Chiefs Bob Gretz on Dorsey - Page 3

Chiefnj2 · 05-20-2009, 07:18 AM

- Gretz confirms that Dorsey is still healing from a college injury to his shin.
- I omitted the charts because they didn't format correctly.

Wednesday Morning Cup O’Chiefs
May 20, 2009 - Bob Gretz |

If you are one of those people who said Glenn Dorsey was a bust as the Chiefs No. 1 draft pick last year, understand that the man in question has heard you.

And if you are one of those people who think Dorsey is now obsolete because of the change in coaching staff and new defensive scheme, let it be known that he’s heard you on that as well.

“I’m not going to lie and say you don’t hear those things,” Dorsey said this week, as the Chiefs began their round of OTA sessions. “Hey, when a team wins two games there are not a lot of nice things they are going to say about anybody.

“It’s always discouraging when you hear negative things about you. But I don’t pay them much mind. I know what I did last year and I’m starting to get a pretty good idea of what’s ahead for this year with the new defense. I’m just working hard and trying to help this team win some more football games.”

The rush to judgment on the part of some in the media on Dorsey’s rookie season had less to do with what the young man did on the field, and more to do with the agendas of various pundits as they tried to make Carl Peterson/Herm Edwards look as bad as possible. We wrote about Dorsey and his rookie season back in January. Here’s the link to that story.

And here’s a chart of first-round defensive tackles in the last five NFL Drafts and what they did in his rookie seasons:

Those numbers scream that what Dorsey did last year in a bad season with a bad defense was pretty normal for first round defensive tackles.

“I don’t expect them to go back and do research,” said Dorsey. “That’s the fans, they react how they want to react.

“Listen, I was the fifth pick and we only one two games, so I guess I’m going to be in the bull’s eye. It comes with it. I talked to my parents about it and they told me what I was thinking: I’ve got to turn things into a positive. That’s what I’m trying to do.”

As to whether he’s out of place now with the defensive change around the Chiefs, Dorsey doesn’t see that.

“A lot of people are thinking this is a straight 3-4 defense and it’s not,” said Dorsey. “Being at an end is a new place for me, but it’s not going to be a classic 3-4 end on every snap. I think I can do it. It’s something new to get used too. I’m trying to get better with it and trying to improve one day at a time.

“There’s a place for me in this defense.”

Dorsey has been limited in his participation first in the team’s mini-camp and now in the first OTA by an old shin injury.

“It’s nothing major,” said Dorsey. “If it was a game, I would have played. We are just trying to make sure it heals and I can get over it.”

The focus for Glenn Dorsey is adapting to the new defense and getting stronger and in condition. There’s nothing else that he’s worried about.

“I can’t focus on stuff like that,” Dorsey said of the criticism. “The moment I do, I fall behind in getting done what I’ve got to get done. I know it comes with the territory and the only way I’m going to shut people up is to go out and dominate.

“That’s what I’m working for right now, trying to get better and be more of an impact player. I don’t take it negatively or positively, I’ve got to do what I’ve got to do.”

Whether is means anything to what Dorsey may get done this year, here’s what those DTs taken in the last five drafts did in their second season. Ellis and Balmer are not included, because like Dorsey, they are entering their sophomore NFL campaigns:

The Chiefs hope Dorsey follows in the footsteps of Ngata, Patterson and Wilfork in their second seasons in the league.

TheGuardian · 05-20-2009, 11:08 AM

Quote:

“A lot of people are thinking this is a straight 3-4 defense and it’s not,” said Dorsey. “Being at an end is a new place for me, but it’s not going to be a classic 3-4 end on every snap.

Man this sounds sooooo familiar.

Who wants crow??????????

Lemme see here, I said Dorsey wouldn't be playing nose. Check.

I said this would not be a two gap defense. Check.

I said this would not be a traditional 3-4 much less be run on every down. Check.

Owning people like kcbubb, mecca, hamas, etc? Check.

Basileus777 · 05-20-2009, 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CoMoChief

Those 3 are NT's, something Dorsey is not.

Patterson isn't a NT and Ngata didn't play the nose until last year when Greggs got hurt.

suds79 · 05-20-2009, 11:12 AM

I fully expect Dorsey to beat out Magee for that starting 3-4 DE spot purely on talent alone.

I mean we're talking a 2nd year top 5 pick vs a rookie 3rd rounder.

Should be a piece of cake.

DJ's left nut · 05-20-2009, 11:12 AM

Even if he's right and it's not a 'traditional' 3-4, we have a part-time player we used a #5 overall on. He's still only going to be out there for a handful of defensive snaps each game.

He's the Elvis Dumerville of interior lineman and Dumerville went in the 4th, correct?

I just don't see how this pick can be salvaged. Maybe it'll turn into passable, he'll develop into a nice rotation DT, but we're never going to get any true impact from him at this point, IMO. Not enough to justify the selection (though again, I wouldn't have made the switch to the 3-4, forcing us to waste not only Dorsey, but the #3 overall on Jackson. Way to lock in mediocrity there, fellas)

TheGuardian · 05-20-2009, 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

Even if he's right and it's not a 'traditional' 3-4, we have a part-time player we used a #5 overall on. He's still only going to be out there for a handful of defensive snaps each game.

He's the Elvis Dumerville of interior lineman and Dumerville went in the 4th, correct?

I just don't see how this pick can be salvaged. Maybe it'll turn into passable, he'll develop into a nice rotation DT, but we're never going to get any true impact from him at this point, IMO. Not enough to justify the selection (though again, I wouldn't have made the switch to the 3-4, forcing us to waste not only Dorsey, but the #3 overall on Jackson. Way to lock in mediocrity there, fellas)

First, what do you mean "even if he's right?" The guy is learning the scheme and told you that. I can't believe some of you are still thinking we will run a traditional 3-4.

Second, since this is not a true 3-4 Dorsey will not be solely asked to hold ground and occupy gaps. He will still be asked to get up field, collapse the pocket, contain the edge, etc. On third downs he and Jackson will slide inside.

I don't think the Pats regret using first round picks on Seymour, Wilfork, and Warren. And comparing Dumerville to Dorsey is ridiculously dumb. No offense.

Basileus777 · 05-20-2009, 11:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

Even if he's right and it's not a 'traditional' 3-4, we have a part-time player we used a #5 overall on. He's still only going to be out there for a handful of defensive snaps each game.

He's the Elvis Dumerville of interior lineman and Dumerville went in the 4th, correct?

I just don't see how this pick can be salvaged. Maybe it'll turn into passable, he'll develop into a nice rotation DT, but we're never going to get any true impact from him at this point, IMO. Not enough to justify the selection (though again, I wouldn't have made the switch to the 3-4, forcing us to waste not only Dorsey, but the #3 overall on Jackson. Way to lock in mediocrity there, fellas)

Why would you think Dorsey would be a situational player in this defense? I don't see any reason to take him off the field on pass rushing situations. If anything the NT would go out.

DJ's left nut · 05-20-2009, 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheGuardian

First, what do you mean "even if he's right?" The guy is learning the scheme and told you that. I can't believe some of you are still thinking we will run a traditional 3-4.

Second, since this is not a true 3-4 Dorsey will not be solely asked to hold ground and occupy gaps. He will still be asked to get up field, collapse the pocket, contain the edge, etc. On third downs he and Jackson will slide inside.

I don't think the Pats regret using first round picks on Seymour, Wilfork, and Warren. And comparing Dumerville to Dorsey is ridiculously dumb. No offense.

Jackson's not Seymour. Wilfork wasn't #3 and Warren's not Warren without both Wilfork and Seymour, neither of which we have (and again Warren wasn't at #3). Had we drafted Seymour at #3, Jackson at # 20 or if even if I thought Jackson would play as well as Warren (and again 10 slots later), I wouldn't hate the pick....as much.

Do you really think Dorsey will be out there more than 70% of the time? It seems to me there will be many times we will be lining up in a more traditional 3-4 set, with 4 backers, Jackson, McGee and a NT. I don't expect the NT to be Dorsey when all is said and done. Nor do I believe the Chiefs will use Dorsey as an end in those sets. They appear to be grooming him for an off-tackle role when they stick four down linemen out there.

And the Dumerville comparison is done to show what value situational players have. Guys that are not every down players simply aren't as valuable. Yes, I know that Dorsey is not going to be brought in as a pass rusher on 3rd downs. At the same time, I don't expect him to be a 50 snap guy either. I'd be surprised to see him in for 30 snaps a game.

Cormac · 05-20-2009, 11:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheGuardian

Man this sounds sooooo familiar.

Who wants crow??????????

Lemme see here, I said Dorsey wouldn't be playing nose. Check.

I said this would not be a two gap defense. Check.

I said this would not be a traditional 3-4 much less be run on every down. Check.

Owning people like kcbubb, mecca, hamas, etc? Check.

Your information and knowledge is great. I enjoy it.
Your gloating......not so much.

CoMoChief · 05-20-2009, 11:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Basileus777

Patterson isn't a NT and Ngata didn't play the nose until last year when Greggs got hurt.

Ngata was drafted as a NT. Played it all throughout college. Where BAL decided to play him is obviously not up to me, but natually Ngata was and always was a NT.

Frankie · 05-20-2009, 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2

Bob Gretz on Dorsey

He must have won the coin flip. Next, is Dorsey's turn.

Cormac · 05-20-2009, 11:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

It seems to me there will be many times we will be lining up in a more traditional 3-4 set, with 4 backers, Jackson, McGee and a NT. I don't expect the NT to be Dorsey when all is said and done. Nor do I believe the Chiefs will use Dorsey as an end in those sets. They appear to be grooming him for an off-tackle role when they stick for down linemen out there.

This is a worst-case scenario, IMO. Nobody knows how well Dorsey will do in the 3-4 alignment - not even Dorsey. The best players will play, and I'll bet Dorsey beats out Magee (our 3rd round rookie who will also be learning a new position) at 3-4 end.

Haley has already said that they are projecting Dorsey as a 3-4 end, not a NT. I think that was in his draft day PC.

If Dorsey fails at 3-4 end, then I agree that he will likely only play under-tackle in the 4-3 snaps. That would indeed be a major disappointment.

Basileus777 · 05-20-2009, 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CoMoChief

Ngata was drafted as a NT. Played it all throughout college. Where BAL decided to play him is obviously not up to me, but natually Ngata was and always was a NT.

That's true, but if we are talking about second seasons, it doesn't change the fact that Ngata played DE then.

Cormac · 05-20-2009, 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

(though again, I wouldn't have made the switch to the 3-4, forcing us to waste not only Dorsey, but the #3 overall on Jackson. Way to lock in mediocrity there, fellas)

Don't jump yet!

Jackson was the only "pure" 3-4 end in the draft according to several "experts". He was an obvious choice tailored for our new defense. The new D may not suit Dorsey's style but it definitely should suit Jackson.

milkman · 05-20-2009, 11:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cormac

Your information and knowledge is great. I enjoy it.
Your gloating......not so much.

And it may be premature.

We are getting so many mixed messages from players and coaches that we are as informed as were were when Haley was initially hired.

I think he's probably right, but the gloating should wait until we actually see what is on the field.

Chiefnj2 · 05-20-2009, 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheGuardian

I said this would not be a traditional 3-4 much less be run on every down. Check.

.

Who said the Chiefs would run a 3-4 every down?

05-20-2009, 07:18 AM
Chiefnj2 In Search of a Life Join Date: Mar 2007 Casino cash: $7813688	Bob Gretz on Dorsey - Gretz confirms that Dorsey is still healing from a college injury to his shin. - I omitted the charts because they didn't format correctly. Wednesday Morning Cup O’Chiefs May 20, 2009 - Bob Gretz \| If you are one of those people who said Glenn Dorsey was a bust as the Chiefs No. 1 draft pick last year, understand that the man in question has heard you. And if you are one of those people who think Dorsey is now obsolete because of the change in coaching staff and new defensive scheme, let it be known that he’s heard you on that as well. “I’m not going to lie and say you don’t hear those things,” Dorsey said this week, as the Chiefs began their round of OTA sessions. “Hey, when a team wins two games there are not a lot of nice things they are going to say about anybody. “It’s always discouraging when you hear negative things about you. But I don’t pay them much mind. I know what I did last year and I’m starting to get a pretty good idea of what’s ahead for this year with the new defense. I’m just working hard and trying to help this team win some more football games.” The rush to judgment on the part of some in the media on Dorsey’s rookie season had less to do with what the young man did on the field, and more to do with the agendas of various pundits as they tried to make Carl Peterson/Herm Edwards look as bad as possible. We wrote about Dorsey and his rookie season back in January. Here’s the link to that story. And here’s a chart of first-round defensive tackles in the last five NFL Drafts and what they did in his rookie seasons: Those numbers scream that what Dorsey did last year in a bad season with a bad defense was pretty normal for first round defensive tackles. “I don’t expect them to go back and do research,” said Dorsey. “That’s the fans, they react how they want to react. “Listen, I was the fifth pick and we only one two games, so I guess I’m going to be in the bull’s eye. It comes with it. I talked to my parents about it and they told me what I was thinking: I’ve got to turn things into a positive. That’s what I’m trying to do.” As to whether he’s out of place now with the defensive change around the Chiefs, Dorsey doesn’t see that. “A lot of people are thinking this is a straight 3-4 defense and it’s not,” said Dorsey. “Being at an end is a new place for me, but it’s not going to be a classic 3-4 end on every snap. I think I can do it. It’s something new to get used too. I’m trying to get better with it and trying to improve one day at a time. “There’s a place for me in this defense.” Dorsey has been limited in his participation first in the team’s mini-camp and now in the first OTA by an old shin injury. “It’s nothing major,” said Dorsey. “If it was a game, I would have played. We are just trying to make sure it heals and I can get over it.” The focus for Glenn Dorsey is adapting to the new defense and getting stronger and in condition. There’s nothing else that he’s worried about. “I can’t focus on stuff like that,” Dorsey said of the criticism. “The moment I do, I fall behind in getting done what I’ve got to get done. I know it comes with the territory and the only way I’m going to shut people up is to go out and dominate. “That’s what I’m working for right now, trying to get better and be more of an impact player. I don’t take it negatively or positively, I’ve got to do what I’ve got to do.” Whether is means anything to what Dorsey may get done this year, here’s what those DTs taken in the last five drafts did in their second season. Ellis and Balmer are not included, because like Dorsey, they are entering their sophomore NFL campaigns: The Chiefs hope Dorsey follows in the footsteps of Ngata, Patterson and Wilfork in their second seasons in the league.
Posts: 22,396

05-20-2009, 11:12 AM	#33
suds79 MVP Join Date: Sep 2000 Casino cash: $10005036	I fully expect Dorsey to beat out Magee for that starting 3-4 DE spot purely on talent alone. I mean we're talking a 2nd year top 5 pick vs a rookie 3rd rounder. Should be a piece of cake.
Posts: 5,747

05-20-2009, 11:12 AM	#34
DJ's left nut Sauntering Vaguely Downwards Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Columbia, Mo Casino cash: $2459099	Even if he's right and it's not a 'traditional' 3-4, we have a part-time player we used a #5 overall on. He's still only going to be out there for a handful of defensive snaps each game. He's the Elvis Dumerville of interior lineman and Dumerville went in the 4th, correct? I just don't see how this pick can be salvaged. Maybe it'll turn into passable, he'll develop into a nice rotation DT, but we're never going to get any true impact from him at this point, IMO. Not enough to justify the selection (though again, I wouldn't have made the switch to the 3-4, forcing us to waste not only Dorsey, but the #3 overall on Jackson. Way to lock in mediocrity there, fellas)
Posts: 60,981