Prayer Request Heartbreaking and very upsetting story - Page 9

KingPriest2 · 03-29-2010, 11:25 PM

To anyone that is a parent this would be very devasting Im a very proud father of my kids and when I read this story and saw the boys picture my heart broke Especially considering the guy that killed him had 16 prior arrests

Keep his family in your prayers

http://www.kansascity.com/2010/03/29...tal-wreck.html

**Lzen** · 03-31-2010, 08:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KCChiefsMan

I'm sure the guy will be driving again in a few months.

This will be when I wish every city had themselves a Dexter.

Are you volunteering?

SDChiefs · 03-31-2010, 09:07 AM

Guy should be put down. And not humanely. Don't sterilize the needle. This is just another sign of law enforcement not doing their job. SIXTEEN. There is no way that guy shouldve been out to make this happen.

SDChiefs · 03-31-2010, 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by healthpellets

You're right. The prosecutor should be the judge, jury, and executioner. Hell, the defendant should just stand there with a gag in his mouth while the prosecutor convicts him.

We don't live in the Minority Report world, thank god. We can't just go around punishing people for crimes they may or may not commit. So if all the dude did was drive illegally 16 times, what are we supposed to do with that? Say "Oh, Mr. Illegal Driver, we know that you're about to kill a kid next week, so we're going to lock you up for a few days."

It's so easy for you to sit back behind your little computer screen and say that he should be "dispatched". What a cute little euphemism. Will you be the one to flip the switch?

And what about you? Ever driven after having a beer? Maybe two? What if you crashed in to a car and killed someone? Should you be dispatched as well?

At least a couple time the dude was arrested for PCP charges. I don't know about KC but here in Cali thats a felony charge and we have whats called a 3 strike rule. 3 times driving under the influence of PCP means lifetime prison term. What do you guys have? The 17 strike rule?

SDChiefs · 03-31-2010, 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by healthpellets

Maybe I wasn't clear. Driving with a suspended license doesn't hurt anyone. It's what you do once you're behind the wheel that hurts people. He got in a car high on PCP. Nothing was going to stop him. But you can't make any argument that once you're caught three times for DWS, that we should lock you up and throw away the key.

I have a childhood friend that hasn't had a license since he was 18. Made some mistakes. Still does. But he still drives and hasn't killed anyone. He has to get to work, and in his town, there is no bus route. He's a single guy that's tryin to make good. So he drives. He knows the risks, but also knows that his alternative is not going to work and getting hauled to the slammer for failing to pay child support. So he drives.

But in your little world, we should just lock him up for life after his third DWS because there may come a day where he might just get high on PCP and drive his car in to a crowded shopping mall. Or he might just do it with a license. The license makes no difference.

Maybe we should compare people that have three DWS convictions with another reviled group, child molesters. Hell, I'd bet most people on here would be highly in favor of locking up any child molester for the remainder of his/her life, regardless of the offense. However, if the recidivism rate is only 20%, how can you justify locking up the remaining 80% that will never offend again for the rest of their lives?

So let's say the recidivism rate of DWS offenders is 50% (just a number, don't know if it's accurate). But if only 10% of those repeat offenders ever cause any harm during a DWS episode, where's the justification in locking them up?

DWS amounts to a slap on the wrist. And it should. You're not harming society when you drive without a license. The State is pissed because either you haven't paid your fine, or undertaken the required rehabilitation (which the defendant has to pay for, which is hard to do if they can't get to work), but as for the rest of society...you're not hurting anyone.

You can't simply look at the result and then determine a proper punishment for the crime. That's like saying Jim bought a case of beer for his underage friend Bob, and then Bob took the beer to a party where it as consumed by Sarah, another underage friend. Sarah then drives her car in to a ditch seriously injuring herself and her friend Beth. Is it Jim's responsibility that Sarah committed a crime consuming the alcoholic beverage, and then committed another crime while driving under the influence? No, it's not.

But that's what society needs. They need a villain upon which to place blame. And our villain in this case is the justice system. If only the justice system worked....Well, it did work. Maybe not the way you wish it worked, but it worked the way it as intended.

Hell, what if this guy was instead a wealthy guy. And he didn't have any convictions, but had five prior DWI arrests. The difference being that he could afford proper counsel to fight and win the DWI charges. But he was drunk at the time of this accident. Would you then say that upon the fifth DWI arrest we should lock people up and throw away the key?

He could just as easily get a restricted license allowing him to drive to work and back and/or kids to school. Making excuses for people that intentionally do not follow the law is absurd. I have friends that have a suspended license and they drive OCCASIONALLY. Only because they can't afford to re-instate their license. But its only been a year or two tops. Not sure how old your friend is, but going since hes 18 Im assuming thats 10 years at least. In that time he could afford to pay said fines to get his license back.

Katipan · 03-31-2010, 09:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SDChiefs

He could just as easily get a restricted license allowing him to drive to work and back and/or kids to school. Making excuses for people that intentionally do not follow the law is absurd. I have friends that have a suspended license and they drive OCCASIONALLY. Only because they can't afford to re-instate their license. But its only been a year or two tops. Not sure how old your friend is, but going since hes 18 Im assuming thats 10 years at least. In that time he could afford to pay said fines to get his license back.

To be clear you never said that your friends weren't absurd, but it sure sounded like it.

Which would be pretty absurd considering the sentence before it.

SDChiefs · 03-31-2010, 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Katipan

To be clear you never said that your friends weren't absurd, but it sure sounded like it.

Which would be pretty absurd considering the sentence before it.

He lost his license because he gave money to his ex to pay an "illegal u-turn" ticket and she never paid it. Lapse of judgement. I know he should have paid it himself but thats not the point. He drives occasionally because he has a show and his ex would drive him and then get too wasted to drive back. Now you tell me, who should drive. The sober one who had their license revoked for an illegal u-turn. Or the licensed one who was shitfaced. Theres a difference between driving out of necessity and driving to work and the store and such.

Katipan · 03-31-2010, 09:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SDChiefs

He lost his license because he gave money to his ex to pay an "illegal u-turn" ticket and she never paid it. Lapse of judgement. I know he should have paid it himself but thats not the point. He drives occasionally because he has a show and his ex would drive him and then get too wasted to drive back. Now you tell me, who should drive. The sober one who had their license revoked for an illegal u-turn. Or the licensed one who was shitfaced. Theres a difference between driving out of necessity and driving to work and the store and such.

It sounds like you're making excuses for your friend doing illegal things. Which is fine. But you seem to be opposed to that sort of thing. Which makes your whole stance a little awkward.

SDChiefs · 03-31-2010, 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Katipan

It sounds like you're making excuses for your friend doing illegal things. Which is fine. But you seem to be opposed to that sort of thing. Which makes your whole stance a little awkward.

Not making excuses at all. He tries to follow the law but there are extenuating circumstances that might force him to have to drive. Unlike the guy I was quoting, whose friend goes about life as if he never lost his license. I don't get how you fail to see the difference in the circumstances.

Katipan · 03-31-2010, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SDChiefs

Not making excuses at all. He tries to follow the law but there are extenuating circumstances that might force him to have to drive. Unlike the guy I was quoting, whose friend goes about life as if he never lost his license. I don't get how you fail to see the difference in the circumstances.

lol you're right. It's so different. He can't get a girl that isn't a lush to drive him to work. He can't do enough shows that would allow him to pay to get his license back. He just goes about his life breaking the law. But hey at least he's got a good friend in you.

SDChiefs · 03-31-2010, 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Katipan

lol you're right. It's so different. He can't get a girl that isn't a lush to drive him to work. He can't do enough shows that would allow him to pay to get his license back. He just goes about his life breaking the law. But hey at least he's got a good friend in you.

Rationallity is not you strong suit. Ok, a serial killer is the same as someone who kills someone in self defense. Gotcha. Hes driven a handful of times in the two years since he lost his license he walks or rides a bike everywhere he goes. This other guy drives everywhere as if he never lost his license. But theyre the same situations. Thank God I don't live in AZ anymore.

Katipan · 03-31-2010, 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SDChiefs

Rationallity is not you strong suit. Ok, a serial killer is the same as someone who kills someone in self defense. Gotcha. Hes driven a handful of times in the two years since he lost his license he walks or rides a bike everywhere he goes. This other guy drives everywhere as if he never lost his license. But theyre the same situations. Thank God I don't live in AZ anymore.

I'm sure the state of Arizona is pretty happy about it too. And just in case you didn't know, justifiable homicide isn't illegal.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SDChiefs

Making excuses for people that intentionally do not follow the law is absurd.

SDChiefs · 03-31-2010, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Katipan

I'm sure the state of Arizona is pretty happy about it too.

I would hope so. If people from that state liked me then that would mean I was on their level. No morals and all.

Katipan · 03-31-2010, 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SDChiefs

I would hope so. If people from that state liked me then that would mean I was on their level. No morals and all.

NONE!!!

Crazy ass people. Nothing like Californians!

SDChiefs · 03-31-2010, 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Katipan

NONE!!!

Crazy ass people. Nothing like Californians!

I wouldn't say crazy. Most are pussies that think they are bad. In 18 years of living in Cali I have been into a fight with multiple people 1 time. In a year and a half in AZ 5 times. Not once did anyone fight me one on one. They think they are bad but can't back up anything without all their friends there. Bunch of lowlifes and druggies. The only people who like AZ are from AZ. Everybody and I do mean EVERYBODY I talked to there that was from another state hated it there. Thats pretty strong odds.

Katipan · 03-31-2010, 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SDChiefs

I wouldn't say crazy. Most are pussies that think they are bad. In 18 years of living in Cali I have been into a fight with multiple people 1 time. In a year and a half in AZ 5 times. Not once did anyone fight me one on one. They think they are bad but can't back up anything without all their friends there. Bunch of lowlifes and druggies. The only people who like AZ are from AZ. Everybody and I do mean EVERYBODY I talked to there that was from another state hated it there. Thats pretty strong odds.

I guess I'd be pretty bitter if I got my ass kicked too.

03-29-2010, 11:25 PM
KingPriest2 Super Grover Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: KCMO Casino cash: $9085135	Heartbreaking and very upsetting story To anyone that is a parent this would be very devasting Im a very proud father of my kids and when I read this story and saw the boys picture my heart broke Especially considering the guy that killed him had 16 prior arrests Keep his family in your prayers http://www.kansascity.com/2010/03/29...tal-wreck.html
Posts: 6,296

03-31-2010, 09:07 AM	#122
SDChiefs Veteran Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Americas Finest City Casino cash: $8190778	Guy should be put down. And not humanely. Don't sterilize the needle. This is just another sign of law enforcement not doing their job. SIXTEEN. There is no way that guy shouldve been out to make this happen.
Posts: 2,320