Chiefs Whitlock LOLs at the Patsification of the Chiefs - Page 22

Hammock Parties · 01-14-2010, 01:33 AM

http://www.kansascity.com/sports/col...y/1682402.html

Wake me when the Chiefs sign Tom Brady, the one with two healthy knees and fearless pocket demeanor.

Until then, I’ll take a wait-and-see approach with Scott Pioli’s New England Relocation Plan.

Right now, this smells like a Jackson Five reunion tour without Michael (Brady) or Janet (Bill Belichick).

Romeo “Tito” Crennel, the defensive coordinator, joins Pioli, Charlie Weis, Matt Cassel, Mike Vrabel and ex-Pats to be named later in what appears to be a lame attempt at recreating the New England Dynasty.

Let me apologize for being unimpressed with this lineup.

You’re tired of reading it, and I’m tired of writing it. Unfortunately, I’m paid to tell you what I really think. Romeo Crennel sounds great on paper. He won three Super Bowls while holding the title of “defensive coordinator” for Belichick’s Patriots.

Tito sold a bunch of records plucking a guitar and singing backup for Michael Jackson. Without The Gloved One, we never heard of Tito again until Michael passed.

Romeo flamed out in Cleveland as a head coach. Of all the Belichick assistants during the Super Bowl years, Crennel was the one with the least amount of responsibility on his plate. Belichick designed the defenses.

When Crennel got the Cleveland job, I asked a longtime Patriots defender what he thought of the hire, and the player told me flat out that he never envisioned Romeo as a head coach.

It’s just one player, one opinion. And not being head-coach material doesn’t disqualify someone from being a top-flight coordinator.

In fact, I touched base with the player again on Wednesday, and he assured me that Crennel installed the defensive game plan throughout the week without interference from Belichick and that Crennel called the game.

The player also assured me that Belichick had his fingerprints on everything that transpired with the team — special teams, offense, defense and front-office decisions.

I’m just not sold on Crennel. As a coordinator, Crennel has far more to prove than Charlie Weis. No one I’ve talked to doubts Weis’ ability to create innovative game plans. (Everyone I’ve talked to doubts Weis’ ability to control his ego.)

Crennel worked for Belichick, who specializes in defense. Bill Parcells never won a Super Bowl without Belichick working as his defensive coordinator.

Hey, maybe one day we will be saying the same thing about Belichick and Crennel.

Today, all I’m sure of is that Crennel’s hiring increases the likelihood that Todd Haley is in a make-or-break season in 2010.

If things go poorly next season, don’t look for Pioli, Weis and Crennel to take the blame. They have nine Super Bowl rings among them. In their mind, they know exactly what it takes to win at the highest level in the NFL.

Haley either has no political savvy, no interest in playing the kind of politics that enhances a coach’s longevity or zero leverage when putting together a coaching staff.

Given the previous working relationship of Pioli, Weis and Crennel — and Weis’ oversized ego — it would be a seamless transition for Pioli to install Weis as head coach midway through the 2010 season or at the start of 2011.

My gut says Haley’s ego and gambling nature make him unaware of the ramifications of his decisions. Firing Chan Gailey was a colossal error. With the offensive personnel provided to him by Pioli, Haley should’ve held on to Gailey for a season. There was no reason for the head coach to attach his reputation and credibility to a receiver-less offense.

Good coaches are paranoid. They perceive every move by ownership/management as a potential threat to their power. Paranoia is what drives a good coach to be great. Paranoia is what makes a coach sleep at his office and punt on fourth down.

Look at Belichick. He’s been spoiled by success. That’s why he went for it on fourth and 2 against the Colts. He’s losing his paranoia.

Haley’s background is extremely unusual for an NFL head coach. Golfers focus on a single obstacle, the course. A football coach worries about a million things, including what his assistants may or may not be plotting.

**OnTheWarpath15** · 01-14-2010, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevieray

good, does this mean you won't continue to blame cassel for his contract that was determined by the market?

Pioli is also dictated by the market..we don't know what Denver was willing to pay for Cassel.

This is about the league overpaying players for something they might do...the market has determined this..these players aren't bigger than the game, even though fans constantly expect them to be, and then ridicule and blame them for things out of their control.

When have I EVER blamed Cassel for his pay?

I blame Cassel for his lack of talent, and his shitty play on Sundays.

And his contract wasn't determined by the market. He wasn't a FA.

And regarding Denver, we know that at minimum, they weren't willing to give up a draft pick higher than what we gave, nor take on his tag number for one year.

Marcellus · 01-14-2010, 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

Dear God, people.

We're talking about 2009 SALARY.

Not ****ing contracts.

Base salary + all applicable bonuses = TOTAL SALARY.

2009? Cassel was going to make $15MM this year whether he was here or in NE or wherever due to the franchise tag. Why do we care about the 2009 $?

All the smart people that think Cassel has the worst contract we have handed out have short memories as well. You need to go look at Pat Surtain (also gave up a 2nd round pick), Ty Law, and Kendrell Bell's contracts vs contributions.

Cassel still has a chance to earn his money. If he doesn't it will be a 2 year deal. Big whoop.

Micjones · 01-14-2010, 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

Yeah, and he's getting paid like, and being sold as a Franchise QB.

Time to play like one.

No argument there, but I'm not going to complain if he's Top 12 across the board either.

**OnTheWarpath15** · 01-14-2010, 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marcellus

2009? Cassel was going to make $15MM this year whether he was here or in NE or wherever due to the franchise tag. Why do we care about the 2009 $?

All the smart people that think Cassel has the worst contract we have handed out have short memories as well. You need to go look at Pat Surtain (also gave up a 2nd round pick), Ty Law, and Kendrell Bell's contracts vs contributions.

Cassel still has a chance to earn his money. If he doesn't it will be a 2 year deal. Big whoop.

I hope your right about the two year deal, but I'd be shocked if Pioli cut him after 2010. If that thought had ever entered his mind, there would have been no reason to sign him to a long-term deal. He could have played this year under the tag, and we could have been done with him.

And FWIW, the QB is the most important position on the field, so contract/contributions are much more heavily weighed regarding QB's.

BigChiefFan · 01-14-2010, 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marcellus

2009? Cassel was going to make $15MM this year whether he was here or in NE or wherever due to the franchise tag. Why do we care about the 2009 $?

All the smart people that think Cassel has the worst contract we have handed out have short memories as well. You need to go look at Pat Surtain (also gave up a 2nd round pick), Ty Law, and Kendrell Bell's contracts vs contributions.

Cassel still has a chance to earn his money. If he doesn't it will be a 2 year deal. Big whoop.

Agreed. The way they structured the contract, allows us to move on, if it doesn't work out.

If we decide to keep him, it also allows us to have paid alot of the money upfront, allowing us to not be hamstrung by the cap for fiuture acquisitions.

I fail to see the problem.

stevieray · 01-14-2010, 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

When have I EVER blamed Cassel for his pay?

And his contract wasn't determined by the market. He wasn't a FA.

post 313...

.and you just said a QB's worth is determined by the market.

**OnTheWarpath15** · 01-14-2010, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Micjones

No argument there, but I'm not going to complain if he's Top 12 across the board either.

Well, that's your right.

I expect better than top-third of the league from a supposed Franchise QB.

I don't think top-quarter is that much to ask, as he's being billed as a franchise QB, being paid like a top-of the-line, elite franchise QB, and considering the players we missed out on by trading for him.

It sure would be nice to have had one of the following:

Laurinaitis
Maualuga
Britton
Sintim
Barwin
Unger
Loadholt
Kruger
Vollmer

crazycoffey · 01-14-2010, 01:38 PM

I'm not big on all the ex-patriot hires either, but I also know that for years we've bitched that we wanted the hunt family to go get real winners with winning attitudes, and this is by far the best attempt at doing just that. Best chiefs coaching staff since a some of marty's years hands down, and from a better coaching tree to boot.

To all the "recreating things never work" guys/opinions, that's not a good enough argument to me. Best foot forward, these guys know each other very well, and pioli knows the players his coordinators like/want. So that seems beneficial to overall team improvement. The new coaches can go to work on what players to keep/get/and draft. How is this not a good move for the chiefs?

Micjones · 01-14-2010, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

Well, that's your right.

I expect better than top-third of the league from a supposed Franchise QB.

I don't think top-quarter is that much to ask, as he's being billed as a franchise QB, being paid like a top-of the-line, elite franchise QB, and considering the players we missed out on by trading for him.

It sure would be nice to have had one of the following:

Laurinaitis
Maualuga
Britton
Sintim
Barwin
Unger
Loadholt
Kruger
Vollmer

I'd really like to control for year-to-year salary increases (at the QB position), do some readjustments and determine where his contract stacks up league-wide. It's a bit disingenuous to compare his contract with those that are two years old. And even when you do... Romo/Rodgers are set to make more money than Cassel...with OLDER contracts.

We agree that he needs to be much more consistent and productive though.

beach tribe · 01-14-2010, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigChiefFan

Agreed. The way they structured the contract, allows us to move on, if it doesn't work out.

If we decide to keep him, it also allows us to have paid alot of the money upfront, allowing us to not be hamstrung by the cap for fiuture acquisitions.

I fail to see the problem.

Actually you guys have pointed out that what they did with this contract is a huge win, and if they weren't prepared to move on if he didn't succeed, then why the hell did they set his contract up in a manner that would allow them to do so.

So basically one of the biggest gripes that people have is actually one of the smartest things they could have done. They can drop his ass, with hardly any impact on the future, and pay big bucks to find out what we've got for a cpl seasons in which we have plenty of cap room to do it.

And I guess those people are going to stick by the "Pioli won't drop him after just two seasons" stance, because then it makes their argument about Cassel, and Pioli pointless, although Pioli clearly set his contract up in a way that would allow him to do just that.

**DeezNutz** · 01-14-2010, 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by beach tribe

Actually you guys have pointed out that what they did with this contract is a huge win, and if they weren't prepared to move on if he didn't succeed, then why the hell did they set his contract up in a manner that would allow them to do so.

So basically one of the biggest gripes that people have is actually one of the smartest things they could have done. They can drop his ass, with hardly any impact on the future, and pay big bucks to find out what we've got for a cpl seasons in which we have plenty of cap room to do it.

And I guess those people are going to stick by the "Pioli won't drop him after just two seasons" stance, because then it makes their argument about Cassel, and Pioli pointless, although Pioli clearly set his contract up in a way that would allow him to do just that.

The difference is that we didn't need to be tied to him for multiple seasons. We could have dropped him after '09, or attempted to sign him to a lesser extension b/c his play didn't dictate anything more.

We already controlled the player for the same time period, either way. It was unnecessary to give up the contract when we did.

Also, the contract took away any possible leverage that we might have had in last year's draft (trading down, etc.).

**OnTheWarpath15** · 01-14-2010, 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by beach tribe

Actually you guys have pointed out that what they did with this contract is a huge win, and if they weren't prepared to move on if he didn't succeed, then why the hell did they set his contract up in a manner that would allow them to do so.

So basically one of the biggest gripes that people have is actually one of the smartest things they could have done. They can drop his ass, with hardly any impact on the future, and pay big bucks to find out what we've got for a cpl seasons in which we have plenty of cap room to do it.

And I guess those people are going to stick by the "Pioli won't drop him after just two seasons" stance, because then it makes their argument about Cassel, and Pioli pointless, although Pioli clearly set his contract up in a way that would allow him to do just that.

If Pioli was concerned about having an "out", why sign him to a long term deal to begin with?

Micjones · 01-14-2010, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

If Pioli was concerned about having an "out", why sign him to a long term deal to begin with?

Because that's his job and the nature of the business.

**OnTheWarpath15** · 01-14-2010, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeezNutz

The difference is that we didn't need to be tied to him for multiple seasons. We could have dropped him after '09, or attempted to sign him to a lesser extension b/c his play didn't dictate anything more.

We already controlled the player for the same time period, either way. It was unnecessary to give up the contract when we did.

Also, the contract took away any possible leverage that we might have had in last year's draft (trading down, etc.).

Exactly.

beach tribe · 01-14-2010, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

Well, that's your right.

I expect better than top-third of the league from a supposed Franchise QB.

I don't think top-quarter is that much to ask, as he's being billed as a franchise QB, being paid like a top-of the-line, elite franchise QB, and considering the players we missed out on by trading for him.

It sure would be nice to have had one of the following:

Laurinaitis
Maualuga
Britton
Sintim
Barwin
Unger
Loadholt
Kruger
Vollmer

It would really be awesome to get a franchise QB wit a 2nd round pick.
It looks like that's what Pioli was trying to do, and so far it looks like he missed. It was a gamble. Sometimes you have to gamble to jump ahead.
Every 1st round QB is a gamble, but you have to give up a 1st, and more than we paid Cassel.
There is also still a chance that gamble could pay off IF Weis can do for Cassel what he has done for many others. I wouldn't bet on it, but nobody has raked any chips on that gamble...yet.

01-14-2010, 01:33 AM
Hammock Parties I'll be back. Join Date: Nov 2002 Casino cash: $930478	Whitlock LOLs at the Patsification of the Chiefs http://www.kansascity.com/sports/col...y/1682402.html Wake me when the Chiefs sign Tom Brady, the one with two healthy knees and fearless pocket demeanor. Until then, I’ll take a wait-and-see approach with Scott Pioli’s New England Relocation Plan. Right now, this smells like a Jackson Five reunion tour without Michael (Brady) or Janet (Bill Belichick). Romeo “Tito” Crennel, the defensive coordinator, joins Pioli, Charlie Weis, Matt Cassel, Mike Vrabel and ex-Pats to be named later in what appears to be a lame attempt at recreating the New England Dynasty. Let me apologize for being unimpressed with this lineup. You’re tired of reading it, and I’m tired of writing it. Unfortunately, I’m paid to tell you what I really think. Romeo Crennel sounds great on paper. He won three Super Bowls while holding the title of “defensive coordinator” for Belichick’s Patriots. Tito sold a bunch of records plucking a guitar and singing backup for Michael Jackson. Without The Gloved One, we never heard of Tito again until Michael passed. Romeo flamed out in Cleveland as a head coach. Of all the Belichick assistants during the Super Bowl years, Crennel was the one with the least amount of responsibility on his plate. Belichick designed the defenses. When Crennel got the Cleveland job, I asked a longtime Patriots defender what he thought of the hire, and the player told me flat out that he never envisioned Romeo as a head coach. It’s just one player, one opinion. And not being head-coach material doesn’t disqualify someone from being a top-flight coordinator. In fact, I touched base with the player again on Wednesday, and he assured me that Crennel installed the defensive game plan throughout the week without interference from Belichick and that Crennel called the game. The player also assured me that Belichick had his fingerprints on everything that transpired with the team — special teams, offense, defense and front-office decisions. I’m just not sold on Crennel. As a coordinator, Crennel has far more to prove than Charlie Weis. No one I’ve talked to doubts Weis’ ability to create innovative game plans. (Everyone I’ve talked to doubts Weis’ ability to control his ego.) Crennel worked for Belichick, who specializes in defense. Bill Parcells never won a Super Bowl without Belichick working as his defensive coordinator. Hey, maybe one day we will be saying the same thing about Belichick and Crennel. Today, all I’m sure of is that Crennel’s hiring increases the likelihood that Todd Haley is in a make-or-break season in 2010. If things go poorly next season, don’t look for Pioli, Weis and Crennel to take the blame. They have nine Super Bowl rings among them. In their mind, they know exactly what it takes to win at the highest level in the NFL. Haley either has no political savvy, no interest in playing the kind of politics that enhances a coach’s longevity or zero leverage when putting together a coaching staff. Given the previous working relationship of Pioli, Weis and Crennel — and Weis’ oversized ego — it would be a seamless transition for Pioli to install Weis as head coach midway through the 2010 season or at the start of 2011. My gut says Haley’s ego and gambling nature make him unaware of the ramifications of his decisions. Firing Chan Gailey was a colossal error. With the offensive personnel provided to him by Pioli, Haley should’ve held on to Gailey for a season. There was no reason for the head coach to attach his reputation and credibility to a receiver-less offense. Good coaches are paranoid. They perceive every move by ownership/management as a potential threat to their power. Paranoia is what drives a good coach to be great. Paranoia is what makes a coach sleep at his office and punt on fourth down. Look at Belichick. He’s been spoiled by success. That’s why he went for it on fourth and 2 against the Colts. He’s losing his paranoia. Haley’s background is extremely unusual for an NFL head coach. Golfers focus on a single obstacle, the course. A football coach worries about a million things, including what his assistants may or may not be plotting.
Posts: 297,003

01-14-2010, 01:38 PM	#323
crazycoffey .......... Join Date: Dec 2006 Casino cash: $4157901	I'm not big on all the ex-patriot hires either, but I also know that for years we've bitched that we wanted the hunt family to go get real winners with winning attitudes, and this is by far the best attempt at doing just that. Best chiefs coaching staff since a some of marty's years hands down, and from a better coaching tree to boot. To all the "recreating things never work" guys/opinions, that's not a good enough argument to me. Best foot forward, these guys know each other very well, and pioli knows the players his coordinators like/want. So that seems beneficial to overall team improvement. The new coaches can go to work on what players to keep/get/and draft. How is this not a good move for the chiefs?
Posts: 28,392