Chiefs "How" do the Chiefs win? - Page 2

SenselessChiefsFan · 09-10-2009, 12:09 PM

Okay, so even the most optimistic person on here would have to admit that the Ravens are the better team, at least on paper.

Perhaps, by some strange turn of events, the Chiefs are very talented and have just been grossly under coached over the last two years, but that has yet to be seen.

So, the only weakness on the Ravens defense I see is the corners. Only, you have to actually pass protect to take advantage of that.

The only weakness on the Ravens offense I see is Flacco. This kid took advantage of a good running game and having very little asked of him. I think he will be a good QB, but not great. I think he was able to catch the NFL off guard a little. I think the NFL will have more of a read on what he can do.

Clearly, the Chiefs are not going to run up a ton of points against that defense. I think the offense MUST stay patient and play field position. If the Chiefs can establish the run, even if they aren't just blowing open holes and creating long runs, I think they can take a couple of shots downfield.

On defense, the Chiefs need to make the Ravens earn every yard. I think the secondary can get a couple of INT's at the expense of a young QB who may become impatient.

He is a big mobile guy, but he also fumbles. The Chiefs have to get a few shots on him and get their hands on the ball.

Hey, if the Chiefs offense can keep from making mistakes, and if the defense can force the Ravens into making a couple mistakes... this could be a good game.

Either way, I don't 'think' the Ravens cover the spread. Not in their first game.

**Easy 6** · 09-10-2009, 12:38 PM

Its always easy for me to admire grounded optimism.

'Hamas' Jenkins · 09-10-2009, 12:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SensibleChiefsfan

About the only think I don't agree with is using a lot of sprint outs and boots.

I think they should concentrate more on three step drops and getting the ball out quickly. When they go deep, I think it should be PAP, perhaps a misdirection bootleg, but then the QB's back is turned to the line on many of those plays.... I at least want Cassel to see the train coming.

If the Chiefs load up on the line with a two tight set, and then run a PAP... I think they can take a shot or two downfield.

Three step drops aren't going to work against a team that is jamming your WRs and have 8-9 in the box.

**OnTheWarpath15** · 09-10-2009, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

Easier said than done.

The right 4/5 of our line is going to have to find a way to keep from getting caved in whenever the Ravens bring 4. Waters and Goff have huge assignments, as they are going to need to help Niswanger on every play, as Ngata will basically jam a shovel up Rudy's ass on every play they are 1 on 1.

Albert has to be trusted to be able to take Suggs 1 on 1 without any chips or max protect.

We are going to have to find a way to run the ball, most likely on the left side of the formation. We aren't going to get more than 3 ypc, but we need to make them honest.

We need to go over the top early with play action, because if their safeties are allowed to cheat up, it's all over. Unfortunately, we don't have a single receiver who is a legit deep threat.

We should probably use a lot of boots and sprint-right-option type plays to string out their defense and mitigate the lack of ability of our line to protect the pocket at the POA.

Tank Tyler is going to have to have an out of body experience, because if he's getting handled in one-on-ones by Birk, the guards and FB are going to crush our inside backers, and they will gash us up the middle all day. If he doesn't, Mike Brown will die by the second quarter.

Our CBs need to make a play on a short passing route. Flowers needs to be able to shut Mason down in 1 on 1s. We need to get creative in our blitzing schemes, otherwise, they can flare out Rice and Heap, and abuse Vrabel and Hali on the edges.

We need 1 or 2 breaks (fumbled exchange, muffed punt, Aborton-esque interception) and our coverage and kicking units need to be perfect. We may need a call or two.

That's pretty much the "how", and even then, it's tenuous.

Well, ****.

THAT'S IT?

I need to change my prediction.

'Hamas' Jenkins · 09-10-2009, 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

Well, ****.

THAT'S IT?

I need to change my prediction.

FAX · 09-10-2009, 12:47 PM

Defense.

1. Sack Flac. We have to put that dumbass on the ground. Early and often. If we can shake him up, we can potentially pick up an interception or two. Our offense needs the best field position possible to have a chance to win. I foresee a lot of blitzing. Hali and Mays need to have a good game and, when they get into the backfield, they need to finish.

2. Stop The Run. With our front 3, this isn't necessarily going to be easy. Clancy needs to have some run blitzes ready. Vrable is key.

3. Don't be afraid to play man to man. I think our young DBs can hang with their receivers. Especially if we're getting pressure on the QB. That will help delay Flacco's release and increase the possibility of planting his ass in the dirt.

3. Win Third Down. The defense has to hold their conversion percentage to a minimum. Along with turnovers, probably the most important statistic in this game.

4. Keep It Close. The Chiefs are probably in better physical condition than the Ravens. If we can keep it close into the 4th quarter, we have a chance.

Offense.

1. We have to be successful with the run game. With our o-line, the offense absolutely depends on it. No dives, please. Our center's asshole can't take much more of that. If we have a counter play in the book, I'd sure consider it. Run LJ right at the bastards behind Waters and Albert. Then, pull Waters and get the ball to Charles and Savage in space on the right side. Stretches and pitches to those guys.

2. Go Deep. Challenge their defensive backfield. Let's find out how much Samari has left.

3. No Turnovers. We only need one or two of those damn things to lose this game.

4. Make The FGs. This is a game that might well be decided by 1 or 2 points.

FAX

SenselessChiefsFan · 09-10-2009, 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

Three step drops aren't going to work against a team that is jamming your WRs and have 8-9 in the box.

Well, clearly, you have to mix it all up. However, the Chiefs have big strong WR's. They need to use that to their advantage.

Chiefs should run hitch and goes and slants. Obviously screen passes and draws as well.

The problem with sprint outs and bootlegs, is that the Ravens play a 3-4 and they have fast linebackers. I think it puts the QB more in harms way on average.

Big physical guys do a better job beating the jam at the line and getting YAC yards.

Lumpy68 · 09-10-2009, 12:49 PM

If the right tackle spot can get Cassel even moderate protection I think he can go after the corners with some out routes. AFTER we establish the run.

Jackson, Hali, and Vrabel need to get to Flacco and hit him hard every time.

Tank plugs the middle so they have to run outside the tackles and let the Linebackers mop up.

I predict Carr getting a pick 6, One of the other wideouts BESIDES Bowe will get two touchdown receptions, and Succop hits a 48 yarder as time expires. Chiefs win 24-21

**Buehler445** · 09-10-2009, 01:00 PM

Offensively, I think it depends on whose starting. If Croyle is starting, I Play Action bootleg him outside and bomb one on the first play. His arm can get it done, if someone can get the **** downfield. Completing that pass would certainly help the run open up *some*. After that, I move his ass around as much as possible to try to keep him from getting dead. If you think about the Bears preseason game last year (that's honestly the last time I saw him be very mobile...****ing Herm), dude can throw on the run, and he will need every bit of it with our OLine.

If Cassel starts, he's probably not well enough to be running much. If he is, great. If not, I think 3 step drops and short routes for Bowe are your friend with some PA mixed in. I don't try to throw a 20 yard pass without PA. I think Bowe can be effective if you allow him to use his body. Across the middle is something Haley stressed, which will be good, but I think short out routes are good too. It gives Bowe a chance to "block out" the defender. The thing I don't want to see more than 1 or 2 times is that Bubble screen to him that was used so much last year. Bowe isn't a quick cutting, agility guy. If they're playing off, sure. Let him get started and beat some bitches, but it is very ineffective when they are expecting it. Plus, I think a big reason for his drops were because he was thinking about running those plays because he isn't good at him. ****er's huge. Let him use it.
[/rant]

Anyway, on defense, I get as aggressive as possible and as tricky as possible. It was stated that he struggles with zone, that's prolly a must. I'd send someone every down, even run blitz some. In all likelyhood it will get us burned, but just lining up and beating these guys isn't going to happen. I'd try to jump as many routes as possible, if there is help over the top, and put as many hits on Flacco as possible. He's a big kid who can take hits, but you've got to find a way to get in his head. Leggett corner blitzes might be effective also. Without some big plays/3rd and longs from our D, this game probably isn't close, so I'd get aggressive.

What it's going to take is some luck.
Posted via Mobile Device

Chiefnj2 · 09-10-2009, 01:03 PM

Flacco has a good arm. If you blitz too much on defense he will exploit McGraw.

The Ravens game plan should be:
1. Run up the gut.
2. Short pass routes to the outside.
3. Play action toward McGraw.

CaliforniaChief · 09-10-2009, 01:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

Easier said than done.

The right 4/5 of our line is going to have to find a way to keep from getting caved in whenever the Ravens bring 4. Waters and Goff have huge assignments, as they are going to need to help Niswanger on every play, as Ngata will basically jam a shovel up Rudy's ass on every play they are 1 on 1.

Albert has to be trusted to be able to take Suggs 1 on 1 without any chips or max protect.

We are going to have to find a way to run the ball, most likely on the left side of the formation. We aren't going to get more than 3 ypc, but we need to make them honest.

We need to go over the top early with play action, because if their safeties are allowed to cheat up, it's all over. Unfortunately, we don't have a single receiver who is a legit deep threat.

We should probably use a lot of boots and sprint-right-option type plays to string out their defense and mitigate the lack of ability of our line to protect the pocket at the POA.

Tank Tyler is going to have to have an out of body experience, because if he's getting handled in one-on-ones by Birk, the guards and FB are going to crush our inside backers, and they will gash us up the middle all day. If he doesn't, Mike Brown will die by the second quarter.

Our CBs need to make a play on a short passing route. Flowers needs to be able to shut Mason down in 1 on 1s. We need to get creative in our blitzing schemes, otherwise, they can flare out Rice and Heap, and abuse Vrabel and Hali on the edges.

We need 1 or 2 breaks (fumbled exchange, muffed punt, Aborton-esque interception) and our coverage and kicking units need to be perfect. We may need a call or two.

That's pretty much the "how", and even then, it's tenuous.

Great analysis. I especially agree on two points...the need to go deep and our CB's taking away the short pass. I do think we have more speed on defense this year, which will help with open-field tackles.

I think we also need to be able to get pressure with the front four so that we can drop more guys back. If the only way to get to Flacco is with the kitchen sink approach, he'll fling it out and put us in the hole.

Jilly · 09-10-2009, 01:06 PM

Ravens' corners may be a weakness, but we match that with our wr deficit

**Buehler445** · 09-10-2009, 01:07 PM

****. Why is McGraw starting? Jesus.

The thing I forgot was to try and get the ball to Charles in space. IF he can get any space. It would be nice to hit something deep occasionally to keep the safeties back some. But Charles can potentially get some good yardage. Especially if Reed is helping on Bowe.
Posted via Mobile Device

tooge · 09-10-2009, 01:07 PM

The best way for the chiefs to win? That's easy. Put what is left of the cap on the under in vegas.

FAX · 09-10-2009, 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaliforniaChief

Great analysis. I especially agree on two points...the need to go deep and our CB's taking away the short pass. I do think we have more speed on defense this year, which will help with open-field tackles.

I think we also need to be able to get pressure with the front four so that we can drop more guys back. If the only way to get to Flacco is with the kitchen sink approach, he'll fling it out and put us in the hole.

Sadly, we are likely not going to be able to bring pressure with our front 3 (if, in fact, we actually run the 3/4, which isn't exactly guaranteed). The Chiefs have no alternative. We have to blitz if we're going to pressure Flacco. And, the fact of the matter is, regardless of how strong his arm is, it's difficult to throw a pass when your ass is on the ground 20 yards or so behind the LOS.

FAX

FAX · 09-10-2009, 01:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2

Flacco has a good arm. If you blitz too much on defense he will exploit McGraw.

The Ravens game plan should be:
1. Run up the gut.
2. Short pass routes to the outside.
3. Play action toward McGraw.

Hmmmm. If that's the case, why not consider bringing McGraw from the safety position?

We're going to have to run blitz anyway, in my opinion.

FAX

09-10-2009, 12:09 PM
SenselessChiefsFan MVP Join Date: Nov 2008 Casino cash: $10005450	"How" do the Chiefs win? Okay, so even the most optimistic person on here would have to admit that the Ravens are the better team, at least on paper. Perhaps, by some strange turn of events, the Chiefs are very talented and have just been grossly under coached over the last two years, but that has yet to be seen. So, the only weakness on the Ravens defense I see is the corners. Only, you have to actually pass protect to take advantage of that. The only weakness on the Ravens offense I see is Flacco. This kid took advantage of a good running game and having very little asked of him. I think he will be a good QB, but not great. I think he was able to catch the NFL off guard a little. I think the NFL will have more of a read on what he can do. Clearly, the Chiefs are not going to run up a ton of points against that defense. I think the offense MUST stay patient and play field position. If the Chiefs can establish the run, even if they aren't just blowing open holes and creating long runs, I think they can take a couple of shots downfield. On defense, the Chiefs need to make the Ravens earn every yard. I think the secondary can get a couple of INT's at the expense of a young QB who may become impatient. He is a big mobile guy, but he also fumbles. The Chiefs have to get a few shots on him and get their hands on the ball. Hey, if the Chiefs offense can keep from making mistakes, and if the defense can force the Ravens into making a couple mistakes... this could be a good game. Either way, I don't 'think' the Ravens cover the spread. Not in their first game.
Posts: 5,540

09-10-2009, 12:38 PM	#16
Easy 6 pie is never free Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: the drivers seat Casino cash: $3697775	Its always easy for me to admire grounded optimism.
Posts: 91,729

09-10-2009, 12:47 PM	#20
FAX testing ... 1, 2, 3 Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Tennessee Casino cash: $6753759	Defense. 1. Sack Flac. We have to put that dumbass on the ground. Early and often. If we can shake him up, we can potentially pick up an interception or two. Our offense needs the best field position possible to have a chance to win. I foresee a lot of blitzing. Hali and Mays need to have a good game and, when they get into the backfield, they need to finish. 2. Stop The Run. With our front 3, this isn't necessarily going to be easy. Clancy needs to have some run blitzes ready. Vrable is key. 3. Don't be afraid to play man to man. I think our young DBs can hang with their receivers. Especially if we're getting pressure on the QB. That will help delay Flacco's release and increase the possibility of planting his ass in the dirt. 3. Win Third Down. The defense has to hold their conversion percentage to a minimum. Along with turnovers, probably the most important statistic in this game. 4. Keep It Close. The Chiefs are probably in better physical condition than the Ravens. If we can keep it close into the 4th quarter, we have a chance. Offense. 1. We have to be successful with the run game. With our o-line, the offense absolutely depends on it. No dives, please. Our center's asshole can't take much more of that. If we have a counter play in the book, I'd sure consider it. Run LJ right at the bastards behind Waters and Albert. Then, pull Waters and get the ball to Charles and Savage in space on the right side. Stretches and pitches to those guys. 2. Go Deep. Challenge their defensive backfield. Let's find out how much Samari has left. 3. No Turnovers. We only need one or two of those damn things to lose this game. 4. Make The FGs. This is a game that might well be decided by 1 or 2 points. FAX
Posts: 44,492

09-10-2009, 12:49 PM	#22
Lumpy68 Starter Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Sylvan Grove Ks Casino cash: $10004900	If the right tackle spot can get Cassel even moderate protection I think he can go after the corners with some out routes. AFTER we establish the run. Jackson, Hali, and Vrabel need to get to Flacco and hit him hard every time. Tank plugs the middle so they have to run outside the tackles and let the Linebackers mop up. I predict Carr getting a pick 6, One of the other wideouts BESIDES Bowe will get two touchdown receptions, and Succop hits a 48 yarder as time expires. Chiefs win 24-21
Posts: 61

09-10-2009, 01:00 PM	#23
Buehler445 Supporter Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Scott City KS Casino cash: $2284734	Offensively, I think it depends on whose starting. If Croyle is starting, I Play Action bootleg him outside and bomb one on the first play. His arm can get it done, if someone can get the **** downfield. Completing that pass would certainly help the run open up some. After that, I move his ass around as much as possible to try to keep him from getting dead. If you think about the Bears preseason game last year (that's honestly the last time I saw him be very mobile...**ing Herm), dude can throw on the run, and he will need every bit of it with our OLine. If Cassel starts, he's probably not well enough to be running much. If he is, great. If not, I think 3 step drops and short routes for Bowe are your friend with some PA mixed in. I don't try to throw a 20 yard pass without PA. I think Bowe can be effective if you allow him to use his body. Across the middle is something Haley stressed, which will be good, but I think short out routes are good too. It gives Bowe a chance to "block out" the defender. The thing I don't want to see more than 1 or 2 times is that Bubble screen to him that was used so much last year. Bowe isn't a quick cutting, agility guy. If they're playing off, sure. Let him get started and beat some bitches, but it is very ineffective when they are expecting it. Plus, I think a big reason for his drops were because he was thinking about running those plays because he isn't good at him. *er's huge. Let him use it. [/rant] Anyway, on defense, I get as aggressive as possible and as tricky as possible. It was stated that he struggles with zone, that's prolly a must. I'd send someone every down, even run blitz some. In all likelyhood it will get us burned, but just lining up and beating these guys isn't going to happen. I'd try to jump as many routes as possible, if there is help over the top, and put as many hits on Flacco as possible. He's a big kid who can take hits, but you've got to find a way to get in his head. Leggett corner blitzes might be effective also. Without some big plays/3rd and longs from our D, this game probably isn't close, so I'd get aggressive. What it's going to take is some luck. Posted via Mobile Device*
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09-10-2009, 01:03 PM	#24
Chiefnj2 In Search of a Life Join Date: Mar 2007 Casino cash: $7873688	Flacco has a good arm. If you blitz too much on defense he will exploit McGraw. The Ravens game plan should be: 1. Run up the gut. 2. Short pass routes to the outside. 3. Play action toward McGraw. __________________ Mismanaging the clock.
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09-10-2009, 01:06 PM	#26
Jilly MVP Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Lee's Summit Casino cash: $10004925	Ravens' corners may be a weakness, but we match that with our wr deficit
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09-10-2009, 01:07 PM	#27
Buehler445 Supporter Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Scott City KS Casino cash: $2284734	***. Why is McGraw starting? Jesus. The thing I forgot was to try and get the ball to Charles in space. IF he can get any space. It would be nice to hit something deep occasionally to keep the safeties back some. But Charles can potentially get some good yardage. Especially if Reed is helping on Bowe. Posted via Mobile Device*
Posts: 56,795

09-10-2009, 01:07 PM	#28
tooge MVP Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Liberty, MO Casino cash: $3924112	The best way for the chiefs to win? That's easy. Put what is left of the cap on the under in vegas.
Posts: 14,998