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Old 10-07-2013, 03:57 PM  
Deberg_1990 Deberg_1990 is offline
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Romo/Rivers/Cutler..career losers or franchise QBs?
Whats your take on these guys? Would these guys be 5-0 on the Chiefs.....or do they make too many mistakes and turnovers in critical situations? Sure, they put up great "box scores" , but so did Jeff George......
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Old 12-16-2013, 07:25 PM   #256
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As another poster said, Franchise QBs are titles given past tense after some notable accomplishments, like the number of post-season appearances and championship games.
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Old 12-16-2013, 07:52 PM   #257
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Sure, I can accept that. Reid would probably make some kind of tangible difference there, as would a better DC. But we're still talking about what very well may be the worst defense in the NFL. They're not going to be a playoff team unless the personnel changes in that area.


It isn't, though. They've only made the playoffs on 3 occasions as it is under Romo and only one of those times was their team even particularly good at all (and that was when they actually had a defense to go with their offense in 2009). He's actually played OK in his 4 playoff games too, the Cowboys have just been beat by better teams than them.



2006: 4th in points scored, 20th in points allowed.
2007: 2nd in points scored, 13th in points allowed.
2008: 18th in points scored, 20th in points allowed
2009: 14th in points scored, 2nd in points allowed.
2010: 7th in points scored, 32nd in points allowed.
2011: 15th in points scored, 16th in points allowed.
2012: 15th in points scored, 24th in points allowed.
2013: 4th in points scored, 26th in points allowed.

Just take a look at that. Take a look at how much they've relied on their offense (and good QB play) just to stay mediocre in this league. Anybody who pins the Cowboys' failures (and lack of playoff success) on Romo and his offense really has no idea what they're talking about. Despite the endless hype, the team itself is just not that good and never has been. That mostly goes on their bad defense, not the few times that you selectively remember Romo throwing an interception in a close game.
Of course they would be better. I doubt Reid would have brought an outdated d-coordinator to run his outdated scheme. They were 19th in D last year with basically the same players.

Once again look at his playoff stats. He is averaging 173 yds and 1 TD in his 4 playoff games and his record is 1-3. That isn't very good for a QB that you state has carried his team. That is downright pathetic actually.

I will add though once again that I don't put all the blame on Romo for the Cowboys failure, most of it goes to Jerry Jones. But he would be one of the last QB's I would pick to be my guy, as Hamas stated "I've never seen a quarterback with an ability to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory quite like him."
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Old 12-16-2013, 07:53 PM   #258
dirk digler dirk digler is offline
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I'm not sure there's one thing Eli Manning is better than Tony Romo at in terms of QB play. Other than being in the right place at the right time on the right team, I guess.

Romo has played for plenty of bad teams in his career, but never had anything like the lows of Eli.
He wins big games something Romo never does.

Seriously is there another franchise or even very good QB that throws 2 INT's in the last 3 minutes to lose a game they were up by 20+ pts?
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Old 12-16-2013, 07:56 PM   #259
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Eli is a game manager - LOL

What can't Eli do - Win a championship game?

Do you know whom he had to beat to get there?

Do you know how many big plays Eli has made in his career?

How many big hits has he taken without getting hurt?

Before this year, Eli has ranked #1 in clutch quarterbacks in the past decade.

You do know that the Giants do not have a running game this year or an offensive line - None.

How was Tom Brady last night without Gronk?

You do not have an offensive line in the NFL you lose.

Yeah, Eli is a game manager all right.

F joke!
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Old 12-16-2013, 07:59 PM   #260
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Tony Romo . It's more than obvious at this point in time. The guy is a talented QB. But he's a big time choker.
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Old 12-16-2013, 07:59 PM   #261
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That doesn't mean your perception (however you formed it) is reality in this case. The facts suggest it isn't. Many falsely believed that LeBron was a choker too because his Cavs lost to elite Spurs and Celtics teams in the NBA playoffs. Didn't make it true.
The guy has been there for what, seven years? I just don't see how it can always be someone else/some other units fault for that long of a span... yes, they've had injuries this year, adjusting to a new (outdated) defensive scheme etc.

But he's also been on some extremely talented and healthy teams and still managed to not get it done, still made the crucial mistakes... we'll just have to disagree about the guy, don't take it personally.
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Old 12-16-2013, 11:57 PM   #262
KC_Connection KC_Connection is offline
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Romo vs. Eli - Least surprising post, ever [coming from you].

Lows?

I take it you consider yourself reasonable, KC Connection? Are you being totally unbiased in that assessment?

Clearly, you need to leave argumentation to those with more than half a wit.
Yes, completely unbiased. I have no dog in this fight. I couldn't give 2 shits about the Cowboys or Giants. I'm just telling you what these two QBs are. And no, I'm not surprised that opinion would upset a Giants fan (who would be admittedly biased in this regard).
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Old 12-17-2013, 12:04 AM   #263
KC_Connection KC_Connection is offline
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Once again look at his playoff stats. He is averaging 173 yds and 1 TD in his 4 playoff games and his record is 1-3. That isn't very good for a QB that you state has carried his team. That is downright pathetic actually.
Romo has a 59.26% completion percentage, 4 TDs, 2 INTs, and a 80.8 passer rating in the playoffs. For reference, Brady's completion percentage in the playoffs for reference is 62.34%, his TD total is 42, his INT total is 22, and his passer rating is 87.4. So no, while not himself, it's not like Romo was completely abysmal in those 4 games. He was OK...at least if Tom Brady is your standard for good QB play in the playoffs.

We're still talking about an incredibly small sample size of 4 games in any case. Not enough to adequately judge anybody on anything. The losses themselves, though, can mostly be put on the fact that none of those Cowboys teams were particularly good.

Quote:
He wins big games something Romo never does.
Might have something to do with the fact that he's actually played in many of them with the benefit of a good/great team behind him instead of a rare few with a bad one.
Quote:
Seriously is there another franchise or even very good QB that throws 2 INT's in the last 3 minutes to lose a game they were up by 20+ pts?
The better question is whether there are any other franchise/very good QBs that play on a team with a defense that would blow that kind of 2nd half lead and allow 37 points to a Flynn-led Packers team.
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Old 12-17-2013, 12:07 AM   #264
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The guy has been there for what, seven years? I just don't see how it can always be someone else/some other units fault for that long of a span... yes, they've had injuries this year, adjusting to a new (outdated) defensive scheme etc.
Did you miss the offense/defense stats? You don't see how having a consistently bad defense over that entire period could cause a team to be bad?
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Old 12-17-2013, 03:36 AM   #265
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Yes, Romo is the front man (him and JJ) for the joke that is the Dallas Cowboys organization so he takes all the shit from the media. In reality, though, Romo's the least of their problems.
For all your bitching about the Cowboys organization, Dallas has only had two losing seasons since Parcells signed on in 2003. Romo was shitting himself even when Parcells was running things, so stop acting as if the problem is the Cowboys. Romo's problem is Romo.
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Old 12-17-2013, 06:25 AM   #266
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Here in Texas Monty Kiffin has taken alot of the heat off of Romo. They want Monty's head on a platter.
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Old 12-17-2013, 07:02 AM   #267
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I know he has his moments.....but overall I like Romo. Their defense is on pace to being one of the worst in NFL history. Without Romo the Cowboys would be playing for the first pick in the draft every year.
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Old 12-17-2013, 07:13 AM   #268
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Rivers has been on some bad teams since their window has closed. They're no longer the class of the division and players have gone elsewhere, retired, gotten off roids etc, him and Gates have pretty much had to do it by themselves. I believe he's a good QB.

Cutler just sucks. Has the physical tools, he's just not that good. Though he's been shuffled around from OC to OC etc. Obviously that doesn't help at all. But he has always been horribly inconsistent.

Tony Romo is a good QB. He just chokes in big time situations. Every sport has these kinda guys. He's the NFL version. It's that simple. Dallas won't ever do anything big because of it.
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Old 12-17-2013, 09:31 AM   #269
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If I were to do a quick grouping of the QBs... here's how I might stack them:

(no order of preference, just listing them)

Group 1
Peyton Manning
Tom Brady
Drew Brees
Aaron Rodgers

Group 2
Eli Manning
Joe Flacco
Ben Roethlisberger

Group 3
Phillip Rivers
Matthew Stafford
Matt Ryan
Tony Romo
Jay Cutler

Too early to slot, but float in the 2/3 range...
Andrew Luck
Andy Dalton
Russell Wilson
Cam Newton
Colin Kaepernick


Not sure what to do with them...
Alex Smith
Ryan Tannehill
RGIII
Nick Foles

I don't think I have a glaring omission, but this is where I would slot them based on what I've seen.
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Old 12-17-2013, 09:48 AM   #270
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If I were to do a quick grouping of the QBs... here's how I might stack them:

(no order of preference, just listing them)

Group 1
Peyton Manning
Tom Brady
Drew Brees
Aaron Rodgers

Group 2
Eli Manning
Joe Flacco
Ben Roethlisberger

Group 3
Phillip Rivers
Matthew Stafford
Matt Ryan
Tony Romo
Jay Cutler

Too early to slot, but float in the 2/3 range...
Andrew Luck
Andy Dalton
Russell Wilson
Cam Newton
Colin Kaepernick


Not sure what to do with them...
Alex Smith
Ryan Tannehill
RGIII
Nick Foles

I don't think I have a glaring omission, but this is where I would slot them based on what I've seen.
I'd put Rivers in a group by himself right now. He's somewhere behind group 1 and ahead of everyone else.
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