Chiefs Was Herm Edwards a good PR choice for the Chiefs? - Page 2

Wile_E_Coyote · 04-30-2008, 11:24 AM

I know it's not easy, but set aside Herm's game day management. For a franchise that needs to rebuild & will be getting little to no media attention (people love a winner). Is Herm Edwards good for the Chiefs PR wise?

The media seems to love him.

Or is media attention over rated? Players come for the paycheck.

Let us wallow in this rebuild in solitude.

DV brought alot of attention KC's way

StcChief · 04-30-2008, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by J Diddy

dude slow down...

we just won the draft
what more could you want?

PR man... I didn't say SB after 2008.

still works for media/NFL for Herm to be here.

Sure-Oz · 04-30-2008, 12:51 PM

Herm can talk with the best of them, i like him as a person, but he needs to improve on the coaching/winning part

DT58HOF · 04-30-2008, 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

Not to be argumentative (though, I guess I am), do you think that someone else could have coached the Chiefs to a 9-7 record in 2006, given the loss of Trent Green (and no serious replacement) and Willie Roaf (with no serious replacement)?

well he did it so i would say yeah probably many other guys.
Are you saying his coaching got us 9 wins and his coaching made the Donks choke?

Hoover · 04-30-2008, 01:04 PM

The grass is always greener on the other side.

The more taleted we are the less a poor coaching decision is going to hurt us.

FAX · 04-30-2008, 01:09 PM

As an anti-Herm, I view his "PR skills" as overrated as well. Frankly, the most entertaining and interesting aspect of his public statements are the new words he devises to explain something that didn't make sense to begin with. Nevertheless, he's very quotable and the media loves that.

The only (and I mean "only") thing that Herm seems to do well is scout talent. I have no idea if he can develop the players he finds, nor do I know if he can put them in a position to win. Were I selecting a coach, those are two critical skills I would look for.

FAX

Chief Chief · 04-30-2008, 01:14 PM

Overall, PR skills shouldn't count as much as on-the-field qualities when evaluating a coach.

For example, even with a number of incidents on the record, look how long Indiana U. hung onto Bobby Knight.

As someone would say, "At the end of the day, it's OK."

Zouk · 04-30-2008, 01:15 PM

When it comes right down to it, you'll usually find that most of the criticisms of Herm's game day decisions boil down to people thinking he should have exposed Jordan Black to Dwight Freeney more in Indy.

**DaneMcCloud** · 04-30-2008, 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DT58HOF

well he did it so i would say yeah probably many other guys.
Are you saying his coaching got us 9 wins and his coaching made the Donks choke?

Nope, I'm not saying that at all.

Dick Vermeil (who is worshipped by so many around here) had Willie Roaf and a healthy Trent Green (and a complete team that was one year younger), yet he was only able to coax one more win out of essentially the same squad (plus he had Saunders, not Solari).

While I wouldn't put Herm in the category of some of the great coaches (Belichick, Walsh, Johnson, Lombardi, Noll, Gibbs, Parcells) and maybe not in the same category as the very good (Reid, Holmgren, etc.), I think that if Herm has a healthy, talented squad, he's going to win a minimum of 9 games per year.

His drafts have been successful. Let's see how this team shapes up before calling him a poor coach. Keep in mind that he was essentially forced into playing veterans AND forced into retaining Vermeil's offensive staff.

If you watch ANY team as closely as the Chiefs faithful watch theirs, you're bound to see mistakes by coaching staffs galore (save for the aforementioned Belichick).

Why do you think there's so much coaching turnover in the NFL?

raybec 4 · 04-30-2008, 01:39 PM

I personally feel that like any other coach Herm has his strengths and weaknesses. He is VERY media friendly, but that is more of a good thing for him than it is the team/organization. I wonder if he were capable of winning games as acoach if he would feel the need to be such a PR guy.

FAX · 04-30-2008, 02:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

... While I wouldn't put Herm in the category of some of the great coaches (Belichick, Walsh, Johnson, Lombardi, Noll, Gibbs, Parcells) and maybe not in the same category as the very good (Reid, Holmgren, etc.), I think that if Herm has a healthy, talented squad, he's going to win a minimum of 9 games per year ....

Thank you for visiting us from the planet Whathehell. Welcome to Earth.

On this planet, any (if not all) NFL-level coach can get you a batch of wins with a "healthy, talented squad". It's what you do when you don't have all the players you want or need that determines your skill as a coach. We Earthlings have yet to see Herm demonstrate the ability to win consistently, let alone develop players, make sound game-day decisions, and/or gameplan the enemy coach to his advantage.

FAX

**DaneMcCloud** · 04-30-2008, 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FAX

Thank you for visiting us from the planet Whathehell. Welcome to Earth.

On this planet, any (if not all) NFL-level coach can get you a batch of wins with a "healthy, talented squad". It's what you do when you don't have all the players you want or need that determines your skill as a coach. We Earthlings have yet to see Herm demonstrate the ability to win consistently, let alone develop players, make sound game-day decisions, and/or gameplan the enemy coach to his advantage.

FAX

Really? ANY?

Dave McGinnis and Buddy Ryan in Arizona couldn't, Chan Gailey in Dallas couldn't, George Siefert in Carolina couldn't, Bobby Ross in Detroit couldn't, Jimmy Johnson in Miami couldn't, Marty Schottenheimer in San Diego couldn't (not consistently), Dennis Erickson in Seattle or San Fran couldn't, Ray Rhodes in Green Bay couldn't, Dom Capers in Carolina or Houston couldn't - need I go on? Pete Carroll? Eric Mangini (10-6 to 4-12 - that isn't coaching?)?

I just don't BUY the idea that if a coach is given a fairly talented team, the team is an automatic winner. And I can provide more examples if necessary.

Reerun_KC · 04-30-2008, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

I just don't BUY the idea that if a coach is given a fairly talented team, the team is an automatic winner. And I can provide more examples if necessary.

This is so true!

Give Herm the Pats during their SB Runs and they never make to one let alone many AFC Championships and SB's...

You hit the nail on the head, You can have all the talent in the world, but when your outdated broke down philsophy is all you can manage the game with, You will make All Madden teams look like the 2007 KC Chiefs.

Hammock Parties · 04-30-2008, 04:28 PM

Honestly, PR had little to do with it.

FAX · 04-30-2008, 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

Really? ANY?

Dave McGinnis and Buddy Ryan in Arizona couldn't, Chan Gailey in Dallas couldn't, George Siefert in Carolina couldn't, Bobby Ross in Detroit couldn't, Jimmy Johnson in Miami couldn't, Marty Schottenheimer in San Diego couldn't (not consistently), Dennis Erickson in Seattle or San Fran couldn't, Ray Rhodes in Green Bay couldn't, Dom Capers in Carolina or Houston couldn't - need I go on? Pete Carroll? Eric Mangini (10-6 to 4-12 - that isn't coaching?)?

I just don't BUY the idea that if a coach is given a fairly talented team, the team is an automatic winner. And I can provide more examples if necessary.

Klatu verata niktu!!!

I assumed from your strange alien speech that, when you said "healthy and talented", you actually meant "healthy and talented". I now understand that you intended to mean "fairly talented". As you know, Mr. DaneMcCloud, the problem with these discussions is that they devolve into arguments about what "talented" means, so I shall defer. Nevertheless, given the "fairly talented" criteria we are now working with, until Hermoine can demonstrate that he can win consistently (or at least compete) with a "fairly talented" team, I still cannot in good conscience agree that he is an effective NFL-caliber coach.

FAX

**DaneMcCloud** · 04-30-2008, 04:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FAX

Klatu verata niktu!!!

I assumed from your strange alien speech that, when you said "healthy and talented", you actually meant "healthy and talented". I now understand that you intended to mean "fairly talented". As you know, Mr. DaneMcCloud, the problem with these discussions is that they devolve into arguments about what "talented" means, so I shall defer. Nevertheless, given the "fairly talented" criteria we are now working with, until Hermoine can demonstrate that he can win consistently (or at least compete) with a "fairly talented" team, I still cannot in good conscience agree that he is an effective NFL-caliber coach.

FAX

Fair enough

04-30-2008, 11:24 AM
Wile_E_Coyote avatar down for remodel Join Date: Jul 2001 Casino cash: $10004900	Was Herm Edwards a good PR choice for the Chiefs? I know it's not easy, but set aside Herm's game day management. For a franchise that needs to rebuild & will be getting little to no media attention (people love a winner). Is Herm Edwards good for the Chiefs PR wise? The media seems to love him. Or is media attention over rated? Players come for the paycheck. Let us wallow in this rebuild in solitude. DV brought alot of attention KC's way
Posts: 6,009

04-30-2008, 12:51 PM	#17
Sure-Oz Stay positive, don't give up Join Date: Dec 2001 Casino cash: $3169383	Herm can talk with the best of them, i like him as a person, but he needs to improve on the coaching/winning part
Posts: 46,189

04-30-2008, 01:04 PM	#19
Hoover Rufus Dawes Jr. Join Date: Aug 2000 Casino cash: $1218179	The grass is always greener on the other side. The more taleted we are the less a poor coaching decision is going to hurt us.
Posts: 17,395

04-30-2008, 01:09 PM	#20
FAX testing ... 1, 2, 3 Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Tennessee Casino cash: $6753759	As an anti-Herm, I view his "PR skills" as overrated as well. Frankly, the most entertaining and interesting aspect of his public statements are the new words he devises to explain something that didn't make sense to begin with. Nevertheless, he's very quotable and the media loves that. The only (and I mean "only") thing that Herm seems to do well is scout talent. I have no idea if he can develop the players he finds, nor do I know if he can put them in a position to win. Were I selecting a coach, those are two critical skills I would look for. FAX
Posts: 44,492

04-30-2008, 01:14 PM	#21
Chief Chief Veteran Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Kansas City MO Casino cash: $10004900	Overall, PR skills shouldn't count as much as on-the-field qualities when evaluating a coach. For example, even with a number of incidents on the record, look how long Indiana U. hung onto Bobby Knight. As someone would say, "At the end of the day, it's OK."
Posts: 3,072

04-30-2008, 01:15 PM	#22
Zouk Veteran Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: DC Casino cash: $10004900	When it comes right down to it, you'll usually find that most of the criticisms of Herm's game day decisions boil down to people thinking he should have exposed Jordan Black to Dwight Freeney more in Indy.
Posts: 1,454

04-30-2008, 01:39 PM	#24
raybec 4 MVP Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: East Jabip Casino cash: $4953807	I personally feel that like any other coach Herm has his strengths and weaknesses. He is VERY media friendly, but that is more of a good thing for him than it is the team/organization. I wonder if he were capable of winning games as acoach if he would feel the need to be such a PR guy.
Posts: 10,938

04-30-2008, 04:28 PM	#28
Hammock Parties I'll be back. Join Date: Nov 2002 Casino cash: $4210478	Honestly, PR had little to do with it. __________________ Chiefs game films
Posts: 279,486