Star Wars: The Old Republic

[keg in kc]

Don't believe there's a dedicated thread, and since they're starting to release information now, I figure it's time for one.

[NewChief]

Originally Posted by keg in kc

I should probably do a post with all the reveal videos in it.

Yes please.

[keg in kc]

Bounty Hunter



Imperial Agent



Jedi Knight



Republic Trooper

[keg in kc]

Sith Inquisitor



Sith Warrior



Smuggler

[Pants]

Great! Sith Inquisitor is the ****ing Warlock from WoW except they can also stealth. I'm betting that class is going to get nerfed to shit a few months after the game is released.

[keg in kc]

Originally Posted by Pants

Great! Sith Inquisitor is the ****ing Warlock from WoW except they can also stealth. I'm betting that class is going to get nerfed to shit a few months after the game is released.

Consulars can also stealth. Although it's an advanced class choice for both (I think).

When they go for that advanced class, however, both inquisitors and consulars become melee focused rather than casting (for lack of a better word) focused. They're purportedly being built as stealth-capable dual-blade wielding blink-tanks.

[keg in kc]

[Molitoth]

You know what pisses me off? Good looking games with faction differences.

I absolutely HATE that if I wanted to play a Sith and my RL best friend wanted to play a Jedi, that we would not be able to do missions together, etc due to a faction difference.

If you want to play together, then you both have to decide on the same faction... which eliminates half of your race/class combinations.

This is why I loved EQ and Vangaurd.... no matter what class/race you choose, you can play with your friends.

[keg in kc]

You're not the only person who feels like that, but I can't imagine a game set in the Star Wars universe where there isn't a faction difference, dark against light.

I still wonder if eventually there won't be cross-faction content, both sides fighting a third party. Although I think it's pretty unlikely.

[Molitoth]

I played SWG when it first dropped and it was ok because I played the game by myself. (I later quit when PvP was so unbalanced that it sucked) Like Commandos being able to 1 shot kill people with the flamethrower.

Anyway... Yes Star Wars based game is going to be Rebelion vs Imperial Army I imagine so you have to choose a side.

I was really into WoW during the design period until they announced the faction wars between human/horde. It cut your choice of race from 8 down to 4.
There are thousands of characters running around the WoW realm with the exact same graphic as yours. (When the game first came out anyway)


Verant/Sigil/SOE just got it right when it came to class/race combo's and having an extreme amount of options.... they did however miss the boat on other things.

While the gameplay on ToR looks pretty good and reminds me of the good things in SWG... I'll still prolly just wait for EQNext to drop before I involve myself heavily in another MMO. I recently just broke my addiction to the Project99 EQ server and am finding myself with a ton more freetime.

[kcxiv]

molitoth is like me in the mmo front. Faction games are basically 2 of the same game on the same server.

I just cant get into games like that. Games have really been dumbed down with so many options. Paths to level up are so linear, its like why do you even have to level now days. Just start out at max level. Everything pre max level, is just snoozefest.


Leveling is fast now days, but its just pointless. Everyone has played mmo's now, they know how to play a character. Back in the EQ days, i agree'd with the leveling it was new, and you had to learn what to do, but that part is gone. There is never any sense of danger in any game anymore. Its like your going to die, its like so what. Means nothing. I remember my friend was doing a planes run in everquest and got his corpse stuck in the plane of fear. lol Took the group i was with 4 hours to get his corpse back. It was one of the most fun ****ing days i ever had in mmo's and it was because of a **** up.

[keg in kc]

Originally Posted by kcxiv

molitoth is like me in the mmo front. Faction games are basically 2 of the same game on the same server.

I just cant get into games like that. Games have really been dumbed down with so many options. Paths to level up are so linear, its like why do you even have to level now days. Just start out at max level. Everything pre max level, is just snoozefest.

That's the WoW influence. Every major MMO on the market is about getting to the cap as quickly as you can so you can start playing the 'real' game. We've talked about that on this thread before. TOR is a different beast, they're designing it to be a game with BioWare style gameplay and leveling, which means long, cinematic storylines, slow leveling curves, companions (which are *not* pets, entirely different concept), basically everything they've done in their single player games but in a multiplayer environment. Getting to the cap is not the focus of the game. Advancing through storylines that are hundreds and hundreds of hours long are what they're placing the highest priority on. Whether that means it will take hundreds and hundreds of hours to reach the level cap, or whether that means you'll be continuing to do hundreds of hours of story content after the cap, I don't know, because the beta is currently under an NDA. What I do know is that each class' story is built up of 3 acts, and the average playtime for just the first act for beta players currently (according to BioWare) runs over 100 hours. I don't know if you're familiar with KotOR, but they've said that the initial act of each class in TOR is longer than an entire play through KotOR. What level folks are at that point, I don't know, but that's a pretty substantial amount of time, and it doesn't include ancillary game activities like exploring, crafting, PvP, heroic quests, or whatever else it is people can do right now. That's just the time involved with the class stories.

As far as making death "meaningful", you're probably never going to see harsh death penalties in an MMO again. Developers are not targetting a niche audience, they're trying to draw in as many players as possible, which means casual choices will generally win over hardcore ones.

[NewChief]

Originally Posted by keg in kc

As far as making death "meaningful", you're probably never going to see harsh death penalties in an MMO again. Developers are not targetting a niche audience, they're trying to draw in as many players as possible, which means casual choices will generally win over hardcore ones.

Even in the MUD community, which is a subset of a subset, the death issue is a controversial one. Lots of games have started to move to permadeath, but it's still a small fringe that prefer that style of play. It tends to appeal to people who are more interested in realism and roleplay than leveling, though there is another group of hardcore player-killers and such who like it because of the added risk/thrill. I really enjoy permadeath, but that's just me.

And for those not familiar: permadeath means that there is some mechanism in place to where your character can truly die and not be recoverable, so that you have to start a whole new character.

[kcxiv]

Originally Posted by keg in kc

That's the WoW influence. Every major MMO on the market is about getting to the cap as quickly as you can so you can start playing the 'real' game. We've talked about that on this thread before. TOR is a different beast, they're designing it to be a game with BioWare style gameplay and leveling, which means long, cinematic storylines, slow leveling curves, companions (which are *not* pets, entirely different concept), basically everything they've done in their single player games but in a multiplayer environment. Getting to the cap is not the focus of the game. Advancing through storylines that are hundreds and hundreds of hours long are what they're placing the highest priority on. Whether that means it will take hundreds and hundreds of hours to reach the level cap, or whether that means you'll be continuing to do hundreds of hours of story content after the cap, I don't know, because the beta is currently under an NDA. What I do know is that each class' story is built up of 3 acts, and the average playtime for just the first act for beta players currently (according to BioWare) runs over 100 hours. I don't know if you're familiar with KotOR, but they've said that the initial act of each class in TOR is longer than an entire play through KotOR. What level folks are at that point, I don't know, but that's a pretty substantial amount of time, and it doesn't include ancillary game activities like exploring, crafting, PvP, heroic quests, or whatever else it is people can do right now. That's just the time involved with the class stories.

As far as making death "meaningful", you're probably never going to see harsh death penalties in an MMO again. Developers are not targetting a niche audience, they're trying to draw in as many players as possible, which means casual choices will generally win over hardcore ones.

Ooh i know, the way MMo's are going and they will never revert back. Its EZ mode from here on out. Thats why i just dont play anymore. Ive moved on. It just sux that i have too is all.

[keg in kc]

Originally Posted by NewChief

Even in the MUD community, which is a subset of a subset, the death issue is a controversial one. Lots of games have started to move to permadeath, but it's still a small fringe that prefer that style of play. It tends to appeal to people who are more interested in realism and roleplay than leveling. I really enjoy permadeath, but that's just me.

And for those not familiar: permadeath means that there is some mechanism in place to where your character can truly die and not be recoverable, so that you have to start a whole new character.

Yeah, I don't think I'd ever play a game with permadeath. I don't particularly enjoy doing things over. So that would mean I could never do anything even remotely dangerous. I'd literally quit if I, say, through an accident or lagspike or some other unforseen event lost a character I'd spent any significant time on. That would be game killing frustration to me. And I don't play games to be frustrated. That's what real life is for. In my opinion, of course.

[keg in kc]

Originally Posted by kcxiv

Ooh i know, the way MMo's are going and they will never revert back. Its EZ mode from here on out. Thats why i just dont play anymore. Ive moved on. It just sux that i have too is all.

I don't think they're easy mode. I think they're just finding the sweet spot. A lot of early MMO play was basically just pointless grinding. And speaking just for me I'd say I don't miss most of that in the least.

Although I do like some grinding - that's the OCD sociopath in me.