Charger Fans are not afraid of the Chiefs. - Page 4

**sd4chiefs** · 04-26-2005, 06:29 PM

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http://forum.signonsandiego.com/uplo...threadid=44636

tk13 · 04-27-2005, 04:00 AM

Yeah, but with Marty he has a history of conversative play in pressure situations that leads to these "choke jobs" always happening. Last year he did the same thing... he had the #3 offense in the league and he just packed it in and settled for a 40+ yard field goal with a rookie kicker on a less than perfect weather day. I like Marty, I really do, and I even defended his decision at the time, but apparently it wasn't the right one. I'm not sure how much of it is being too conversative and how much is just bad luck, but I think now I'd rather have a team like we do with Vermeil where we're aggressive both offensively and defensively.

Abba-Dabba · 04-27-2005, 04:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tk13

Yeah, but with Marty he has a history of conversative play in pressure situations that leads to these "choke jobs" always happening. Last year he did the same thing... he had the #3 offense in the league and he just packed it in and settled for a 40+ yard field goal with a rookie kicker on a less than perfect weather day. I like Marty, I really do, and I even defended his decision at the time, but apparently it wasn't the right one. I'm not sure how much of it is being too conversative and how much is just bad luck, but I think now I'd rather have a team like we do with Vermeil where we're aggressive both offensively and defensively.

Yes, Marty has had his problems with game planning and game day decisions in the playoffs. No doubt about that. But, the same can be said with Vermeil in the regular season. Hell, last year we complained about Vermeil and poor clock management, terrible game planning, poor use of the red flags. Vermeil even admitted to the fact that those were his fault. No coach is perfect in that respect. I'm not going to claim either one is better than the other. In all honesty they really can't be compared to eachother. Two totally different styles of coaching being the main reason. I'll just say I would be happy with either Vermeil or Marty as the HC. I know they both can do an excellent job of building and coaching a football team.

htismaqe · 04-27-2005, 05:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tk13

You'd think they'll be alright as long as Brees doesn't come back down to earth. They did have a solid draft, and they're awful high on their draft picks. Their schedule is brutal though. They have to go play @ Philly, @ New England... and they also have to go @ Indy and host Pittsburgh, we don't play either of those teams. They have to come play @ Arrowhead in late December, and they've got a lot of east coast games that will be at 10am their time since our division plays the AFC and NFC East this year. They'll have to earn it.

After the season he had last year, we'll see. Alot of times when guys are on that kind of leash, the OC and HC get antsy and think "Well, he handled that, let's loosen up a bit" and bingo, they fall on their face.

Brees was successful last year because they created an offense specifically for him, using Tomlinson. The guy compared to the top AFC QB's in every way -- except for yards. 1000-1500 LESS than every other top QB.

htismaqe · 04-27-2005, 05:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saggysack

Yes, Marty has had his problems with game planning and game day decisions in the playoffs. No doubt about that. But, the same can be said with Vermeil in the regular season. Hell, last year we complained about Vermeil and poor clock management, terrible game planning, poor use of the red flags. Vermeil even admitted to the fact that those were his fault. No coach is perfect in that respect. I'm not going to claim either one is better than the other. In all honesty they really can't be compared to eachother. Two totally different styles of coaching being the main reason. I'll just say I would be happy with either Vermeil or Marty as the HC. I know they both can do an excellent job of building and coaching a football team.

There's one CRUCIAL difference.

We KNOW Vermeil can win a Super Bowl.

Abba-Dabba · 04-27-2005, 05:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by htismaqe

There's one CRUCIAL difference.

We KNOW Vermeil can win a Super Bowl.

We also know he can lose one too. To even add more to that. We know Vermeil can become TOO emotional at times. To the point where it clouds his judgement.

I'm not in the crowd that likes to say getting to the SB is enough. Because, it isn't enough. Gawd damnit, if they get to the SB I sure as hell ain't going to be happy if they lose. 2nd place is the 1st loser. Consolation prizes suck.

What I was trying to say earlier was that SD and KC both have great coaches with very, very good teams. It would not surprise me in the least to see SD come out on top again, and vice versa, it would not surprise me to see KC come out on top.

htismaqe · 04-27-2005, 05:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saggysack

We also know he can lose one too. To even add more to that. We know Vermeil can become TOO emotional at times. To the point where it clouds his judgement.

I'm not in the crowd that likes to say getting to the SB is enough. Because, it isn't enough. Gawd damnit, if they get to the SB I sure as hell ain't going to be happy if they lose. 2nd place is the 1st loser. Consolation prizes suck.

What I was trying to say earlier was that SD and KC both have great coaches with very, very good teams. It would not surprise me in the least to see SD come out on top again, and vice versa, it would not surprise me to see KC come out on top.

You have to GET to a Super Bowl before you can lose one.

keg in kc · 04-27-2005, 05:25 AM

The 2004 Chargers were just the latest crappy team to overachieve for a season. It happens every year. They'll fall back to earth in 2005, probably pretty hard.

Abba-Dabba · 04-27-2005, 05:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by htismaqe

You have to GET to a Super Bowl before you can lose one.

You also have to have a good regular season to get to the playoffs. 3 out of last 4 years the Vermeil led Chiefs have not had a good enough regular season to even sniff the playoffs.

We could go all day with little nuggets like this.

DaWolf · 04-27-2005, 05:33 AM

The Chargers last year were a lot like some of Marty's Chiefs teams. Even Donnie Edwards was admitting that they were getting "bounces" going their way that they had not been getting the year before. sound familiar? Marty always gave us a team that one year, the bounces went our way, we win, then the next year the bounces evened out and we were mediocre. 11-5, 9-7, 13-3, 9-7, 13-3, 7-9 IIRC in '93-98. Every other year we got the first place schedule and fell back to earth...

Abba-Dabba · 04-27-2005, 05:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by keg in kc

The 2004 Chargers were just the latest crappy team to overachieve for a season. It happens every year. They'll fall back to earth in 2005, probably pretty hard.

Sounds like the 2003 Chiefs.

keg in kc · 04-27-2005, 05:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saggysack

Sounds like the 2003 Chiefs.

Eggzactly.

tk13 · 04-27-2005, 05:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaWolf

The Chargers last year were a lot like some of Marty's Chiefs teams. Even Donnie Edwards was admitting that they were getting "bounces" going their way that they had not been getting the year before. sound familiar? Marty always gave us a team that one year, the bounces went our way, we win, then the next year the bounces evened out and we were mediocre. 11-5, 9-7, 13-3, 9-7, 13-3, 7-9 IIRC in '93-98. Every other year we got the first place schedule and fell back to earth...

I think they'll be a decent team as long as Brees doesn't come crashing down, that schedule though, it's tough on them this year. Just seems like they caught all their tough non-division games on the road. We really need to take advantage of the fact that we get teams like NE and Philly and the Jets in Arrowhead.

jspchief · 04-27-2005, 08:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by htismaqe

After the season he had last year, we'll see. Alot of times when guys are on that kind of leash, the OC and HC get antsy and think "Well, he handled that, let's loosen up a bit" and bingo, they fall on their face.

A lot like Jake Plummer. Shamarat was really conservative with Plummet the first year he was there, then they loosen up and Plummet reverts to his 4 INTs-a-game form.

Teams are going to start keying on Gates more, and while they may not stop him completely, they will slow him down. The rest of their WRs are not particularly scary. McCardell is a good possesion receiver, but he's not going to break a game open. I really think things hinge on Brees. Early stumbles may make them look hard at their multi-million dollar clipboard carrier.

I think they have a solid team, built on the core that Marty builds all his teams on, running game and defense. But just like Marty's teams in the past, I don't think they have what it takes to get over that final hump. I see them being a winning team with a shot at the play-offs every year, but never being any real threat for the Superbowl.

Boltergeist · 04-27-2005, 10:47 AM

Hey guys,

I come in peace. Not particularly into the smack talk, but I thought I'd offer some comments.

Count me in with the Chargers fans that are not so cocky right now. I know how quickly things can change and I've been through too many lean years to count on us ripping through the league with the monster schedule we have to face. Also, there is no doubt the division is going to be much tougher next year and the potential impact of the Chiefs' draft and acquiring of Surtain is pretty obvious.

With that being said however, I find it funny that some are taking us lightly also. We did go 12-4 last year and lost games to Indy in overtime and Atlanta by 1 point on the road when we were winning for 90% of the game. We are probably also one of the deepest young teams in the league from top to bottom and we seem to really have taken steps to address our biggest weakness last year (pass rush) with what would seem to be a pretty good draft. We also get our #1 receiver back (Caldwell) who was off to a great start last year before getting hurt, and McCardell will be with us for a full year and TC instead of coming off the street to start 7 games. Perhaps even more importantly, LT will not be hobbled for 10 weeks with a groin injury like last year(knock on wood). Antonio Gates is also no mirage and teams starting double teaming and keying on him during the second half of last year. He is a nightmare matchup on 3rd down and in the red zone. Brees is also not asked to do anything extraordinary in our offense. His biggest improvement was simply cutting down on mistakes....throwing balls away instead of throwing into double coverage to try to make a play, etc. Defensively we have 3 first rounders and 1 high second round pick playing corner...all of whom are young and improving. Jammer has been fairly solid for us, and Drayton Florence is stepping up to be a good compliment. Our pass rush should definately be improved with Castillo and Merriman...this is what will help our pass defense the most. Our run D was #2 in the NFL last year and the addition of another 300 pounder to the line and a freak like "lights out" won't hurt that.

It's all speculation now, but I think it will boil down to the Chargers and Chiefs for the division with the Broncos being right there the entire way. The Raiders still have too many gaping holes on defense to keep up with the other three all year, although they'll be a nuisance to everyone.

This may be the most competitive and exciting AFC West we have ever seen. May the best team win.

htismaqe · 04-27-2005, 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saggysack

You also have to have a good regular season to get to the playoffs. 3 out of last 4 years the Vermeil led Chiefs have not had a good enough regular season to even sniff the playoffs.

We could go all day with little nuggets like this.

We could go all day, but I'd rather end it now.

Vermeil is one of a handful of coaches to take 2 teams to a Super Bowl.

If Marty keeps winning regular season games, he'll be the winningest coach in HISTORY never to play in a Super Bowl.

Enough said.

04-26-2005, 06:29 PM
sd4chiefs error 404 Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Bizarro World Casino cash: $8800445	Charger Fans are not afraid of the Chiefs. This should be fun. Check it out. http://forum.signonsandiego.com/uplo...threadid=44636
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04-27-2005, 04:00 AM	#46
tk13 ... Join Date: Nov 2001 Casino cash: $1422500	Yeah, but with Marty he has a history of conversative play in pressure situations that leads to these "choke jobs" always happening. Last year he did the same thing... he had the #3 offense in the league and he just packed it in and settled for a 40+ yard field goal with a rookie kicker on a less than perfect weather day. I like Marty, I really do, and I even defended his decision at the time, but apparently it wasn't the right one. I'm not sure how much of it is being too conversative and how much is just bad luck, but I think now I'd rather have a team like we do with Vermeil where we're aggressive both offensively and defensively.
Posts: 55,075

04-27-2005, 05:25 AM	#52
keg in kc oxymoron Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: OP/KC/Whatever Casino cash: $9556299	The 2004 Chargers were just the latest crappy team to overachieve for a season. It happens every year. They'll fall back to earth in 2005, probably pretty hard.
Posts: 58,682

04-27-2005, 05:33 AM	#54
DaWolf Cry havoc... Join Date: Aug 2000 Casino cash: $10007725	The Chargers last year were a lot like some of Marty's Chiefs teams. Even Donnie Edwards was admitting that they were getting "bounces" going their way that they had not been getting the year before. sound familiar? Marty always gave us a team that one year, the bounces went our way, we win, then the next year the bounces evened out and we were mediocre. 11-5, 9-7, 13-3, 9-7, 13-3, 7-9 IIRC in '93-98. Every other year we got the first place schedule and fell back to earth...
Posts: 6,798

04-27-2005, 10:47 AM	#59
Boltergeist Registered User Join Date: Aug 2003 Casino cash: $10004900	Hey guys, I come in peace. Not particularly into the smack talk, but I thought I'd offer some comments. Count me in with the Chargers fans that are not so cocky right now. I know how quickly things can change and I've been through too many lean years to count on us ripping through the league with the monster schedule we have to face. Also, there is no doubt the division is going to be much tougher next year and the potential impact of the Chiefs' draft and acquiring of Surtain is pretty obvious. With that being said however, I find it funny that some are taking us lightly also. We did go 12-4 last year and lost games to Indy in overtime and Atlanta by 1 point on the road when we were winning for 90% of the game. We are probably also one of the deepest young teams in the league from top to bottom and we seem to really have taken steps to address our biggest weakness last year (pass rush) with what would seem to be a pretty good draft. We also get our #1 receiver back (Caldwell) who was off to a great start last year before getting hurt, and McCardell will be with us for a full year and TC instead of coming off the street to start 7 games. Perhaps even more importantly, LT will not be hobbled for 10 weeks with a groin injury like last year(knock on wood). Antonio Gates is also no mirage and teams starting double teaming and keying on him during the second half of last year. He is a nightmare matchup on 3rd down and in the red zone. Brees is also not asked to do anything extraordinary in our offense. His biggest improvement was simply cutting down on mistakes....throwing balls away instead of throwing into double coverage to try to make a play, etc. Defensively we have 3 first rounders and 1 high second round pick playing corner...all of whom are young and improving. Jammer has been fairly solid for us, and Drayton Florence is stepping up to be a good compliment. Our pass rush should definately be improved with Castillo and Merriman...this is what will help our pass defense the most. Our run D was #2 in the NFL last year and the addition of another 300 pounder to the line and a freak like "lights out" won't hurt that. It's all speculation now, but I think it will boil down to the Chargers and Chiefs for the division with the Broncos being right there the entire way. The Raiders still have too many gaping holes on defense to keep up with the other three all year, although they'll be a nuisance to everyone. This may be the most competitive and exciting AFC West we have ever seen. May the best team win.
Posts: 62