Football Peter King: You have to go back to 1997 to find a draft like this one - Page 20

Deberg_1990 · 02-19-2013, 07:53 AM

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/nfl.../?sct=uk_wr_a1

You'd probably have to go back to 1997 to find a draft like this one. That's the year Peyton Manning eschewed the prospect of going to the Jets first overall to play for Bill Parcells and returned for his senior year at Tennessee. One quarterback (shaky Jim Druckenmiller, 26th) picked in round one. Two backs (Warrick Dunn 12th and Antowain Smith 23rd) in round one, and four receivers in the first: Ike Hilliard seventh, Yatil Green 15th, Reidel Anthony 16th and Rae Carruth 27th. Yikes! What a horrible draft for point-producers. One star, Dunn, out of seven first-rounders.

That could repeat this year. It's likely Alabama's Eddie Lacy will be the only running back taken in round one. Tennessee's Cordarrelle Patterson leads the muddled pack at wide receiver, but how sure can you really be of junior-college transfers who play one year of major-college football, which is Patterson's profile?

The quarterbacks are a total mish-mosh at this point. One GM interested in acquiring a quarterback this offseason told me over the weekend, "I expect more attention on the quarterbacks throwing this year than on any other single thing at the Combine.'' Some think Geno Smith of West Virginia will go first overall to quarterback-needy Kansas City; one personnel man who studied all the top quarterbacks for a team in need of one last fall told me, "There's not one quarterback, including Smith, I would take in the first round."

Two points about that. If you need a quarterback, you can talk brave in February, but when reality sets in around draft day, and you haven't picked up a quarterback in free agency, all of a sudden the zits on Smith, Matt Barkley and other others don't seem as bad. And we're nine and a half weeks from round one. There's no way that Andy Reid and John Dorsey, the coach and GM for Kansas City, know what they're doing now. They need time to investigate and to watch tape on the eight or 10 quarterbacks.

But in some ways, 2013 should be a catchup year for the other positions. Opening day 2013 could feature 12 starting quarterbacks drafted in 2011 and '12; that's far, far above the norm in a game that values veteran arms at the position.

Now for a couple of notes about players at the Combine.

Alec Ogletree. The underclass inside linebacker from Georgia would be a clear top-10 pick with a clean resume. But he was suspended the first four games of last season for failing an offseason drug test, and then came the news Saturday night, via ProFootballTalk.com, that Ogletree recently was pinched for driving while intoxicated.

Ogletree and agent Pat Dye were smart to come out and beat the police blotter to the punch. As for the damage done by the arrest, Ogletree, who is a speed demon for an inside player, the kind of player who, if right, would be a perfect fit as a rare three-down inside linebacker for any team, has to convince teams they shouldn't be worried about a player who has tested positive, been suspended, and gotten a DWI in the span of about nine months.

Some GM is going to stake his reputation on Ogletree in the first round, most likely. Which GM? It would have to be a secure one. Green Bay's Ted Thompson or de facto GM Bill Belichick of the Patriots or Baltimore's Ozzie Newsome, all down near the bottom of the round.

Manti Te'o. The Notre Dame linebacker has spent a lot of time practicing football and practicing what he's going to say to teams. His last game, against Alabama, was a nightmare (he was awful, and overpowered), and then the whole fake girlfriend story came up, making him a national story and, in some quarters, a national joke. It won't matter much how he works out in Indianapolis. What will matter are the 15-minute interviews he'll have in formal evening sessions with teams, and in less formal settings, seeing coaches and personnel people at the stadium and around his hotel.

No men have more on the line, off the field, at the Scouting Combine than Ogletree and Te'o.

Finally, three players I'll be watching at the Combine, three with question marks and debatable upsides:

1. Quarterback Sean Renfree, Duke. No one's talking about him, but he completed 70 percent of his throws in six of 12 games for David Cutcliffe last fall, was a comeback specialist, and has the pedigree in a good pro-style offense to play early. Could he be more than a late-round flyer, this year's Ryan Lindley? We'll see.

2. Cornerback Xavier Rhodes, Florida State. A 6-2 cornerback in a league demanding cover guys who can play on islands more and more? Scouts want to see if Rhodes, who is a heady player with good bump skills at the line of scrimmage, has the speed to stay with fast wideouts. If so, he'll be a top-half-of-the-first-round player.

3. Running back Marcus Lattimore, South Carolina. After his devastating dislocated knee and torn knee ligaments in October, Lattimore, considered a certain first-rounder before the injury, is still in recovery mode. His surgeon, James Andrews, told Lattimore recently that he's going to shock the world. "I hear he's working out great,'' said Mayock. Lattimore believes he'll be healthy enough to start the 2013 NFL season. Is he's a fourth-round minefield pick? Or might some team desperate for a back go for him a round earlier -- or even late in the second round?

Read More: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/nfl...#ixzz2LLwcLLId

O.city · 02-20-2013, 01:12 PM

While I like geno as a prospect, it's getting a little overblown around here. Lets just let it play out.

**BossChief** · 02-20-2013, 01:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city

While I like geno as a prospect, it's getting a little overblown around here. Lets just let it play out.

What the **** is overblown? Reading is fundamental...

This shows that all qbs have warts coming out...especially the guys that made it to the biggest stage in the sport.

O.city · 02-20-2013, 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BossChief

What the **** is overblown? Reading is fundamental...

Yeah, or the fact that probably 7 of those guys were better prospects at the time.

Sweet Daddy Hate · 02-20-2013, 01:19 PM

break it down homes, or shut it.
Posted via Mobile Device

**BossChief** · 02-20-2013, 01:19 PM

Trying to insert something new into a conversation that has beaten every other discussion to death.

O.city · 02-20-2013, 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BossChief

Here is a list of all the quarterbacks in the last 10 superbowls.

Brady/Collins
Brady/McNabb
Rothlisberger/Hasselback
Eli/Brady
Peyton/Grossman
Rothlisberger/Warner
Brees/Peyton
Rodgers/Rothlisberger
Eli/Brady
Flacco/Kaepernick

13 quarterbacks.

How many of them were better than Geno Smith COMING OUT OF COLLEGE?

McNabb, Roethlisberger, Eli, Peyton, Rodgers, Brees aren't really arguable. You could argue Kaepernick.

Sweet Daddy Hate · 02-20-2013, 01:21 PM

i was talking to O.
Posted via Mobile Device

Sweet Daddy Hate · 02-20-2013, 01:23 PM

Youd have to go back to 1977 to find some dumbassed team building philosphy to compare with the bullshit spouted by King. By Sweet Dick Willie.
Posted via Mobile Device

Sweet Daddy Hate · 02-20-2013, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city

McNabb, Roethlisberger, Eli, Peyton, Rodgers, Brees aren't really arguable. You could argue Kaepernick.

lololololololol
Posted via Mobile Device

O.city · 02-20-2013, 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sweet Dick Willie

lololololololol
Posted via Mobile Device

Yeah, I can't imagine you would look at that unbiased. At all.

Sweet Daddy Hate · 02-20-2013, 01:29 PM

shit, i dont even need HINDSIGHT to look at THAT and "lol"...
Posted via Mobile Device

DJ's left nut · 02-20-2013, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city

McNabb, Roethlisberger, Eli, Peyton, Rodgers, Brees aren't really arguable. You could argue Kaepernick.

You have an internal logic fail here.

If Rodgers isn't arguable, but there was a huge faction of the draft folks that thought Smith was better than Rodgers coming out of college, then isn't Smith also not arguable?

The same logic can be applied to Rivers/Eli.

Brees fell to the 2nd and wasn't Brees for 3 years.

It's an odd question, really. BUt I think a fair statement is that many of those names could have been considered better than Geno coming out of college, but the only truly 'inarguable' example is Peyton Manning. Otherwise you have to put yourself in the position of claiming that Alex Smith was also better than Geno coming out. You wanna hitch yourself to that wagon?

**BossChief** · 02-20-2013, 01:30 PM

I think it's arguable that Geno isn't an inferior prospect to McNabb or Brees as a colle prospect. Brees had measurable issues and McNabb.

McNabb didn't even complete 55% of his passes as a sophomore or Junior.

His highest yardage total of a season was 2488 yards

His best year throwing touchdowns was 22.

htismaqe · 02-20-2013, 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city

McNabb, Roethlisberger, Eli, Peyton, Rodgers, Brees aren't really arguable. You could argue Kaepernick.

Coming out of college?

He's superior as a prospect to Brees, period. Brees was coming out of the spread before the spread was en vogue, plus Brees is a midget.

I think it's arguable whether or not he's a better prospect that Big Ben. Ben had some serious question marks coming out and he too came from a spread offense.

Out of the guys on that list, the ones that were DEFINITIVELY better prospects than Geno, without the benefit of hindsight, are:

McNabb
Eli Manning
Peyton Manning

And that's about it.

**DaneMcCloud** · 02-20-2013, 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BossChief

Here is a list of all the quarterbacks in the last 10 superbowls.

Brady/Collins
Brady/McNabb
Rothlisberger/Hasselback
Eli/Brady
Peyton/Grossman
Rothlisberger/Warner
Brees/Peyton
Rodgers/Rothlisberger
Eli/Brady
Flacco/Kaepernick

13 quarterbacks.

How many of them were better than Geno Smith COMING OUT OF COLLEGE?

All but Hasselbeck, Grossman and Warner.

If Smith takes his team to a championship game or Super Bowl by the end of his second season, the debate could be re-opened, depending on how that team was led.

But at this point in time, before the Combines, before the Draft, before training camp, etc. it's just damn silly to make these comparisons.

02-19-2013, 07:53 AM
Deberg_1990 In Search of a Life Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: San Antonio Tx. Casino cash: $2054454	Peter King: You have to go back to 1997 to find a draft like this one http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/nfl.../?sct=uk_wr_a1 You'd probably have to go back to 1997 to find a draft like this one. That's the year Peyton Manning eschewed the prospect of going to the Jets first overall to play for Bill Parcells and returned for his senior year at Tennessee. One quarterback (shaky Jim Druckenmiller, 26th) picked in round one. Two backs (Warrick Dunn 12th and Antowain Smith 23rd) in round one, and four receivers in the first: Ike Hilliard seventh, Yatil Green 15th, Reidel Anthony 16th and Rae Carruth 27th. Yikes! What a horrible draft for point-producers. One star, Dunn, out of seven first-rounders. That could repeat this year. It's likely Alabama's Eddie Lacy will be the only running back taken in round one. Tennessee's Cordarrelle Patterson leads the muddled pack at wide receiver, but how sure can you really be of junior-college transfers who play one year of major-college football, which is Patterson's profile? The quarterbacks are a total mish-mosh at this point. One GM interested in acquiring a quarterback this offseason told me over the weekend, "I expect more attention on the quarterbacks throwing this year than on any other single thing at the Combine.'' Some think Geno Smith of West Virginia will go first overall to quarterback-needy Kansas City; one personnel man who studied all the top quarterbacks for a team in need of one last fall told me, "There's not one quarterback, including Smith, I would take in the first round." Two points about that. If you need a quarterback, you can talk brave in February, but when reality sets in around draft day, and you haven't picked up a quarterback in free agency, all of a sudden the zits on Smith, Matt Barkley and other others don't seem as bad. And we're nine and a half weeks from round one. There's no way that Andy Reid and John Dorsey, the coach and GM for Kansas City, know what they're doing now. They need time to investigate and to watch tape on the eight or 10 quarterbacks. But in some ways, 2013 should be a catchup year for the other positions. Opening day 2013 could feature 12 starting quarterbacks drafted in 2011 and '12; that's far, far above the norm in a game that values veteran arms at the position. Now for a couple of notes about players at the Combine. Alec Ogletree. The underclass inside linebacker from Georgia would be a clear top-10 pick with a clean resume. But he was suspended the first four games of last season for failing an offseason drug test, and then came the news Saturday night, via ProFootballTalk.com, that Ogletree recently was pinched for driving while intoxicated. Ogletree and agent Pat Dye were smart to come out and beat the police blotter to the punch. As for the damage done by the arrest, Ogletree, who is a speed demon for an inside player, the kind of player who, if right, would be a perfect fit as a rare three-down inside linebacker for any team, has to convince teams they shouldn't be worried about a player who has tested positive, been suspended, and gotten a DWI in the span of about nine months. Some GM is going to stake his reputation on Ogletree in the first round, most likely. Which GM? It would have to be a secure one. Green Bay's Ted Thompson or de facto GM Bill Belichick of the Patriots or Baltimore's Ozzie Newsome, all down near the bottom of the round. Manti Te'o. The Notre Dame linebacker has spent a lot of time practicing football and practicing what he's going to say to teams. His last game, against Alabama, was a nightmare (he was awful, and overpowered), and then the whole fake girlfriend story came up, making him a national story and, in some quarters, a national joke. It won't matter much how he works out in Indianapolis. What will matter are the 15-minute interviews he'll have in formal evening sessions with teams, and in less formal settings, seeing coaches and personnel people at the stadium and around his hotel. No men have more on the line, off the field, at the Scouting Combine than Ogletree and Te'o. Finally, three players I'll be watching at the Combine, three with question marks and debatable upsides: 1. Quarterback Sean Renfree, Duke. No one's talking about him, but he completed 70 percent of his throws in six of 12 games for David Cutcliffe last fall, was a comeback specialist, and has the pedigree in a good pro-style offense to play early. Could he be more than a late-round flyer, this year's Ryan Lindley? We'll see. 2. Cornerback Xavier Rhodes, Florida State. A 6-2 cornerback in a league demanding cover guys who can play on islands more and more? Scouts want to see if Rhodes, who is a heady player with good bump skills at the line of scrimmage, has the speed to stay with fast wideouts. If so, he'll be a top-half-of-the-first-round player. 3. Running back Marcus Lattimore, South Carolina. After his devastating dislocated knee and torn knee ligaments in October, Lattimore, considered a certain first-rounder before the injury, is still in recovery mode. His surgeon, James Andrews, told Lattimore recently that he's going to shock the world. "I hear he's working out great,'' said Mayock. Lattimore believes he'll be healthy enough to start the 2013 NFL season. Is he's a fourth-round minefield pick? Or might some team desperate for a back go for him a round earlier -- or even late in the second round? Read More: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/nfl...#ixzz2LLwcLLId
Posts: 66,914

02-20-2013, 01:12 PM	#286
O.city In Search of a Life Join Date: Jul 2009 Casino cash: $1094064	While I like geno as a prospect, it's getting a little overblown around here. Lets just let it play out.
Posts: 82,883

02-20-2013, 01:19 PM	#289
Sweet Daddy Hate Unsparing Join Date: Aug 2008 Casino cash: $10004900	break it down homes, or shut it. Posted via Mobile Device
Posts: 77,135

02-20-2013, 01:19 PM	#290
BossChief SuperBowl or bust Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: BF Iowa Casino cash: $14088	Trying to insert something new into a conversation that has beaten every other discussion to death. __________________ Dreams do come true... http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showp...postcount=1407
Posts: 47,540

02-20-2013, 01:21 PM	#292
Sweet Daddy Hate Unsparing Join Date: Aug 2008 Casino cash: $10004900	i was talking to O. Posted via Mobile Device
Posts: 77,135

02-20-2013, 01:23 PM	#293
Sweet Daddy Hate Unsparing Join Date: Aug 2008 Casino cash: $10004900	Youd have to go back to 1977 to find some dumbassed team building philosphy to compare with the bullshit spouted by King. By Sweet Dick Willie. Posted via Mobile Device
Posts: 77,135

02-20-2013, 01:29 PM	#296
Sweet Daddy Hate Unsparing Join Date: Aug 2008 Casino cash: $10004900	shit, i dont even need HINDSIGHT to look at THAT and "lol"... Posted via Mobile Device
Posts: 77,135

02-20-2013, 01:30 PM	#298
BossChief SuperBowl or bust Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: BF Iowa Casino cash: $14088	I think it's arguable that Geno isn't an inferior prospect to McNabb or Brees as a colle prospect. Brees had measurable issues and McNabb. McNabb didn't even complete 55% of his passes as a sophomore or Junior. His highest yardage total of a season was 2488 yards His best year throwing touchdowns was 22. __________________ Dreams do come true... http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showp...postcount=1407
Posts: 47,540