Chiefs He's not Cassel, he's Deberg. - Page 5

Chris Meck · 02-28-2013, 11:21 AM

at least, I'd say that's his floor. Either way, it's not good enough to go the distance, which is what we're all pissed about, right?

I assume that Reid thinks he can take Smith to the next level, and perhaps he can. Let's be really clear about the 9'er offense: Kaepernick flourishes for a few physical reasons, and as a centerpiece of the read-option. Smith, being a traditional pocket passer, just ran the normal NFL style offense there. Yes, they ran the ball and played defense-they still do that with Kaepernick. Yes he gets more yardage as the defense has to play him differently. He's also a freak athlete and runs for a lot of yards.

My point is that it's possible Reid CAN get more production out of Smith. It also seems that Reid and Dorsey are unimpressed with Geno and the rest of the possible first round crew. Maybe not though. Maybe they've got a trade down plan in place and have possible partners in line.

The thing that bothers me the most is if they really did give up a #2 and not just swap #2's then we lose the opportunity for a Nassib/Emanuel/Dysert type project. Possibly even a shot at Barkley, who might fall due to the injury.

**DaFace** · 02-28-2013, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

So we are trading two high picks, including a conditional pick next year based on the performance of the QB we are trading for, but he's not the QB they are ultimately targeting to lead this franchise?

Thus, we are either spending two second round picks on a backup or the first overall pick on a backup?

This is what you honestly believe is possible?

You have to have two things for an argument to proceed: people with potentially sharable assumptions and individuals who operate within the bounds of rational discourse.

So rather than sign Matt Moore or Matt Hasselbeck as a stopgap, we're going to TRADE two second round picks for a guy that no one wanted last year, and on top of that he's either the guy, in which case 1.1 could be a backup QB to eventually take over for him even though we tied Smith's compensation to performance for a team that, if he isn't the guy, would need picks to rebuild.

Why is it anathema to consider the fact that the Hunt family wants this team to make money over all else? Look, 8-8 makes them assloads, because gullible fools will chase blind hope.

Does this not look like an attempt to immediately get to 8-8 as soon as possible?

Are you winning a SB with Alex Smith?

What then, is the purpose of this move?

This isn't a difficult train of thought to follow, nor is it convoluted.

I'll say it boldly: THE OWNERSHIP OF THIS TEAM DOES NOT GIVE ONE ****ING SHIT ABOUT ITS FANBASE OR THE RESULTS ON THE FIELD AS LONG AS THE RESULTS ARE GOOD ENOUGH TO ENSURE STH RENEWALS AND CONCESSIONS.

1. The trade was less than other recent trades for vet QB's. I think it was high too, but technically we don't even know what the trade IS yet. If it turns out that we just swapped 2nd's and included a conditional for next year, that's about the equivalent of a mid-2nd rounder (this year) in terms of the value chart.

2. Alex is on a two-year contract. If he signs a Cassel-esque contract before he plays a game for us, I'll be pissed too. For now, it's entirely possible that we'll draft a young QB and give him a couple years behind Alex to grow in to the position. The 49ers just did the exact scenario you are basically saying can't happen.

Again, if we make all of your assumptions, then I don't disagree that it's a path I'm not a fan of. Again, I just don't see the point in even watching the team if you're going to assume that they're never going to prove you wrong. If you're at that point, I honestly don't know how you can keep watching - there's no point.

COchief · 02-28-2013, 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

1-14 on third down in that game. 1-14.

97 QB rating against the Giants D, 2 TDs, zero picks.

I'm not saying the guy is elite, but it's pissing me off to continually see him compared to Kasl, can you even imagine what type of game captain-shit-pants would turn in in that situation? I can, it's called the playoff game vs the Ravens.

I'll concede that 1-14 is pretty rough though.

He is not the best in the NFL, but he is nowhere near as bad as all the drama queens are making him out to be. He is also without a doubt better than Geno Smith at this point and time it's my opinion that will not change.

**DaFace** · 02-28-2013, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

We just shot down this ****ing rumor thirty minutes ago

http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showt...59#post4717259

I can play that game too. Here's the poll from that year.

http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=183909

Opinions were pretty mixed.

**ChiTown** · 02-28-2013, 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaFace

Charles wasn't very popular either.

Stop. This is about our total ineptitude as it relates to committing to drafting and developing a QB. Period. By trading for Smith, we are just prolonging that glorious track record of QB suckage that this Organization has so proudly shoved in their fans faces.

'Hamas' Jenkins · 02-28-2013, 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaFace

1. The trade was less than other recent trades for vet QB's. I think it was high too, but technically we don't even know what the trade IS yet. If it turns out that we just swapped 2nd's and included a conditional for next year, that's about the equivalent of a mid-2nd rounder (this year) in terms of the value chart.

2. Alex is on a two-year contract. If he signs a Cassel-esque contract before he plays a game for us, I'll be pissed too. For now, it's entirely possible that we'll draft a young QB and give him a couple years behind Alex to grow in to the position. The 49ers just did the exact scenario you are basically saying can't happen.

Again, if we make all of your assumptions, then I don't disagree that it's a path I'm not a fan of. Again, I just don't see the point in even watching the team if you're going to assume that they're never going to prove you wrong. If you're at that point, I honestly don't know how you can keep watching - there's no point.

1. No one has made any suggestion or intimation that this isn't a 2nd plus another conditional third that can move up to a second. That was what Sheffter reported, other reports were conjecture based on the fact that it was an egregious overpayment, not based on information from primary sources.

2. The 49ers drafted that QB in the second round. I guess with our second round pick we could...oh, wait. Well, we also have a thir--.

3. I'm not watching anymore. If March 12 hits and this trade goes through as reported, I'm done with this team. Done. I understand why other people will continue to watch them, because it's a form of local identity, but I'm done with subsidizing billionaires who treat their customers like vermin.

ReynardMuldrake · 02-28-2013, 01:27 PM

Alex is Deberg, and this franchise is the Titanic.

'Hamas' Jenkins · 02-28-2013, 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaFace

I can play that game too. Here's the poll from that year.

http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=183909

Opinions were pretty mixed.

50% gave it an A and 44% gave it a B/C and one guy gave it a D/F.

How is that mixed at all?

**Reaper16** · 02-28-2013, 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaFace

So you're saying that leadership shouldn't necessarily make moves that the fans approve of and that there are times when they may make moves that are unpopular but that may be in the best interest of the team?

Yes. Of course.

**DaFace** · 02-28-2013, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

50% gave it an A and 44% gave it a B/C and one guy gave it a D/F.

How is that mixed at all?

How's Dajuan Morgan working out? Or Dorsey for that matter?

**DaFace** · 02-28-2013, 01:32 PM

Anyway, I'm done for today. There's only so much arguing you can do when the people who agree with you are too scared of being chastized to post (though I think it's odd that they're OK with repping people silently for it).

As I've said before, ChiefsPlanet has become Fox News. The circle jerk is so strong that people assume everyone else is completely wrong and are surprised when things don't go their way.

'Hamas' Jenkins · 02-28-2013, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by COchief

97 QB rating against the Giants D, 2 TDs, zero picks.

I'm not saying the guy is elite, but it's pissing me off to continually see him compared to Kasl, can you even imagine what type of game captain-shit-pants would turn in in that situation? I can, it's called the playoff game vs the Ravens.

I'll concede that 1-14 is pretty rough though.

He is not the best in the NFL, but he is nowhere near as bad as all the drama queens are making him out to be. He is also without a doubt better than Geno Smith at this point and time it's my opinion that will not change.

I don't think you get it.

Better than Cassel is not good enough. Better than Geno Smith right now is not the goal.

Everyone knows that the Chiefs will be better in 2013 with Alex Smith than a rookie QB.

I was under the impression that the point of sports was to win championships. Geno Smith has the projected talent to do that. Alex Smith couldn't do that with arguably the best OL in the NFL, a great running game, a top three coach, and a top three defense.

Thus, logic dictates he can't win a Super Bowl either. Therefore, he, like Cassel before him, is a waste of time.

Cassel finishes last in the 100m at the Olympics. Alex Smith finishes fifth.

What's the ****ing difference?

'Hamas' Jenkins · 02-28-2013, 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaFace

How's Dajuan Morgan working out? Or Dorsey for that matter?

That's related to Jamaal Charles approval rating exactly how?

'Hamas' Jenkins · 02-28-2013, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaFace

As I've said before, ChiefsPlanet has become Fox News. The circle jerk is so strong that people assume everyone else is completely wrong and are surprised when things don't go their way.

That's just bullshit. That's a passive aggressive attempt to marginalize someone else's opinion because you can't have a substantive debate with supporting evidence.

I'm sorry that there is no evidence to suggest that Alex Smith will win with the Chiefs. Look at the landscape of the NFL.

However much you may want that to be true, it doesn't change what is true.

'Hamas' Jenkins · 02-28-2013, 01:36 PM

Finally, I have no doubt that a plurality of Chiefs fans support this move. Look at what else they've supported.

oldandslow · 02-28-2013, 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

I don't think you get it.

Better than Cassel is not good enough. Better than Geno Smith right now is not the goal.

Everyone knows that the Chiefs will be better in 2013 with Alex Smith than a rookie QB.

I was under the impression that the point of sports was to win championships. Geno Smith has the projected talent to do that. Alex Smith couldn't do that with arguably the best OL in the NFL, a great running game, a top three coach, and a top three defense.

Thus, logic dictates he can't win a Super Bowl either. Therefore, he, like Cassel before him, is a waste of time.

Cassel finishes last in the 100m at the Olympics. Alex Smith finishes fifth.

What's the ****ing difference?

Geno Smith has that projected talent by whom - You and a bunch of other fanboys...Everyone else is saying he is a middle of the first round pick at best.

Alex Smith came very close to getting the 9'ers to the promised land...

logic says he can do so again....

02-28-2013, 11:21 AM
Chris Meck MVP Join Date: May 2001 Location: midtown KC Casino cash: $1604910	He's not Cassel, he's Deberg. at least, I'd say that's his floor. Either way, it's not good enough to go the distance, which is what we're all pissed about, right? I assume that Reid thinks he can take Smith to the next level, and perhaps he can. Let's be really clear about the 9'er offense: Kaepernick flourishes for a few physical reasons, and as a centerpiece of the read-option. Smith, being a traditional pocket passer, just ran the normal NFL style offense there. Yes, they ran the ball and played defense-they still do that with Kaepernick. Yes he gets more yardage as the defense has to play him differently. He's also a freak athlete and runs for a lot of yards. My point is that it's possible Reid CAN get more production out of Smith. It also seems that Reid and Dorsey are unimpressed with Geno and the rest of the possible first round crew. Maybe not though. Maybe they've got a trade down plan in place and have possible partners in line. The thing that bothers me the most is if they really did give up a #2 and not just swap #2's then we lose the opportunity for a Nassib/Emanuel/Dysert type project. Possibly even a shot at Barkley, who might fall due to the injury.
Posts: 17,574

02-28-2013, 01:27 PM	#66
ReynardMuldrake 2 Legit 2 Colquitt Join Date: Sep 2010 Casino cash: $4175754	Alex is Deberg, and this franchise is the Titanic.
Posts: 4,719

02-28-2013, 01:32 PM	#70
DaFace Kind of a mod Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Donkey Land Casino cash: $1616899	Anyway, I'm done for today. There's only so much arguing you can do when the people who agree with you are too scared of being chastized to post (though I think it's odd that they're OK with repping people silently for it). As I've said before, ChiefsPlanet has become Fox News. The circle jerk is so strong that people assume everyone else is completely wrong and are surprised when things don't go their way.
Posts: 52,019

02-28-2013, 01:36 PM	#74
'Hamas' Jenkins Now you've pissed me off! Join Date: Jan 2006 Casino cash: $7929572	Finally, I have no doubt that a plurality of Chiefs fans support this move. Look at what else they've supported. __________________ "When the Know-Nothings get control, it will read 'all men are created equal, except negroes, and foreigners, and Catholics.' When it comes to this I should prefer emigrating to some country where they make no pretense of loving liberty – to Russia, for instance, where despotism can be taken pure, and without the base alloy of hypocrisy.”--Abraham Lincoln
Posts: 74,855