Chiefs Since we are ready to throw out Thiggy why not go grab Cassel - Page 6

Red Dawg · 12-18-2008, 09:26 PM

in FA? No way they tag him for 8 mil. We've got the cash, he's young, got the size, the arm and has a full year under his belt. That's better to build around at this point than a junior class qb with no experience. Granted our team is less talented than the Pats but he will only get better and would probably jump at the chance to call a team his own.

I like Thiggy but he doesn't have the size and strength of a Manning type player. We could probably get a good pick for him and keep Gray as a back up.

**MahiMike** · 12-19-2008, 11:50 AM

So you don't want to pay a guy that's proven himself in this league but you'd love to draft a QB in the top 5? You guys kill me. How many times do I have to tell you - never draft a QB! Get your franchise guy via free agency. Draft picks are coin flips. Free Agents are proven commodities.

I say if they go after Pioli, they package his salary with that of Cassel's. Tell Pioli "here's a bundle of money for both of you. You decide how much to pay Cassel".

BigChiefFan · 12-19-2008, 11:54 AM

Just say NO to Scott Mitchell.

Sully · 12-19-2008, 11:59 AM

Don't know if it's been mentioned yet, but.....

Scott Mitchell.

Chieftain58 · 12-19-2008, 12:05 PM

I agree.. Thiggy is doing fine.. We need a pass rush....

TRR · 12-19-2008, 01:25 PM

I'm all for Tyler Thigpen in 2009. I'm not completely sold on this years draft class anyways. Especially after Detroit takes Stafford #1. I think you get the best player available, and draft a QB in the later rounds to compete.

Brock · 12-19-2008, 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MahiMike

So you don't want to pay a guy that's proven himself in this league but you'd love to draft a QB in the top 5? You guys kill me. How many times do I have to tell you - never draft a QB! Get your franchise guy via free agency. Draft picks are coin flips. Free Agents are proven commodities.

I say if they go after Pioli, they package his salary with that of Cassel's. Tell Pioli "here's a bundle of money for both of you. You decide how much to pay Cassel".

Brad Johnson FTW

Amnorix · 12-19-2008, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MahiMike

So you don't want to pay a guy that's proven himself in this league but you'd love to draft a QB in the top 5? You guys kill me. How many times do I have to tell you - never draft a QB! Get your franchise guy via free agency. Draft picks are coin flips. Free Agents are proven commodities.

I say if they go after Pioli, they package his salary with that of Cassel's. Tell Pioli "here's a bundle of money for both of you. You decide how much to pay Cassel".

errr...since Cassell's salary is subject to the cap and Pioli's isn't, that makes no sense at all.

FringeNC · 12-19-2008, 01:38 PM

It'll be interesting to see what the new GM thinks about Thigpen after watching the tape. I'm guessing that trying to figure out what we have in Thigpen will be one of the first tasks of the new GM.

I'm higher on Thigpen than a lot of posters.

Sully · 12-19-2008, 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FringeNC

It'll be interesting to see what the new GM thinks about Thigpen after watching the tape. I'm guessing that trying to figure out what we have in Thigpen will be one of the first tasks of the new GM.

I'm higher on Thigpen than a lot of posters.

He's not all that tall. I bet a ton of posters are higher than Thigpen.

Wait...you said...never mind

Amnorix · 12-19-2008, 01:45 PM

Not that I am Bill Walsh or anything, but here's my take on Cassell:

1. Hadn't start a game since HS until this season. Was thrown into it without notice when Brady's knee was blown up as you guys know. Played basically very poorly for a good month and OBVIOUSLY had trouble making second/third reads, feeling the pass rush, and releasing the ball in good rhythm.

2. Over the second half of the season, he has greatly improved. He's twice the QB he was. More like 10x. He still has NO long-ball touch worth talking about, however. That's a matter of timing which he hasn't yet developed with his WRs. That he can't hit Randy MOss streaking down the sidelines is very disheartening, as he's missed him several times even when wide open behind the entire defense.

3. He's VERY athletic. Not quite John Elway / Steve Young, but he's got a very strong arm, and is quick to move around.

4. His read progression has become much faster, and his ability to move in the pocket and sense the rush has really come along also.

5. IMHO, his long-run ceiling should be within the top half of starting QBs in the NFL. It's impossible to project whether he can actually develop into a top 5 or whatever QB at this point, but the strides he has made this season have been phenomenal. When you compare it to what he was the first month of the season, there's no comparison.

For now, he's really just a Chad Pennington short-range passer who can run a bit and has a stronger arm that is useless because he can't hit anybody downfield. In time, however, I think that will come.

His current production is the same as the Pats in 2001 when Brady first started out -- lots of flanker screens and short passes. The Pats have over 50% of their passing yardage on YAC, and are tops in the league on that front in large part because of Wes Welker (love that guy). With time, however, just as Brady did, I think he has every potential to round out his game and be a very good QB.

Slight downside is that next season he'll already be 27. So a second year player is entering his physical peak years, and his mental ability may not be there yet. He may be 30 before he puts it all together and becomes REALLY damn good, if he ever does that. It gives him a moderately shorter shelf life as a starting QB than someone younger might provide.

**HemiEd** · 12-19-2008, 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PastorMikH

Thigpen is doing great for the level of competition he had in college, the experience had coming into this season, and the group of players he shares the field with.

He has accounted for 18 TDs this season - last season we had 24 offensive TDs as a team - and he hasn't played the full season. Since the bye week, his QB rating is 86.3 - that's within 1 point of McNabb, Favre, Cassel, and Eli Manning, not to mention that he's put up more rushing yards than any of those 4 playing less games.

I'd like to see Thigpen get some more experience under his belt and also see how many wins this team could generate with Brady back, Bowe learning to catch, a RB that can run AND block, and a D that can actually force the other team to punt once in a while.

We've been talking about how we want a "Franchise QB" since Green got his bell rung. Tyler is stepping up and playing decently and actually showing potential to be a solid QB and we want someone else.

I'm not opposed to drafting, but no way does Thiggy get a fair chance to compete against a QB taken in the top 5 of a draft. I fear we're going to toss another Gannon aside looking for a stud that turns out to be a dud.

Well said Pastor! The grass is always greener on the other side of the CPlanet fence.

**HemiEd** · 12-19-2008, 02:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mecca

I'd like to see Tyler Thigpen display proper footwork and be able to play from under the center.

Really, I had realized Tyler playing under center, was a concern of yours.

**HemiEd** · 12-19-2008, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reerun_KC

Cheaper and less risk are the reasons we have never won anything meaningful from Marty til now....

Taking less risks means your franchise sucks...

uh sure, lets not learn anything from previous mistakes.

Brock · 12-19-2008, 03:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HemiEd

uh sure, lets not learn anything from previous mistakes.

Yeah, it didn't work that one time 25 years ago, so let's never try that again.

Sweet Daddy Hate · 12-19-2008, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mecca

No..just No, Cassell is a product of playing with 2 of the best WR's in the league and a great system.

He's inconsistent too. And to be like that with the level of protection he is afforded? No thanks. PASS!

Quote:

Originally Posted by KCFalcon59

Let Detroit grab him. Please.

That would be sweet, yes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by philfree

Who's throwing out Thigpen? Even if we draft Stafford or Bradford or any QB anywhere in this draft I'd keep #4. He'd be my starter going into camp and hopefully into the season. Why should we burn bridges and why should we put all our eggs in one basket?

If we draft a QBOTF, he will be holding a clipboard while Thigpen get's another season to prove himself. Win-Win.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mecca

I expect an NFL QB to be able to do those things, the guy I watch play for my college team does it.

Yes he does.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mecca

Who do you think plays better from under center Tyler Thigpen or Mark Sanchez....hell Sanchez has good footwork.

It's pretty bad when USC has a more pro style offense than the Chiefs do.

The latter. And yes, yes it is.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sedated

I'm sorry, I just can't buy someone's opinion on a USC QB when they are obviouly the biggest USC homer in the history of chiefsplanet.

For the love of God and the LAST TIME; Mecca is NOT a USC Homer.

Is anyone, anywhere, pimping Sanchez as much as our own mr. usc/self-
proclaimed draft expert?

Yes, right here; ME. Mark is the total package and if he declares, we take him assuming Matt has already been cherry-picked.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Flopnuts

I'd also like to see him throw the deep ball with better accuracy.

This.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Demonpenz

Cassel is another trent dilfer Brad johnson, can we stop F-ing around and get a franchise qb or atleast try for olathe's sake

It's time.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brock

Yeah, it didn't work that one time 25 years ago, so let's never try that again.

It's a new day, and **** the past. Time to grow balls.

12-18-2008, 09:26 PM
Red Dawg Going home eventually Join Date: Dec 2002 Casino cash: $4542858	Since we are ready to throw out Thiggy why not go grab Cassel in FA? No way they tag him for 8 mil. We've got the cash, he's young, got the size, the arm and has a full year under his belt. That's better to build around at this point than a junior class qb with no experience. Granted our team is less talented than the Pats but he will only get better and would probably jump at the chance to call a team his own. I like Thiggy but he doesn't have the size and strength of a Manning type player. We could probably get a good pick for him and keep Gray as a back up.
Posts: 30,472

12-19-2008, 11:50 AM	#76
MahiMike He's Mahomie! Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Jax, FL Casino cash: $10023443	So you don't want to pay a guy that's proven himself in this league but you'd love to draft a QB in the top 5? You guys kill me. How many times do I have to tell you - never draft a QB! Get your franchise guy via free agency. Draft picks are coin flips. Free Agents are proven commodities. I say if they go after Pioli, they package his salary with that of Cassel's. Tell Pioli "here's a bundle of money for both of you. You decide how much to pay Cassel".
Posts: 17,387

12-19-2008, 11:54 AM	#77
BigChiefFan MVP Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: In the Top 10 Casino cash: $9924205	Just say NO to Scott Mitchell. __________________ A 35 year drought can make you thirsty.
Posts: 15,777

12-19-2008, 11:59 AM	#78
Sully It Goes On Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Lees Summit Casino cash: $10026331	Don't know if it's been mentioned yet, but..... Scott Mitchell. __________________ "And I don't wish that girl any bad luck," he said, "but I hope she gets hit with a car." - Tommy Lasorda
Posts: 18,295

12-19-2008, 12:05 PM	#79
Chieftain58 Fan club member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Land of OZ Casino cash: $10005117	I agree.. Thiggy is doing fine.. We need a pass rush.... __________________
Posts: 1,626

12-19-2008, 01:25 PM	#80
TRR The Priest and I Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: CO Casino cash: $9870185	I'm all for Tyler Thigpen in 2009. I'm not completely sold on this years draft class anyways. Especially after Detroit takes Stafford #1. I think you get the best player available, and draft a QB in the later rounds to compete.
Posts: 7,262

12-19-2008, 01:38 PM	#83
FringeNC MVP Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: NC Casino cash: $1486014	It'll be interesting to see what the new GM thinks about Thigpen after watching the tape. I'm guessing that trying to figure out what we have in Thigpen will be one of the first tasks of the new GM. I'm higher on Thigpen than a lot of posters.
Posts: 10,173

12-19-2008, 01:45 PM	#85
Amnorix In BB I trust Join Date: May 2003 Location: Boston, Mass. Casino cash: $10029808	Not that I am Bill Walsh or anything, but here's my take on Cassell: 1. Hadn't start a game since HS until this season. Was thrown into it without notice when Brady's knee was blown up as you guys know. Played basically very poorly for a good month and OBVIOUSLY had trouble making second/third reads, feeling the pass rush, and releasing the ball in good rhythm. 2. Over the second half of the season, he has greatly improved. He's twice the QB he was. More like 10x. He still has NO long-ball touch worth talking about, however. That's a matter of timing which he hasn't yet developed with his WRs. That he can't hit Randy MOss streaking down the sidelines is very disheartening, as he's missed him several times even when wide open behind the entire defense. 3. He's VERY athletic. Not quite John Elway / Steve Young, but he's got a very strong arm, and is quick to move around. 4. His read progression has become much faster, and his ability to move in the pocket and sense the rush has really come along also. 5. IMHO, his long-run ceiling should be within the top half of starting QBs in the NFL. It's impossible to project whether he can actually develop into a top 5 or whatever QB at this point, but the strides he has made this season have been phenomenal. When you compare it to what he was the first month of the season, there's no comparison. For now, he's really just a Chad Pennington short-range passer who can run a bit and has a stronger arm that is useless because he can't hit anybody downfield. In time, however, I think that will come. His current production is the same as the Pats in 2001 when Brady first started out -- lots of flanker screens and short passes. The Pats have over 50% of their passing yardage on YAC, and are tops in the league on that front in large part because of Wes Welker (love that guy). With time, however, just as Brady did, I think he has every potential to round out his game and be a very good QB. Slight downside is that next season he'll already be 27. So a second year player is entering his physical peak years, and his mental ability may not be there yet. He may be 30 before he puts it all together and becomes REALLY damn good, if he ever does that. It gives him a moderately shorter shelf life as a starting QB than someone younger might provide. __________________ "I love signature blocks on the Internet. I get to put whatever the hell I want in quotes, pick a pretend author, and bang, it's like he really said it." George Washington
Posts: 43,125