Chiefs Dorsey: There is no definite first round QB - Page 17

RunKC · 02-16-2013, 05:29 PM

No clear quarterback choice for Chiefs in the draft
By ADAM TEICHER
Kansas City Star
Published Saturday, Feb. 16, 2013, at 3:36 p.m.
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Pros and cons
Matt Barkley, 6-2, 230, USC: Superb leadership skills, the first one at practice or meetings and the last one to leave. But his arm strength is suspect. May be a system fit.

Mike Glennon, 6-7, 220, North Carolina State: Strong arm. He’s easily able to make all the necessary throws. But a lack of mobility could be a problem against a strong pass rush.

Ryan Nassib, 6-2, 225, Syracuse: Good mobility and throws well on the run. But he’s a late-bloomer who might need more seasoning before he’s ready for the NFL.

Geno Smith, 6-3, 210, West Virginia: Has best ability of all the top prospects. Was durable in college, but he’s not an imposing specimen. So how will he hold up in the NFL?

Tyler Wilson, 6-2, 220, Arkansas: Will stand in and take a hit but still make an accurate throw. But he’s short for an ideal NFL quarterback and has small hands, which could lead to fumbling problems.

KANSAS CITY, Mo. — The Chiefs spent the last several days setting their draft board in preparation for this week’s NFL Scouting Combine in Indianapolis. The process merely confirmed for new general manager John Dorsey that when it comes to quarterbacks, their homework is only starting.

Opinions on the top available quarterbacks in this year’s draft are that varied.

“There is no quarterback where personnel guys can definitely say, ‘He’s a first-round pick,’ ” Dorsey said. “There were so many inconsistencies in the collective group. There was not one guy that stood up and said, ‘I’m the guy in the position this year.’ There really wasn’t one clear-cut guy.

“There are too many technical flaws, scheme flaws. There are so many different variables that there are a lot of people all over the place on naming the top four or five guys and who those guys would be.”

The Chiefs aren’t the only team having trouble sorting through the top quarterback prospects. From the natural ability of West Virginia’s Geno Smith to the smooth leadership skills of USC’s Matt Barkley to the willingness to take a hit in the face of a strong pass rush of Arkansas’ Tyler Wilson, there are plenty of things to like.

There are reasons to pause just the same. Smith faltered late last fall against better competition. Barkley and Wilson had disappointing, injury-marred senior seasons.

This is a particular problem for teams like the Chiefs, who have a gaping need at quarterback. Dorsey didn’t say so specifically, but he didn’t sound like the Chiefs were planning to take a quarterback with the first pick in this year’s draft.

More likely, the Chiefs will select a quarterback later in the draft — if they take one at all.

Dorsey said both he and coach Andy Reid would be in attendance at the workouts of most, if not all, of the top available quarterbacks.

“I think Andy is a really good evaluator of quarterbacks,” Dorsey said. “I want him and I to go to as many quarterback workouts as possible and actually set our own up.”

The quarterback rankings for last year’s draft were determined almost a year in advance. Stanford’s Andrew Luck was a consensus choice to be the top player selected as soon as the 2011 draft was finished. Baylor’s Robert Griffin III came on as a senior to win the Heisman Trophy and make the race interesting, but in the end, Luck was selected first by Indianapolis. Griffin was taken with the next pick by Washington.

“Last year was an easy evaluation,” draft analyst Mel Kiper said. “Automatically, you put Andrew Luck and RG III up there.”

This year, quarterback ratings are scattered. Some teams like Smith, but others have different favorites, like Barkley, Wilson, North Carolina State’s Mike Glennon or Syracuse’s Ryan Nassib.

“The year didn’t go the way Barkley and the USC Trojans hoped,” Kiper said. “He began the year number one on my big board. You saw what happened with USC. They lost four games with Barkley at quarterback and lost a couple more when he was hurt. They didn’t have a signature win all year. They dropped down the rankings from number one and he dropped down the rankings from number one.

“Geno Smith started out great. It looked like after Barkley struggled you could lock Geno Smith in. Then he has a disappointing second half of the season, so there are issues in terms of what type of starting quarterback he can be. Glennon was hot for a while even though he had a subpar supporting cast, and he didn’t play great (in the bowl game) against Vanderbilt and didn’t have a wow-you-over Senior Bowl week.

“Things didn’t fall into place at Arkansas, and that affected Tyler Wilson. The wheels came off for all the quarterbacks at some point (last) year. Things just didn’t fall right to allow them to maximize their ability. That’s why the teams are right now in the predicament they are, trying to figure this whole quarterback thing out and not overdraft or push a guy up when he’s not deserving.”

Kiper doesn’t have a quarterback rated among his top 25 players. In fact, in his latest mock draft, Kiper doesn’t have a single quarterback being selected in the first round.

“It’s just a tough evaluation, trying to figure out which quarterbacks in this draft, if any, will be great starting quarterbacks,” he said.

Dorsey said he expects at least two quarterbacks to be drafted in the first round because so many teams have a need. It’s a matter, though, of which ones.

Things could solidify in the next couple of months. The draft doesn’t begin until April 25. Meanwhile, the combine begins this week, followed by pro days on college campuses and then individual workouts.

To Dorsey, at least, personal interviews might be the most important part of the postseason draft process. He said a quarterback can improve his draft standing with a series of strong interviews.

“The most impressive interview I’ve ever had in the last 25 years of doing this? Russell Wilson,” said Dorsey, referring to the quarterback drafted by Seattle last year in the third round. “Wasn’t even close. You could feel that guy as a person, how strong he was, how intellectually deep he was, how mentally tough he was, that he had the charisma to lead other players. I always try to look at kids like I’m in the locker room and I’m a teammate. It was easy to see this guy leading a team.

“A quarterback wants to come across in the interview process as confident, as having a vast understanding and knowledge of defenses, as being capable of leading a group of men. That’s what you’ve got to convey to the teams. On film, his physical traits and skills will come out. But you have to over the next few weeks impress on teams the character of his soul, his ability to lead a franchise.”

Read more here: http://www.kansas.com/2013/02/16/267...#storylink=cpy

tk13 · 02-16-2013, 07:22 PM

I guess I'm not surprised by this. I put little stock into Kiper and even less into McShay... but I do think these guys are ripping the QB class because they're all hearing terrible things from scouts/personnel people. I don't think it's entirely their own opinion.

The big difference between these guys and Pioli is they've 1) always put a high importance on the QB position and 2) have never been afraid to take one high in the draft. I feel confident that if they pass at 1, it'll be because they truly do not like anyone at that pick, and not some misguided ego trip to prove they're football geniuses.

But I've been wrong before. And the reality is there are questions about this class. But there will also be at least one or two guys who end up being underrated and have success. A Dalton, Kaepernick, Brees, Wilson, Rodgers... etc.

Unsmooth-Moment · 02-16-2013, 07:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoWalrus

How is that different than any QB?

It's not.

I agree to an extent.

If you have less invested in a QB today, you would think you are more likely to be aggressive in the upcoming offseason if said QB is not playing at the level you require (unless you are pioli).

htismaqe · 02-16-2013, 07:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city

Chiefs haven't picked a Qb in the first round in 30 years. Geno is arguably the best QB in a class where we have the first overall pick. Some here think Geno is an extremely skilled passer with the ability to be a franchise QB.

Can you really blame them?

I'm not 100% on QBs. I liked Sanchez but was concerned about his lack of experience. I didn't like Tannehill, again because of the experience factor.

That being said, I thought Matt Ryan was a game manager and said he'd never win a Super Bowl. I said Jay Cutler was a loser mentally and would never win in Denver - he didn't win a single playoff game there.

I've been right more often than wrong about QBs. There's guys here that are much better at this than me but I do watch a TON of football.

I'm absolutely CONVINCED that Geno has what it takes to be a solid NFL starter with championship upside.

**RealSNR** · 02-16-2013, 07:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by htismaqe

Evaluate. Look. Study.

Those were his first three words.

Well, guess what?

I've done that. I watched over 200 college football games this past season and I've watched dozens more since then. I've evaluated pretty much every one of the top 10 or so QBs in this draft.

And I've come to the conclusion, after MUCH EVALUATION, MUCH LOOKING, and MUCH STUDY that anybody that says this is a bad QB class hasn't done their homework.

No "fanboy bullshit" about it.

I think I know HCF's response.

"Where's your NFL team if you're so smart?"

A bag of doughnuts says I'm right.

Unsmooth-Moment · 02-16-2013, 07:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tk13

I guess I'm not surprised by this. I put little stock into Kiper and even less into McShay... but I do think these guys are ripping the QB class because they're all hearing terrible things from scouts/personnel people. I don't think it's entirely their own opinion.

The big difference between these guys and ***** is they've 1) always put a high importance on the QB position and 2) have never been afraid to take one high in the draft. I feel confident that if they pass at 1, it'll be because they truly do not like anyone at that pick, and not some misguided ego trip to prove they're football geniuses.

But I've been wrong before. And the reality is there are questions about this class. But there will also be at least one or two guys who end up being underrated and have success. A Dalton, Kaepernick, Brees, Wilson, Rodgers... etc.

I agree with everything you said.

|Zach| · 02-16-2013, 07:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 58-4ever

You're so cool with your stats.

http://www.businessinsider.com/faceb...clining-2012-9

We can both cite different things and it will be a while before it plays out..

Honestly I am just proud of you that you didn't put your head in the sand.

This does not even begin to show anything dying...more than a year after your 6 month prediction. Grasp at some more straws but know I am giving you a high five for trying.

Nightfyre · 02-16-2013, 07:24 PM

All I know is that I did not sit through every ****ing game this year, hoping for a loss, just so we could trade for a trashy QB from another team. Foles was trash in Arizona and he was trash in Philly. Draft Geno Smith number one. If Foles is starting, there is no reason to even watch because the season will be over before it starts and it will be clear that this administration is clueless.

O.city · 02-16-2013, 07:25 PM

Foles wasnt' trash. He showed some upside. He wasn't great, but he wasn't trash at all.

RunKC · 02-16-2013, 07:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city

Reid gave Michael Vick 100 million dollars. It's not like his past record is spotless a the position.

Sorry man, but like Hamas just said, we can go back to 09 and find a post exactly like this.

Scott ***** helped find the best QB ever in the 6th round, etc.

People have this grand illusion that Trent Green was this great QB here. He was good, no doubt. They conveniently forget that with him, we made the playoffs 1 time.

Trent led the greatest offense this franchise has ever seen. We were a top 5 offense 4 years in a row. 2 of those years, we were statistically the BEST.

In that time, our defense was 25th or worse. 2 of those years, they were last and second last.

Blaming Trent for those failures is ****ing stupid. If you're going to point the finger at anyone, point it at King Carl and Dick Vermeil for not making our defense worth a shit.

It takes more than a good QB to win. I thought this was understood?

HonestChieffan · 02-16-2013, 07:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by htismaqe

Evaluate. Look. Study.

Those were his first three words.

Well, guess what?

I've done that. I watched over 200 college football games this past season and I've watched dozens more since then. I've evaluated pretty much every one of the top 10 or so QBs in this draft.

And I've come to the conclusion, after MUCH EVALUATION, MUCH LOOKING, and MUCH STUDY that anybody that says this is a bad QB class hasn't done their homework.

No "fanboy bullshit" about it.

If i read what has been said by a number of people is that there is no stanout number one. And this years draft class does not have the quality last year had. No one is saying its a bad class. Its just not a standout easy pick. Thats why people see opportunities to do more than just take a QB with the number 1 pick. The Geno or die mantra is the fanboy emotional point. We need a quality Qb. We have zero in what we have. We will have better this season. Geno? Maybe. But he is not good enough to make it an easy pick. Intangables will factor big time. The difference between the top 3 or 5 QBs is not enough to make any one an easy pick

|Zach| · 02-16-2013, 07:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nightfyre

All I know is that I did not sit through every ****ing game this year, hoping for a loss,

Sucks to be you?

O.city · 02-16-2013, 07:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RunKC

Trent led the greatest offense this franchise has ever seen. We were a top 5 offense 4 years in a row. 2 of those years, we were statistically the BEST.

In that time, our defense was 25th or worse. 2 of those years, they were last and second last.

Blaming Trent for those failures is ****ing stupid. If you're going to point the finger at anyone, point it at King Carl and Dick Vermeil for not making our defense worth a shit.

It takes more than a good QB to win. I thought this was understood?

Nope, this argument doesn't work. You specifically told us it didn't work when talking about Geno and his defenses. So get out with that bullshit.

Yes, Green was a good QB. I'm not arguing against that. But facts are facts. We made the playoffs once. You yourself told us that the QB should be able to carry said defense if he's that good.

So which is it?

O.city · 02-16-2013, 07:29 PM

Looks like we have another "this QB class isn't great, lets wait and not take the best one, but take the 5 or 6 best".

tk13 · 02-16-2013, 07:31 PM

Anybody who makes an argument blaming any offensive player from the Vermeil-era for lack of playoff success should be locked in a closet and never allowed to participate in football discussion ever again. It seems like someone makes a comment along those lines every other week anymore.

|Zach| · 02-16-2013, 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tk13

Anybody who makes an argument blaming any offensive player from the Vermeil-era for lack of playoff success should be locked in a closet and never allowed to participate in football discussion ever again. It seems like someone makes a comment along those lines every other week anymore.

So shitty. We didn't even need a great defense...just an average one. Ugh.

02-16-2013, 05:29 PM
RunKC Andy Reid Supporter Join Date: Apr 2012 Casino cash: $1989611	Dorsey: There is no definite first round QB No clear quarterback choice for Chiefs in the draft By ADAM TEICHER Kansas City Star Published Saturday, Feb. 16, 2013, at 3:36 p.m. 0 CommentsEmailPrintReprints Pros and cons Matt Barkley, 6-2, 230, USC: Superb leadership skills, the first one at practice or meetings and the last one to leave. But his arm strength is suspect. May be a system fit. Mike Glennon, 6-7, 220, North Carolina State: Strong arm. He’s easily able to make all the necessary throws. But a lack of mobility could be a problem against a strong pass rush. Ryan Nassib, 6-2, 225, Syracuse: Good mobility and throws well on the run. But he’s a late-bloomer who might need more seasoning before he’s ready for the NFL. Geno Smith, 6-3, 210, West Virginia: Has best ability of all the top prospects. Was durable in college, but he’s not an imposing specimen. So how will he hold up in the NFL? Tyler Wilson, 6-2, 220, Arkansas: Will stand in and take a hit but still make an accurate throw. But he’s short for an ideal NFL quarterback and has small hands, which could lead to fumbling problems. KANSAS CITY, Mo. — The Chiefs spent the last several days setting their draft board in preparation for this week’s NFL Scouting Combine in Indianapolis. The process merely confirmed for new general manager John Dorsey that when it comes to quarterbacks, their homework is only starting. Opinions on the top available quarterbacks in this year’s draft are that varied. “There is no quarterback where personnel guys can definitely say, ‘He’s a first-round pick,’ ” Dorsey said. “There were so many inconsistencies in the collective group. There was not one guy that stood up and said, ‘I’m the guy in the position this year.’ There really wasn’t one clear-cut guy. “There are too many technical flaws, scheme flaws. There are so many different variables that there are a lot of people all over the place on naming the top four or five guys and who those guys would be.” The Chiefs aren’t the only team having trouble sorting through the top quarterback prospects. From the natural ability of West Virginia’s Geno Smith to the smooth leadership skills of USC’s Matt Barkley to the willingness to take a hit in the face of a strong pass rush of Arkansas’ Tyler Wilson, there are plenty of things to like. There are reasons to pause just the same. Smith faltered late last fall against better competition. Barkley and Wilson had disappointing, injury-marred senior seasons. This is a particular problem for teams like the Chiefs, who have a gaping need at quarterback. Dorsey didn’t say so specifically, but he didn’t sound like the Chiefs were planning to take a quarterback with the first pick in this year’s draft. More likely, the Chiefs will select a quarterback later in the draft — if they take one at all. Dorsey said both he and coach Andy Reid would be in attendance at the workouts of most, if not all, of the top available quarterbacks. “I think Andy is a really good evaluator of quarterbacks,” Dorsey said. “I want him and I to go to as many quarterback workouts as possible and actually set our own up.” The quarterback rankings for last year’s draft were determined almost a year in advance. Stanford’s Andrew Luck was a consensus choice to be the top player selected as soon as the 2011 draft was finished. Baylor’s Robert Griffin III came on as a senior to win the Heisman Trophy and make the race interesting, but in the end, Luck was selected first by Indianapolis. Griffin was taken with the next pick by Washington. “Last year was an easy evaluation,” draft analyst Mel Kiper said. “Automatically, you put Andrew Luck and RG III up there.” This year, quarterback ratings are scattered. Some teams like Smith, but others have different favorites, like Barkley, Wilson, North Carolina State’s Mike Glennon or Syracuse’s Ryan Nassib. “The year didn’t go the way Barkley and the USC Trojans hoped,” Kiper said. “He began the year number one on my big board. You saw what happened with USC. They lost four games with Barkley at quarterback and lost a couple more when he was hurt. They didn’t have a signature win all year. They dropped down the rankings from number one and he dropped down the rankings from number one. “Geno Smith started out great. It looked like after Barkley struggled you could lock Geno Smith in. Then he has a disappointing second half of the season, so there are issues in terms of what type of starting quarterback he can be. Glennon was hot for a while even though he had a subpar supporting cast, and he didn’t play great (in the bowl game) against Vanderbilt and didn’t have a wow-you-over Senior Bowl week. “Things didn’t fall into place at Arkansas, and that affected Tyler Wilson. The wheels came off for all the quarterbacks at some point (last) year. Things just didn’t fall right to allow them to maximize their ability. That’s why the teams are right now in the predicament they are, trying to figure this whole quarterback thing out and not overdraft or push a guy up when he’s not deserving.” Kiper doesn’t have a quarterback rated among his top 25 players. In fact, in his latest mock draft, Kiper doesn’t have a single quarterback being selected in the first round. “It’s just a tough evaluation, trying to figure out which quarterbacks in this draft, if any, will be great starting quarterbacks,” he said. Dorsey said he expects at least two quarterbacks to be drafted in the first round because so many teams have a need. It’s a matter, though, of which ones. Things could solidify in the next couple of months. The draft doesn’t begin until April 25. Meanwhile, the combine begins this week, followed by pro days on college campuses and then individual workouts. To Dorsey, at least, personal interviews might be the most important part of the postseason draft process. He said a quarterback can improve his draft standing with a series of strong interviews. “The most impressive interview I’ve ever had in the last 25 years of doing this? Russell Wilson,” said Dorsey, referring to the quarterback drafted by Seattle last year in the third round. “Wasn’t even close. You could feel that guy as a person, how strong he was, how intellectually deep he was, how mentally tough he was, that he had the charisma to lead other players. I always try to look at kids like I’m in the locker room and I’m a teammate. It was easy to see this guy leading a team. “A quarterback wants to come across in the interview process as confident, as having a vast understanding and knowledge of defenses, as being capable of leading a group of men. That’s what you’ve got to convey to the teams. On film, his physical traits and skills will come out. But you have to over the next few weeks impress on teams the character of his soul, his ability to lead a franchise.” Read more here: http://www.kansas.com/2013/02/16/267...#storylink=cpy
Posts: 46,298

02-16-2013, 07:22 PM	#241
tk13 ... Join Date: Nov 2001 Casino cash: $1732500	I guess I'm not surprised by this. I put little stock into Kiper and even less into McShay... but I do think these guys are ripping the QB class because they're all hearing terrible things from scouts/personnel people. I don't think it's entirely their own opinion. The big difference between these guys and Pioli is they've 1) always put a high importance on the QB position and 2) have never been afraid to take one high in the draft. I feel confident that if they pass at 1, it'll be because they truly do not like anyone at that pick, and not some misguided ego trip to prove they're football geniuses. But I've been wrong before. And the reality is there are questions about this class. But there will also be at least one or two guys who end up being underrated and have success. A Dalton, Kaepernick, Brees, Wilson, Rodgers... etc.
Posts: 54,991

02-16-2013, 07:24 PM	#247
Nightfyre MVP Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Helena, MT Casino cash: $3408849	All I know is that I did not sit through every ****ing game this year, hoping for a loss, just so we could trade for a trashy QB from another team. Foles was trash in Arizona and he was trash in Philly. Draft Geno Smith number one. If Foles is starting, there is no reason to even watch because the season will be over before it starts and it will be clear that this administration is clueless.
Posts: 18,567

02-16-2013, 07:25 PM	#248
O.city In Search of a Life Join Date: Jul 2009 Casino cash: $2504064	Foles wasnt' trash. He showed some upside. He wasn't great, but he wasn't trash at all.
Posts: 81,434

02-16-2013, 07:29 PM	#253
O.city In Search of a Life Join Date: Jul 2009 Casino cash: $2504064	Looks like we have another "this QB class isn't great, lets wait and not take the best one, but take the 5 or 6 best".
Posts: 81,434

02-16-2013, 07:31 PM	#254
tk13 ... Join Date: Nov 2001 Casino cash: $1732500	Anybody who makes an argument blaming any offensive player from the Vermeil-era for lack of playoff success should be locked in a closet and never allowed to participate in football discussion ever again. It seems like someone makes a comment along those lines every other week anymore.
Posts: 54,991