Heavy hitters see downtown stadium as linchpin

[jiveturkey]

I think that this will make it easier to accomodate a new Arrowhead. A dowtown stadium would also be a lot more fun IMO.

http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascity/

With Bistate II defeated, KC business leaders spot an opening

By KEVIN COLLISON

The Kansas City Star


The quest for a downtown ballpark is on, with the Downtown Council expected to take the first swing today and City Manager Wayne Cauthen on deck.

Cauthen was a top city official in Denver during the 1990s and saw how downtown redevelopment benefited from the construction of Coors Field. Cauthen said this week in an interview that the momentum of the current building boom in downtown Kansas City should lead people to believe similar results could be achieved here.

“I've seen it happen before,” Cauthen said. “We here in Kansas City are getting ready to experience a renaissance, and I think things tend to mushroom. When people see this and that can-do attitude that we have in the city, people will say, ‘Gosh, that's a no-brainer.' ”

The Downtown Council, an organization of influential business and property owners, plans to officially announce its support for a ballpark at its annual luncheon today at the Kansas City Marriott Downtown. The group commissioned a $100,000 downtown ballpark feasibility study earlier this year, but kept it under wraps at the request of supporters of the Bistate II initiative.

Bistate II would have financed extensive renovations of Kauffman and Arrowhead stadiums to keep the Royals and Chiefs there under newly extended leases, but voters rejected it this month.

“Now, the Downtown Council believes that our greater community should take some time to consider other alternatives, including the possibility of a new downtown baseball park for the Kansas City Royals,” the organization said in a news release.

The group said it expected to have a full-fledged proposal that includes financing options ready to present to the Royals and the public sometime next month.

“At that time, more economic information about the concept will be made available to the public for an open community discussion of the idea,” the group said.

The endeavor faces formidable obstacles, among them: determining a politically palatable way to finance the estimated $330 million cost, persuading Jackson County to relinquish its decades-long grip on the Royals at Truman Sports Complex and convincing Royals owner David Glass it's the right move for his club over the long term.

Backers are confident they'll be able to find solutions to all those problems. They're also convinced that moving the Royals would not only be good for downtown economic development but for the team's financial future as well.

“When you look at the best interests of the ball team, it's selling tickets,” said Andi Udris, president and CEO of the Economic Development Corp. of Kansas City. “Who better to sell more tickets than downtown businesses? Employees and clients can finish their day, have dinner and go to a ballgame to cap it off.”

Glass, who was in Southern California on business, said in a telephone interview that the new initiative had caught him off-guard.

“I'm totally out of the loop on this,” he said. “But I think if there was a real plan to be considered that I would have heard about it.”

Mike Gorris, senior vice president for business operations for the Royals, said he had had discussions with downtown ballpark supporters last summer but was unaware of the renewed effort.

“Our focus has been on bistate,” Gorris said. “Now, our focus is on the master plan to determine an exact schedule of work to be done on Kauffman Stadium.”

The Downtown Council said its research had found downtown ballparks generally generate better weekday attendance than do outlying ballparks and are more attractive to corporate suite owners and corporate season ticket holders.

“These are the factors why 15 of 17 new downtown baseball parks since 1990 have been constructed as part of downtown revitalization,” the organization said.

While no potential sites are expected to be mentioned today, two locations were studied by Downtown Council consultants earlier this year. One was at the north end of the Crossroads area, around 16th and Main streets, and the other was on the north edge of the central business district, around Seventh and Wyandotte streets.

The Crossroads location already is running into opposition from some property owners in the area.

Also the Urban Society of Kansas City, a new group formed to advocate better urban planning and design in the city, wants to participate in the ballpark discussion. It is proposing to examine five potential downtown sites and make recommendations to the city.

Besides the two sites that have been studied, the Urban Society of Kansas City plans to examine potential sites at Washington Park, across from Crown Center; a site southeast of Ilus W. Davis Park on the east side of the downtown loop; and a site in the 18th and Vine area.

In a letter to Kansas City Council members, David E. Scott, the president of the Urban Society of Kansas City, said his group wanted to ensure an unbiased and public process for reviewing the concept.

“In so doing, we hope to enrich the discussion, broaden community participation and increase support for any ultimate direction taken by the city on this matter,” he wrote.

Cauthen said a crucial question confronting supporters is financing. That means deciding whether the project would be something the city could attempt on its own or whether it would have to partner with Jackson County or, perhaps, the entire metropolitan area.

The Downtown Council statement referred to the ballpark initiative as being something the “greater community” should consider, but it didn't offer specifics.

“The things I want to deal with right now are looking at the structure, what are the best taxes for us to deal with and how much of the commitment should be public versus private,” Cauthen said.

A prime potential revenue source discussed earlier this year was increasing the cigarette tax, he said, but that idea may have to be reviewed in light of the current push to ban smoking in bars and restaurants in Kansas City.

The city manager did say that if other metropolitan communities were asked to help finance a downtown ballpark, it would be appropriate for the Jackson County Sports Complex Authority to expand its board.

“We all talk about one Kansas City and regionalization,” he said.

“It's going to be important for all of us to work together as one region to make sure these amenities stay in this area.”

The consultants hired by the Downtown Council earlier this year were the Barrett Sports Group LLC of Los Angeles and Jacobs, Chase Frick, Kleinkopf & Kelly LLC, a Denver law firm.

Their credentials include work on Coors Field and on Petco Field, the new downtown ballpark in San Diego.

Cauthen also said that Rick Horrow, a national expert who was working with the city on the Sprint Center downtown arena project, also would be asked to review the proposal.

Kansas City Councilman John Fairfield, a strong supporter of downtown baseball, thinks a plan should be ready in short order to present to the public.

“I've been working with a number of individuals, fine-tuning the numbers,” he said. “We need a plan that's practical, easy for the public to understand and one we can take to the Royals. That all has to happen pretty quickly.”

As to when downtown ballpark advocates plan to talk to Glass, Cauthen said only when they're satisfied they have a strong case.

“We have to get our proposal together, get our act together … and have that meeting with Mr. Glass to tell him these are our intentions and hope there's back and forth with him.”

[KCN]

Originally Posted by ENDelt260

Those Kansas folks want somethin'... let 'em have a soccer only stadium.

I'm not a big soccer fan or anything... but, I think their field is slightly different than a baseball field.

Right I meant if Kauffman were to be razed, to build one there.

I'm cool w/ a Kansas location too. But it would be nice to get them out of Arrowhead wherever they go. I've been to a several wizards games, including one w/ record breaking attendance, and a significant crowd still seems tiny when dwarfed by that huge empty stadium.

[Logical]

Originally Posted by KCN

Downtown handles thousands of commuters every day just fine (relative to other cities). As if highway infrastructure is any better near TSC? It's not as if people zip on out of that parking lot....we sit there forever trying to get out. A downtown location would scatter parking among several existing and soon-to-be built garages in the area. Front page of today's star is talking about all the new garages coming to the south loop area with thousands of new spaces. On top of that, a downtown location will give fans the option of sticking around after the game so that not everyone has to leave at the exact same time.

If I recall correctly and it has been a while parking for the Royals is like 5 or 6 bucks. When that goes downtown it will be between 12 and 20 like happened here in San Diego. You will see how much worse it is to get in and out of than TSC if they ever move downtown.

[KCN]

Originally Posted by ENDelt260

Oh, gotcha. I've seen talk on here before of converting the K to a soccer stadium... which just doesn't work in my brain. (Then again... I don't work for HOK, so what do I know?)

I'm kinda thinking through this as I type... but, if the K is gonna be knocked down... and we're gonna spend money on a "new" home for the Chiefs... I'd start to lean towards something brand new and done right. You've got a site for it... there's no need for interruption in games at the current Arrowhead (tho... I suppose there's a possibility of contruction and whatnot taking up some of the parking lot if the timing is wrong...)

I dunno... I like the current Arrowhead... and would like to keep it... but, it seems that in that situation, a new one would just make more sense. You're provided a perfect opportunity to do something great.

I was thinking the same, much like the cards are doing....just build one adjacent while games are still being played in the old one.

The idea has also been thrown out to put a new Arrowhead down by Kemper/American Royal (or even replace Kemper), where tailgating would tie in with the American Royal BBQ and the stockyard history. I haven't put much thought into this idea at all to decide if it's even feasible.

[Logical]

Originally Posted by KCN

I was thinking the same, much like the cards are doing....just build one adjacent while games are still being played in the old one.

The idea has also been thrown out to put a new Arrowhead down by Kemper/American Royal (or even replace Kemper), where tailgating would tie in with the American Royal BBQ and the stockyard history. I haven't put much thought into this idea at all to decide if it's even feasible.

If you had ever gone to a game that had 12,000 at Kemper you would know it is not feasible to have a 65K venue with paring on that site. It took 2 to 3 hours to enter and exit the site at Kemper. It would be impossible to get all the cars that are on site at a Chiefs game into and out of that area.

[Logical]

Originally Posted by ENDelt260

When parking downtown for D'Backs games, you can park for $5 or $10 (depending on how close you are... if you're in a garage, etc.)

It goes up for the playoffs, of course.

I haven't been to a Royals game in years, but I'm sure parking at TSC for those games is more than $5 by now.

Might be, Padres parking the last year at the Q (two years ago) was only $6. I was assuming KC would be about that or less.

[KCN]

Originally Posted by ENDelt260

When parking downtown for D'Backs games, you can park for $5 or $10 (depending on how close you are... if you're in a garage, etc.)

It goes up for the playoffs, of course.

I haven't been to a Royals game in years, but I'm sure parking at TSC for those games is more than $5 by now.

I think it's $8, seems to go up every year.

[KCN]

Originally Posted by Vlad Logicslav

If you had ever gone to a game that had 12,000 at Kemper you would know it is not feasible to have a 65K venue with paring on that site. It took 2 to 3 hours to enter and exit the site at Kemper. It would be impossible to get all the cars that are on site at a Chiefs game into and out of that area.

Sounds about right.

[tk13]

IIRC Parking at the K is $8. I would expect that if they were to move downtown it'd be 10-12 bucks like Cardinals games are.... but then again I guess that'd depend on if the parking garages were independently owned and what those people (who may not have any sports "common sense" at all) think they should charge....

[kc rush]

Originally Posted by Vlad Logicslav

baseball will never fix its problems because it only takes 4 or maybe 5 owners to block any initiative for change. The big money owners will always block the changes and keep all the revenue. The luxury tax is a pitance for the Yankees, Cubs, Red Sox, Braves, Dodgers etc. You are dreaming if you actually believe MLB will ever be fixed. Mark my words if a downtown stadium is built in KC after the first year attendance will plummet due to inadequate highway infrastructure and parking problems. KC is a car city, it will not change in our lifetimes.

The Yankees were the only ones to vote against the last CBA. The Red Sox have been complaining about salaries and have been looking to unload unreasonable contracts (Manny Ramirez), the Braves are no longer owned by Ted Turner and they have been taking steps to be more fiscally responsible, I've heard complaints from Dodgerland because they are scaling back. The owners are starting to get it (except Steinbrenner) and it is moving in the right direction. It may take some years, but I believe that it is closer than you think.

KC is a car city, part of the reason is because it is decentralized and not practical to jump on 5 busses to get from point A to B. If downtown was the major center of activity for the city mass transit would work.

[KCN]

Originally Posted by kc rush

KC is a car city, part of the reason is because it is decentralized and not practical to jump on 5 busses to get from point A to B. If downtown was the major center of activity for the city mass transit would work.

Yup. The mentality of Kansas Citians is no different than anywhere else. People want what's easiest, and when KC has several major attractions downtown, people will be wanting an alternative and easier solution to the car. When I'm in Chicago, DC and New York I take public transportation because it's much easier than driving. Hell, here in College Station half of us take off campus buses to class since parking is such a mess.

[KCN]

Originally Posted by ENDelt260

Hell, that ain't bad.

Nah, but it's one of the only events I can think of where parking costs more than the game itself (if you sit in the "Hy Vee" section)

[kc rush]

Originally Posted by ENDelt260

Haha. Meanwhile they have the second highest payroll in baseball.

New owner, new GM. They have a lot of free agents this year, it will be interesting to see what kind of money the spend to replace those people. The Red Sox will still be a higher payroll team, but they may be a good indicator of what is to come for MLB in general.

[Brando]

Originally Posted by ENDelt260

That is kinda funny.

Tho, it wouldn't surprise me if I've paid $10 for parking at some point to sit in a $6 seat at a D'Backs game.

Shit..there are some mighty fine watering holes down by the Bob. I would just drunk drive my car into one of those and stay the night.

[Brando]

Originally Posted by ENDelt260

I've got a buddy who lives down in them parts. Last few times I got drunk in downtown, I just crashed on his couch.

I really gotta go get drunk with him downtown again sometime... if I ever get the fuck out of Tucson.

I spent a few hours in Tuscon on my way to Nogales (sp). It came accross as the AH of AZ. Definitely could have just been the area we stopped in.
Now Nogales is a whole nother story for when we have beers. It's amazing what you can get from a stripper for $15 down there.

[Brando]

Originally Posted by ENDelt260

I went into the wrong titty bar. I must've blown $200 in the Nogey titty bar I partied in.

Granted... I had a really good time.

I couldn't believe that they were actually clean and hot. I think the beers were like a buck fitty. Of course the bouncer tried to sell me blow in the bathroom and there was some crazy old guy from Wisconsin pulling his pud in front of everyone too.