended 80 games last April after testing positive for a performance-enhancing drug. Garcia will presumably report to Double-A Springfield.
Posts: 2,508

07-05-2018, 09:45 PM	#1841
Jewish Rabbi What's up braj? Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Placencia, Belize Casino cash: $1808320	Weaver going along pretty well right now.
Posts: 15,663

07-05-2018, 10:22 PM	#1843
Frazod WE ARE THE CHAMPIONS Join Date: Aug 2000 Casino cash: $2815085	Wow, 11 runs. They normally don't score that many in a week.
Posts: 119,532