It's interesting how bitter the fans are now...

[jAZ]

Carl and Herm are staying... ok, that's expected.
The Chiefs are going to go "young"... ok, that did start this year.
Carl doesn't want to win a SB, and never did... I doubt that.
"Rufus" says we aren't going to sign any FA's... well, that makes sense if we plan to build through the draft.

I guess I understand that this season was disappointing... and I agree that the last the 5 year plan was a constant failure for nearly 20 years now.

But the irrationalism is reaching an all time high.

• I believe without a doubt that Herm and Carl both want win a superbowl.
  
• Carl has no desire to go out embarassed by his last few years... if for n other reason, his massive ego will force him to try one last time to win the SB.
  
• Herm has wanted to rebuild from the ground up from the day he arrived. We as fans and by proxy, Carl as Herm's boss forced him to accept DV's legacy roster. Sounds like Herm will finally get everything he wants.
  
• Because his hands have been somewhat tied by DVs legacy, Herm will have his first and likely last chance to field a team as he always wanted it to be. I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt for one last season.
  
• If there is anyone in our organization's history that I would want trying to build our team through the draft, it's Herm. Not sure I want him coaching those players on game day, but that's another story.

Whatever the outcome, I do think that Herm and Carl are doing what they think is required to win a Superbowl in KC. I hope they get it figured out. I'm not counting on it, but I'm going to support it.

[suds79]

Originally Posted by jAZ

* I believe without a doubt that Herm and Carl both want win a superbowl.

* Carl has no desire to go out embarassed by his last few years... if for n other reason, his massive ego will force him to try one last time to win the SB.

I personally think the people who think Carl doesn't want to win a SB are idiots. Why not?

But that's never been the correct question if Carl wants to win a SB. The question is "Can Carl WIN a SB?" The history and recent performance (last 10 years) overwhelmingly says no.

So I'm not going to support them keeping the guy.

That's why I'm fine with us stinking it up until the end of the 2009 season when Carl is finally gone. It really doesn't matter until then. We'll acquire a bunch of high 1st round draft picks and maybe the new GM and pick it up from there to where we'll actually have a chance.

[milkman]

Originally Posted by Baby Lee

- how old do you think Brees is?

As you know, I am certainly not a Marty fan, but even I recognize the stupidity of that critisism.

I mean look at all the young QBs drafted by the Chiefs in Marty's 10 years and all the success they managed to achieve after they got out of KC.

That Marty just stunted their development, clearly.

[RJ]

Originally Posted by jAZ

I can see Herm getting a 3 year clock from Clark.

But why should he?

[suds79]

Originally Posted by RJ

But why should he?

I think Herm should get a 3rd year because we all knew this type of season was coming no matter who the coach was after DV.

It's only one more year.

Besides, it's Carl who should be gone.

[jAZ]

Originally Posted by suds79

I think Herm should get a 3rd year because we all knew this type of season was coming no matter who the coach was after DV.

It's only one more year.

Besides, it's Carl who should be gone.

To be clear, I'm suggesting that (barring a the team quitting on him next season) we will have Herm for a total of 4 years, and maybe more.

Last season + this season + 2 more years of Carl + maybe even 1 more year after Carl retires (if progress is demonstrated in the next 2).

[jAZ]

Originally Posted by RJ

But why should he?

You can expect he will draft well during that time, and that's key to rebuilding through the draft. Worst case is that he leaves demonstrating he's a better GM than a HC... and he's restocked the Chiefs with young talent for the next HC.

[jAZ]

Originally Posted by mlyonsd

Sad thing now is next year we'll be arguing whether or not the team is going in the right direction when we finish 6-10.

That's to be expected if we are actually going to build from the ground up now.

[FAX]

I still think it's remarkable that we went from a dominating, top-ranked offense to this embarrassment in only two years.

Honestly, I think I'm still in shock, peeps.

FAX

[Dave Lane]

Originally Posted by the Talking Bong

and what has Carl done in the last 15 years to demonstrate that he has the first ****ing clue about how to build a Championship team?


just another Dufus article...fans are dumb, Carl is smart...give him another 5 years to solve the problems (that he created...oops! not supposed to say that...)


Carl is THE problem. As long as we ignore that, we will end up with the same result: Nothing.

Almost totally agree except that Herm is the coaching version of Carl. Until he goes the future for a superbowl is blocked.

Dave

I very rarely agree with you jAZ but with few exceptions, I do today.

I believe that most head coaches are capable of winning a superbowl under the right circumstances. Obviously, Belechick did not have the right circumstances in Cleveland. Herm does not in KC - currently. I don't know exactly what is going to change Herm's hand here but I think the departure of Carl would help. I'm not fond of Herm's philosophy or many of his decisions but I do acknowledge that he's been dealt a very difficult hand.

I'm not necessarily a Herm backer but I don't think we've seen Herm with the necessary tools to be successful in today's NFL. If he's provided the tools and still fails I'll be in with the lynch mob. Until then, we have to understand what a legitimate rebuilding feels like - this is it. Anger isn't going to help anything. This team isn't going to be competitive until at least 2009. Accept it. Hope for the best.

[Brock]

As far as gameday coaching goes, I don't see why anyone thinks Herm is even adequate. He isn't. It's obvious.

[mlyonsd]

Originally Posted by jAZ

That's to be expected if we are actually going to build from the ground up now.

Right, but I'm just saying that measuring the success of rebuilding will be one of the new themes on the planet that is debated to death.

[jAZ]

Originally Posted by Phobia

I very rarely agree with you jAZ but with few exceptions, I do today.

I believe that most head coaches are capable of winning a superbowl under the right circumstances. Obviously, Belechick did not have the right circumstances in Cleveland. Herm does not in KC - currently. I don't know exactly what is going to change Herm's hand here but I think the departure of Carl would help. I'm not fond of Herm's philosophy or many of his decisions but I do acknowledge that he's been dealt a very difficult hand.

I'm not necessarily a Herm backer but I don't think we've seen Herm with the necessary tools to be successful in today's NFL. If he's provided the tools and still fails I'll be in with the lynch mob. Until then, we have to understand what a legitimate rebuilding feels like - this is it. Anger isn't going to help anything. This team isn't going to be competitive until at least 2009. Accept it. Hope for the best.

Agreed 100%.

[mlyonsd]

Originally Posted by Phobia

I very rarely agree with you jAZ but with few exceptions, I do today.

I believe that most head coaches are capable of winning a superbowl under the right circumstances. Obviously, Belechick did not have the right circumstances in Cleveland. Herm does not in KC - currently. I don't know exactly what is going to change Herm's hand here but I think the departure of Carl would help. I'm not fond of Herm's philosophy or many of his decisions but I do acknowledge that he's been dealt a very difficult hand.

I'm not necessarily a Herm backer but I don't think we've seen Herm with the necessary tools to be successful in today's NFL. If he's provided the tools and still fails I'll be in with the lynch mob. Until then, we have to understand what a legitimate rebuilding feels like - this is it. Anger isn't going to help anything. This team isn't going to be competitive until at least 2009. Accept it. Hope for the best.

If rebuilding is defined as an incompetent GM hiring a coach that has basically done nothing in his career and allowed him to destroy an offense using the philosophy that they score too fast, which in turn drags us down to the bottom of the NFL for several years so we can "get younger" through the draft and then fire said coach after about 4 years of sucking, and then hire a coach that knows what they're doing we might be on the right track.

It's called the Oakland plan and they have a head start on us.

I know, I'm one of the bitter ones. But I don't see us as rebuilding yet, we're still in full fledged free fall.

Originally Posted by Brock

As far as gameday coaching goes, I don't see why anyone thinks Herm is even adequate. He isn't. It's obvious.

True. He's been terrible. I don't know if that's because he's stupid or because he's in a bad situation though. If he's stupid, there's no hope. If it's situational we might be okay in the long run. In either case, it's certainly painful to be a Chiefs backer ATM.