12 Trapped Miners in West Virginia discussion

[nychief]

Grief, anger as all but one miner found dead
Initial reports indicated 12 had survived

Wednesday, January 4, 2006; Posted: 10:25 a.m. EST (15:25 GMT)
TALLMANSVILLE, West Virginia (CNN) -- For three hours overnight, families of a dozen trapped West Virginia miners thought their loved ones were coming home as church bells rang to welcome them.

But by 3 a.m. Wednesday -- as one critically ill survivor was rushed to a hospital -- families learned that their thankful jubilation was premature.

There had been a tragic "miscommunication," said mine company chief Ben Hatfield. Twelve of the 13 trapped miners had not made it. They were dead. (Watch angry relatives react -- 3:21)

Anna Casto, who lost her cousin, angrily disagreed with Hatfield's use of the term "miscommunication."

"No, he strictly told us they was alive," Casto said. "Three hours later he come back and said they wasn't."

"We want to know why, and how people can get by with this," she said.

"I just want that immediate family to get some kind of satisfaction, to get some kind of answers." (Full story)

Casto said the tragedy has shaken the faith of some in the community. "We have got some of us ... saying... that we don't even know if there is a Lord anymore," she said. "We had a miracle, and it was taken away from us."
3-hour delay

# 11:53 p.m. -- Church bells ring as reports first indicate that 12 miners have been found alive.

# 2:14 a.m. -- A man is rescued and taken to a nearby hospital in critical condition after being trapped underground for nearly 40 hours.

# 2:44 a.m. -- Miners' relatives say they had been told all but one of the miners were dead.

# 3:11 a.m. -- Hatfield, president and CEO of International Coal Group, which owns the Sago Mine, announces that despite previous reports, only one survivor was found in the mine. (Timeline)

Hatfield called it the "worst day of my life."
Critical condition

The sole survivor, Randal McCloy, 27, was in critical condition in intensive care Wednesday at Ruby Memorial Hospital in Morgantown.

"He suffered some collapse of one of his lungs," said Dr. Larry Roberts. "And we're trying to reopen that and there's good progress there."

Roberts said McCloy was sedated and attached to a breathing tube, but was moving and responding to stimuli.

"We hope that we will try to awaken him later today or tomorrow," the doctor said.
'Who do we tell?'

Hatfield said he knew within 20 minutes that an error had been made and that not all 12 were alive, but said he did not inform jubilant family members.

"We couldn't correct the information without knowing more about it," he told reporters. "Let's put this in perspective -- who do we tell not to celebrate? All I knew is, there weren't 12 people that were alive. It was somewhere between 12 and zero."

Hatfield said he understood family members' anger.

"I'm not surprised or upset with them. They certainly have some basis for their frustration, having been put through this emotional roller-coaster. I wouldn't wish that on anyone."

Hatfield said the miscommunication occurred between rescue crews and the command center, causing the earlier erroneous reports. (Watch the CEO's grim announcement -- 9:00)
Miners were alive after accident

Hatfield said it was apparent that the miners, who were found 13,000 feet into the mine, remained alive for a period of time following the explosion. They had built a "rough barricade structure," he said, and had donned their self-contained breathing apparatuses. The apparatuses held one hour of oxygen; Hatfield said he had no way of knowing how long the miners were alive.

The rescue team that found the miners was speaking to the command center over mine communication system on an open speaker audible to a number of people, Hatfield said. He noted the company made no formal announcement that the 12 were alive, but said he would not single out any rescuers, as they were trying to save the miners' lives.

"The honest answer is, we were devastated," he said. "It's sorrow beyond belief ... Welcome to the worst day of my life."
'Some wrong communications'

West Virginia Gov. Joe Manchin -- who flashed a thumbs-up on the steps of the church and said, "believe in miracles," after hearing the initial report that the 12 were alive -- called the situation "heart-wrenching." (Watch Gov. Manchin explain what may have caused the miscommunication -- 3:44)

He said he was in another room of the church with some family members when "we heard families in a euphoric state, and all the shouting and screaming and joyfulness." He asked what was happening, he said, and was told, "They found them. They're alive."

Manchin said he asked his communications people if they had confirmed that information, and they said no. But he was caught in the sea of jubilant relatives streaming out of the church, and the church bells began ringing, he said. He said he was "in a euphoric state, the same as they are."

It was about 20 minutes later, he said, when he also became aware of "some wrong communications." The delay in informing relatives, he said, came because officials were trying to get accurate information instead of adding to the confusion. He said he understood the family's pain, as his own uncle died in a 1968 mine accident.

"To put blame on anybody -- it's the wrong time, the wrong place," Manchin said. "Everybody has worked so hard. The rescue teams have worked around the clock. They've come from all over the country."

[Eleazar]

Originally Posted by Donger

If my agenda is pointing out that you and mememe have a history of this kind of crap in the face of tragedy, then yes.

[jAZ]

Originally Posted by Donger

...this kind of crap ...

nicely done... avoid saying exactly what you believe "this kind of crap" is... can't be held to acccount for what you don't explicitly say right?

[jAZ]

Originally Posted by Baby Lee

Serious question, does your visceral response to the families affect in any way your assessment of the BLPD crowd and the visceral response of some to them?

I've always viewed both in the same light. Emotional overreaction. However, it's possible to talk reasonably about both actions in their appropriate context.

[Donger]

Originally Posted by jAZ

nicely done... avoid saying exactly what you believe "this kind of crap" is... can't be held to acccount for what you don't explicitly say right?

I'm really not that duplicitous. I apparently just over-estimated you.

This kind of crap = focus not on the people in trouble or mourning the deceased, but on other things. For instance, focusing on how the families were acting irrationally and "losing sympathy" for them.

Your words.

[memyselfI]

Originally Posted by Donger

The very fact that you're even thinking about it, let alone writing about it, proves the point.

At least you're consistent.

Oh, so now you are a mind reader?

The only reason I mentioned the chronicle of events was to point out the media is not culpable for initial transmission of false information. That information had to come from someone inside the mine. Those people would be either mine company employees and/or rescuers.

Again, it's too easy to assign blame. But at this point based on the series of events that has been described it's easy to see the media will not be rightful target of blame here...

contrary to the early trend by some on this board to do so.

Again, no blame has been assigned by me contrary to your thinking what I'm thinking.

[Donger]

Originally Posted by memyselfI

Oh, so now you are a mind reader?

No. It's called logic. Unless, of course, you can type without thinking.

[memyselfI]

Even Rush Limbaugh has changed his tone since he's heard the chronology of the events. The first hour of his show he had a MSM blamefest.

[Inspector]

Originally Posted by jAZ

Nicely done.

You are using a disaster to score personal/political points on a message board.

Classy move.

Wha...?

We can get POINTS????

I didn't know that.

[Baby Lee]

Originally Posted by jAZ

I've always viewed both in the same light. Emotional overreaction. However, it's possible to talk reasonably about both actions in their appropriate context.

Thank you. Can we now dispense with the absurd idea that those who refute such emotional overreactions are simply sheep?

[KCTitus]

Originally Posted by Donger

No. It's called logic. Unless, of course, you can type without thinking.

Of course she can...you READ her posts, yes?

[jAZ]

Originally Posted by Baby Lee

Thank you. Can we now dispense with the absurd idea that those who refute such emotional overreactions are simply sheep?

As per usual, the devil is in the details of what you are saying. There is a lot of "Bush Lied" discussion that's entirely legit. In fact the comparison to this discussion of "lying" is a complete joke. I'm not going to (re)start the actually discussion there, but let's just try to agree that the possibility of the powers that be deliberately lying about the life/death status of 12 people is not even remotely similar to the possiblity of the powers that be deliberately lying about the case for a disputed war.

Those who are whole cloth trying to stop such a discussion should NOT be given a free pass to dismiss such a discussion.

If your comments are limited strictly and precisely to the narrow minorty who use slogans like "bush lied people died" for effect, then I've never disputed that.

Like I said, the devil is in the details.

[Chief Henry]

Originally Posted by memyselfI

I can completely understand the families outrage. Especially given the fact that of the 200 violations this company was cited for last year, over 90 of them were serious and/or safety violations. Obviously the families had EVERY reason to be skeptical of what the officials from the mine tell them.

It seems the sad irony here is in their haste to believe in a miracle they did not remember these officials are the very same people they've come to suspect since the accident.

Just an all around horrible situation. I hope the officials of the mine are prosecuted if they knowingly, even inadvertantly, sent these guys into their deaths.

Just wondering who she's placing the blame on right here !!!

[tk13]

I would say that I think I could defend the media's action in this particular case because the governor himself was going around giving thumbs up talking to the families celebrating the "miracle". I think that made the media outlets pretty confident that they had the right info, when the governor of the state is going around and saying this is going on.

[jAZ]

Originally Posted by Donger

I'm really not that duplicitous. I apparently just over-estimated you.

This kind of crap = focus not on the people in trouble or mourning the deceased, but on other things. For instance, focusing on how the families were acting irrationally and "losing sympathy" for them.

Your words.

If that's all your point is, then have at it. I don't see that as even remotely a bad thing.

But your comparison to the Katrina thing is bogus at best. Your point of outrage before wasn't that we were talking about some side issue while the bodies were still warm (as you put it), it was that you were outraged it was being politicized while the bodies were still warm. That you are trying to distance the conversation from the political angle you tried to take regarding Katrina says about all I need to know, I guess.

Your comparison is bogus and was made flippantly. Now that you realize you are acting as shallow as you accuse me of acting, you are stuck looking like a hypocrite or purveyor of fake outrage. Neither is particularly flattering.

[Taco John]

Originally Posted by memyselfI

The only reason I mentioned the chronicle of events was to point out the media is not culpable for initial transmission of false information.

The media is most certainly culpable for the transmission of false information to their audience. Rather than waiting for the official sources to give them the correct information... rather than confirming their story with more than just one source, they ran with a rumor. It's the same stuff that people are rallying against Athan for with regards to Chiefs news. If people are that mad over Chiefs news not being right, they sure as hell are going to get angry when it's a matter of life and death.

The media was terribly irresponsible.