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Old 01-24-2010, 05:22 PM  
milkman milkman is offline
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Joe Montana is still the greatest ever....
....and nothing that Peyton Manning does will ever change that.
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Old 01-25-2010, 09:27 PM   #316
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Originally Posted by Tuckdaddy View Post
I agree. He's at that point where saying so and so was actually better is just not reality. To me nobody is acttually better that P. Manning. Joe is my all time number one but was he actually better than Manning? It's even in my book. They both are the greatest.
My whole argument is that Montana was greater, not because of talent, but because he was clutch.

I would, however, suggest that given the same the same rules to play under, that Johnny U would have been viewed in almost exactly the same light that Manning is now.
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Old 01-25-2010, 09:31 PM   #317
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Let's not leave Bradshaw off that list ...
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Old 01-26-2010, 02:33 AM   #318
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Your list along with the other guys' list includes nothing before the 80's. I'm sorry...but any list that doesn't at least struggle with putting Staubach, Bradshaw, etc. on their list isn't even trying. Brady? I'm pretty sure there's at least a double-digit list of QB's in NFL history that should be in front of him. Hell, I'd put Favre in front of him and Favre isn't top 5.

Regardless of how good Manning has been, I just don't think you can discuss him as seriously top 5 until his carreer is over. If he goes down next year w/ a carreer ending injury, he'll just be a more-talented Danny White w/ a Superbowl win under his belt. We so easily forget how quickly people forget players when they leave the game early or fail to last.

I could remember when people were talking about Terrel Davis as if he were going to recognized as the best ever running back. Everyone speaks in hyperbole about current players...but it all means nothing until they've been out of the game a few years so that everyone can take a breath and objectively evaluate.
Perhaps that's why I qualified my list with "that I've seen."
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Old 01-26-2010, 05:38 AM   #319
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It's impossible to judge QBs from different eras...

Baugh, Unitas, Starr ... Staubach, Bradshaw ... Montana, Elway ... Brady, Manning, Favre (there's likely another 2-3 for this group)

Throw in guys like Young, Marino, Fouts, Tarkenton... there are a few others. I just don't know if I put Young or Marino in that first batch of QBs. And, it's not because of the rings, there's just something that is missing to be that keeps those types of QBs out of the realm of the first group.

Anyway, I have no desire to rank them numerically, I'm fine with the grouping because the eras were so different and there is a good argument for several of them being the best.
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Old 01-26-2010, 07:59 AM   #320
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Originally Posted by milkman View Post
And hell, how many times have I said that I would want Manning on my team?
Several. Hootie only reads what he wants to read and spins everything else.
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Old 01-26-2010, 08:02 AM   #321
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If you really want to know how great Joe Montana is go look at the stats of the 1993 Chiefs when he plays and when Dave Kreig plays. Kreig was a solid NFL starter as well. Its unbelivable how much better the Chiefs were, the Chiefs had a good defense but it wasn't a juggernaut that year at all. The offense scored more and the defense gave up less when Montana was the QB. Chiefs were 8-3 with Montana and 3-2 with Kreig. If Montana is healthy all year, the Chiefs go to the Super Bowl more than likely. If that doesn't tell how good he was at age 37, that should tell you something.

Elway did a shit ton with crappy talent as well. Brady has had the benefit of a good defense and Manning had a shit ton of options on offense. Still lets not act like the Colts are some talent deprived team on offense all of the sudden - Garcon and Collie are still #2 and #3 WRs with Wayne & Clark.

Compared to alot of the all-time greats Manning is lacking in Super Bowl apperances. He only has two - Montana has 4, Elway has 5, Brady has 4, Stabuach has 5, some of the old guys don't have many or any bc they couldn't but won the NFL championship like Unitas, Starr, Graham etc. You can spin the stats all you want but Manning needs at least two more championships/Super Bowl appreances to plant himself in the top 3 IMO.
Great post.
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Old 01-26-2010, 10:22 AM   #322
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Originally Posted by ChiefsCountry View Post
If you really want to know how great Joe Montana is go look at the stats of the 1993 Chiefs when he plays and when Dave Kreig plays. Kreig was a solid NFL starter as well. Its unbelivable how much better the Chiefs were, the Chiefs had a good defense but it wasn't a juggernaut that year at all. The offense scored more and the defense gave up less when Montana was the QB. Chiefs were 8-3 with Montana and 3-2 with Kreig. If Montana is healthy all year, the Chiefs go to the Super Bowl more than likely. If that doesn't tell how good he was at age 37, that should tell you something.

Elway did a shit ton with crappy talent as well. Brady has had the benefit of a good defense and Manning had a shit ton of options on offense. Still lets not act like the Colts are some talent deprived team on offense all of the sudden - Garcon and Collie are still #2 and #3 WRs with Wayne & Clark.

Compared to alot of the all-time greats Manning is lacking in Super Bowl apperances. He only has two - Montana has 4, Elway has 5, Brady has 4, Stabuach has 5, some of the old guys don't have many or any bc they couldn't but won the NFL championship like Unitas, Starr, Graham etc. You can spin the stats all you want but Manning needs at least two more championships/Super Bowl appreances to plant himself in the top 3 IMO.
Solid post and when comparing great players across eras, stats don't always tell the true tale. Plus, very few can say that they actually saw all of these guys from the last 5 decades play the game.

I think there is a consensus of about 7-8 guys that are always brought up when you want to fit them into the best ever or top 5 and with SOOOO many different variables (style of the game, surrounding talent, etc)... it's very difficult to truly rank their greatness.

It's easier for me to just accept the fact that there is truly a small handful that qualify as the elite at their position.
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Old 05-04-2024, 01:38 PM   #323
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It's crazy how Joe Montana was running around like this two years after back surgery




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Old 05-04-2024, 01:48 PM   #324
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It's crazy how Joe Montana was running around like this two years after back surgery




Very cool watching highlights of two of the greatest to ever do it. Even an old Montana was able to lead the Marty Chiefs to as many playoff wins as every other KC QB post Dawson and pre Mahomes.
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Old 05-04-2024, 01:50 PM   #325
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Old 05-04-2024, 03:02 PM   #326
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As far as SB performances go, Joe is still the GOAT.

4-0 in SBs, averaged over 67% completion%, averaged about 3 passing TDs per SB, threw 5 TDs in his final SB appearance, 0 INTs in four appearances, Passer Rating over four SB appearances was a ridiculous 122.5, with a 147.6 in his last SB. Also, never had a PR lower than 100.0 in a SB.
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Old 05-04-2024, 03:05 PM   #327
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Montana is still better than that fraud Brady.

And the OP's post is further evidence from 2010 that Brady wasn't seen as the best of that era despite the revisionist history of late (it was Manning).
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Old 05-04-2024, 03:46 PM   #328
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Montana also didn’t have the pussy rules we have now. The two eras are completely different. I don’t think there is much you could do to change my mind that Joe was the GOAT.
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Old 05-04-2024, 04:07 PM   #329
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Montana had Dwight Clark, Brent Jones, Roger Craig, Jerry Rice and John Taylor along with elite defenses…so I’m going to put Mahomes in front of him.
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Old 05-04-2024, 04:09 PM   #330
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1. Brady
2. Mahomes
3. Montana

Thats 2 of the 3 best ever to play for chiefs
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