Intruder calls 911, afraid homeowner may have gun

[Deberg_1990]

http://www.cnn.com/2011/CRIME/03/08/...ex.html?hpt=T2



This time it was the intruder who called 911.

A man who broke into a house in Portland, Oregon, called police -- afraid the homeowner may have a gun.

The suspect, Timothy James Chapek, was in the bathroom taking a shower when the homeowner returned to the house Monday night, Portland police said in a statement.

Accompanied by two German shepherds, the homeowner asked Chapek what he was doing in the house.

Chapek locked himself in the bathroom and made an emergency call, police said. He said he had broken into the house, the owner had come home, and that he was concerned the owner might have a gun.

The homeowner also called the police to report that he had found a man in the house.

Police with dogs took Chapek, 24, into custody "without incident," they said. He was booked for criminal trespass.

They did not say if the homeowner did in fact have a gun.

[Jenson71]

Originally Posted by KC Fish

The internet tough guys act like it's an easy clear cut thing, to be in position to take another man's life in the heat of the moment.

It's a tough thing to do. And it's even tougher to get the blood stains out of your carpet.

[Radar Chief]

Originally Posted by salame

why the **** was he showering?

PCP? I’ve heard it makes the body over heat that’s why most guys you see on those Cops shows hopped up on PCP are naked and looking for water to bath in.

[MOhillbilly]

Originally Posted by Just Passin' By

Yes, it pretty much does, actually. The extent of that depends upon the state. The key, as is so often the case, if to be found in "reasonable".

Texas is a great example of this.

try that shit in missouri and the jury might you hand your some prison time. Im not talkin outta my ass. My brother, stone solid, is a sheriff and gave the the straight breakdown.
you shoot a mother****er in missouri, in your home, without provocation, your ass could land in jail.

noone believes in 'pay to play' more than i do. But in these situations there are two sides to the coin.

[BigRichard]

Originally Posted by kcfanXIII

Big Richard... That instance you were outside. Its different inside one's home. Had you and your buddies walked into the home instead of knocking on the window, he would have every right to blow you away. Tragic? yes. Illegal? Absolutely not. And my guess is the old man missed on purpose.

We were invited by the girl so no he would have had no right to do so... according to the cops anyway.

[Just Passin' By]

Originally Posted by MOhillbilly

try that shit in missouri and the jury might you hand your some prison time. Im not talkin outta my ass. My brother, stone solid, is a sheriff and gave the the straight breakdown.
you shoot a mother****er in missouri, in your home, without provocation, your ass could land in jail.

noone believes in 'pay to play' more than i do. But in these situations there are two sides to the coin.

As I said, the permutations vary by state. Here, take a gander at the Texas version:

http://www.rc123.com/texas_castle_doctrine.html

As another example, Florida abolished the retreat requirement outside of the home a few years back, and now has a general standard of "reasonable belief they are in danger of death or great bodily harm" even outside the home.

[Chiefnj2]

If someone is using your dam shower, just walk out and call the cops. You aren't going to feel that good about defending your castle when no real threat exists, or the guy/gal has some serious mental issue.

[MOhillbilly]

Originally Posted by Just Passin' By

As I said, the permutations vary by state. Here, take a gander at the Texas version:

http://www.rc123.com/texas_castle_doctrine.html

As another example, Florida abolished the retreat requirement outside of the home a few years back, and now has a general standard of "reasonable belief they are in danger of death or great bodily harm" even outside the home.

your quote"reasonable belief they are in danger of death or great bodily harm" is afairly broad term and thats my point.

[kcfanXIII]

http://www.learntocarry.com/docs/CastleDoctrine.html

mo's castle doctrine.

Btw, i never said shoot first ask questions later.

[milkman]

Originally Posted by salame

why the **** was he showering?

After robbing the house, he was hoping to make a clean getaway.

[suds79]

Originally Posted by milkman

After robbing the house, he was hoping to make a clean getaway.

I'm kinda ashamed to admit this because it was that cheesy but it made me laugh.

nice.

[WV]

Originally Posted by KC Fish

The internet tough guys act like it's an easy clear cut thing, to be in position to take another man's life in the heat of the moment.

I don't see it so much as an internet tough guy situation as much as how it relates to this particular article. This guy was in your shower, broke into your house and decided he was going to shower. Obviously kicking in your bathroom door open with guns blazing is irresponsible, but I also don't think it relates to alot of examples it's trying to be compared to either.

This joker is already in your house and broke in to get there. There is no longer any question of intent or mistaken identity. If anyone deserves or is asking for a slug to the gut it's this guy. Obviously all situations are not the same, but this one isn't that difficult. The guy in the article decided to take his chances with a criminal in his bathroom, someone else may have decided he needed a little more lead in his diet. Both cases can be justified.

Oh and you didn't mention it, but the Castle Doctrine in WV covers you out to your porch. If the person is unarmed you may not fair so well, but if you can prove the act of trying to enter through force you'd most certainly be good.

[Just Passin' By]

Originally Posted by MOhillbilly

your quote"reasonable belief they are in danger of death or great bodily harm" is afairly broad term and thats my point.

I noted that back when I first responded to you:

Originally Posted by Just Passin' By

Yes, it pretty much can, actually. The extent of that depends upon the state. The key, as is so often the case, is to be found in the interpretation of "reasonable".

Texas is a great example of this.

I don't know that anything more needs to be said on the subject, other than to note that your brother may have been talking about what the law was prior to the recent passage of the updated version. The Missouri version of the law is here:

http://www.learntocarry.com/docs/CastleDoctrine.html

[chopper]

Originally Posted by MOhillbilly

try that shit in missouri and the jury might you hand your some prison time. Im not talkin outta my ass. My brother, stone solid, is a sheriff and gave the the straight breakdown.
you shoot a mother****er in missouri, in your home, without provocation, your ass could land in jail.

noone believes in 'pay to play' more than i do. But in these situations there are two sides to the coin.

MO Revised Statutes - Section 563.031 (google this b/c CP doesn't let n00bs post links - or play in the arcade or casino it turns out)

Here is the MO statute regarding the castle doctrine. Hillbilly is right, you don't have the obligation to retreat if you're in your home, but the burden of proof is on the shooter to prove that deadly force is necessary. Might be hard to do if the other party is dead. If you ever kill an unarmed man in your house, you better at least sprinkle some crack on his dead body.

[Just Passin' By]

Originally Posted by chopper

MO Revised Statutes - Section 563.031 (google this b/c CP doesn't let n00bs post links - or play in the arcade or casino it turns out)

Here is the MO statute regarding the castle doctrine. Hillbilly is right, you don't have the obligation to retreat if you're in your home, but the burden of proof is on the shooter to prove that deadly force is necessary. Might be hard to do if the other party is dead. If you ever kill an unarmed man in your house, you better at least sprinkle some crack on his dead body.

2. A person may not use deadly force upon another person under the circumstances specified in subsection 1 of this section unless:

(1) He or she reasonably believes that such deadly force is necessary to protect himself or herself or another against death, serious physical injury,[ rape, sodomy or kidnapping or serious physical injury through robbery, burglary or arson] or any forcible felony; or

(2) Such force is used against a person who unlawfully enters, remains after unlawfully entering, or attempts to unlawfully enter a dwelling, residence, or vehicle lawfully occupied by such person.

As a bit of follow up, here's an article on the subject written by Dan Terry, who's the assistant police chief in New Haven (or was at the time of the writing in 2010):

Not only your home, but your vehicle is covered under the law, allowing you to use deadly force against carjackers.

And in reference to the lawsuits such as mentioned above, the law states: "a person who uses force as described . . . is justified in using such force and such fact shall be an absolute defense to criminal prosecution or civil liability." It goes on to say "The court shall award attorneys' fees, court costs, and all reasonable expenses incurred by the defendant in defense of any civil action if absolute defense is found." Revised Statutes of Missouri, 563.073

If you're inside your own home, and some derelict sneaks in through a window, breaks down the door, or in some way unlawfully enters your castle, you may assume he is there to offer you or someone inside physical violence, and may react with deadly force, but only in your home or vehicle.

http://www.ngnn.com/65041/content/20...astle-doctrine

[Bwana]

Originally Posted by Just Passin' By

If you're inside your own home, and some derelict sneaks in through a window, breaks down the door, or in some way unlawfully enters your castle, you may assume he is there to offer you or someone inside physical violence, and may react with deadly force, but only in your home or vehicle.

Cool, I guess if I catch someone breaking in to my garage, I will just have to beat their ass with a pipe wrench until I can drag them into the house to shoot them.