***** All things Fitness *****

[JohnnyHammersticks]

Originally Posted by SupDock

Hmmm

Putting on that much muscle mass while simultaneously losing weight seems unlikely when natural.

Congrats on the body recomp, but P90x never struck me as being optimized for gains. It’s more for functional strength and athleticism. And there is absolutely nothing wrong with that.

One can definitely gain some muscle while cutting, but your deficit needs to be minimal. Most people lose minimal weight while “main-gaining” because their muscle gain is mostly balanced with fat loss, so they maintain somewhat weight neutral.

Is your goal to lose weight, or to put on muscle?

I have learned to hard way that your attention to your macros needs to match your effort in the gym.


Sorry if I am giving unwanted advice.

My goal is both to lose weight AND put on muscle. Totally naturally, I would never do 'roids. I'm not even using a recovery drink or any protein supplements. Just eating clean food with lots of protein. Chicken breasts, turkey, and for snacks unsalted nuts.

I've very fortunately been blessed with a fast metabolism, so as long as I'm working out daily and not eating pints of ice cream every night along with other crap like chips and pizzas I lose weight pretty easily. If I fast while still drinking water I lose 2-4 lbs in 24 hours.

Like I mentioned in the first post, the only other time I've done P90X with the full diet I went from 203 to 178 while getting noticeably bigger. At least an inch on biceps, bigger shoulders, chest, and legs. I figure I put on 10 lbs of muscle at least. So simple math would suggest I lost ~35 lbs of fat when I lost 25 lbs the first time I did the workouts along with the diet. That absolutely blew my mind because I wasn't completely disgusting-looking at 203.

[SupDock]

Originally Posted by JohnnyHammersticks

My goal is both to lose weight AND put on muscle. Totally naturally, I would never do 'roids. I'm not even using a recovery drink or any protein supplements. Just eating clean food with lots of protein. Chicken breasts, turkey, and for snacks unsalted nuts.

I've very fortunately been blessed with a fast metabolism, so as long as I'm working out daily and not eating pints of ice cream every night along with other crap like chips and pizzas I lose weight pretty easily. If I fast while still drinking water I lose 2-4 lbs in 24 hours.

Like I mentioned in the first post, the only other time I've done P90X with the full diet I went from 203 to 178 while getting noticeably bigger. At least an inch on biceps, bigger shoulders, chest, and legs. I figure I put on 10 lbs of muscle at least. So simple math would suggest I lost ~35 lbs of fat when I lost 25 lbs the first time I did the workouts along with the diet. That absolutely blew my mind because I wasn't completely disgusting-looking at 203.

That’s awesome man. Keep getting it!

[JohnnyHammersticks]

Originally Posted by JohnnyHammersticks

Just finished the first 30 days of my latest P90X 3-month body reset. Doing the diet too. Eating mainly chicken breasts and steamed veggies.

I'm just a hair over 6 ft and I've dropped from 204 to 193 so far, and that's with a little added muscle. In the past the weight has really started coming off in days 30-90, so I feel like I'm headed in the right direction. That's also when most of the muscle-building happened.

Hoping to drop about 25 more while putting on about 10 more lbs of muscle. Went from 203 to 178 the last time I did the full 90 days with the diet, so that's what I'm using for a benchmark this time.

Finished on schedule yesterday. Didn't miss a workout for 90 days and did the diet. 204lbs on 3/13/23 to 182 yesterday. Put on quite a bit of muscle. Before/after pics are dramatic. Before is honestly frightening, after is pretty shredded.

No injuries until I tweaked my knee with 10 days left, but not badly enough to miss a workout.

So freaking ready to pig out. Not a single bite of pizza or ice cream for 3 months. Lived on chicken breasts, steamed veggies, turkey sandwiches, salads, energy bars, and an Outshine fruit popsicle if I had to have a sugar fix. Gates Extra Hot sauce on the chicken every night was the only thing that kept me from going nuts.

Now I can coast for awhile. Maintaining is a lot easier than getting there.

[ThaVirus]

Originally Posted by JohnnyHammersticks

Finished on schedule yesterday. Didn't miss a workout for 90 days and did the diet. 204lbs on 3/13/23 to 182 yesterday. Put on quite a bit of muscle. Before/after pics are dramatic. Before is honestly frightening, after is pretty shredded.

No injuries until I tweaked my knee with 10 days left, but not badly enough to miss a workout.

So freaking ready to pig out. Not a single bite of pizza or ice cream for 3 months. Lived on chicken breasts, steamed veggies, turkey sandwiches, salads, energy bars, and an Outshine fruit popsicle if I had to have a sugar fix. Gates Extra Hot sauce on the chicken every night was the only thing that kept me from going nuts.

Now I can coast for awhile. Maintaining is a lot easier than getting there.

Post pics, you sexy bitch.

[JohnnyHammersticks]

Originally Posted by ThaVirus

Post pics, you sexy bitch.

I look so damn sexy that if I posted the 'after' pic Katipan, BEP, and Billay wouldn't be able to get any work done for the next 6 months, and Billay just started a new job.

But joking aside, no one wants to see that 'before' pic. Trust me on that.

[RaidersOftheCellar]

Somebody tell me the secret to gaining/maintaining muscle while losing fat.

Never had an issue keeping weight off til about a year ago. Now it's getting tough. I could probably drop the belly fat pretty easily but I don't want to be scrawny and I definitely don't want to be one of those skinny-fat guys.

[PAChiefsGuy]

Originally Posted by RaidersOftheCellar

Somebody tell me the secret to gaining/maintaining muscle while losing fat.

Never had an issue keeping weight off til about a year ago. Now it's getting tough. I don't want to be scrawny and I definitely don't want to be one of those skinny-fat dudes.

Low calorie but high protein diet, do an even split of lift days/cardio days. Eat a lot during lift days, but nothing too crazy. Then eat less during cardio days. That is the key in my opinion. This way you will build muscle during certain days of the week and then lose weight the other days. I'd also recommend doing a 24-hour fast once every two-weeks if you can pull it off. Just make sure after it is over you don't overeat.

Not going to beat around the bush - it's tricky and not for everyone. It takes a lot of hard work and dedication but it can be done.

[RaidersOftheCellar]

Originally Posted by PAChiefsGuy

Low calorie but high protein diet, do an even split of lift days/cardio days. Eat a lot during lift days, but nothing too crazy. Then eat less during cardio days. That is the key in my opinion. This way you will build muscle during certain days of the week and then lose weight the other days. I'd also recommend doing a 24-hour fast once every two-weeks if you can pull it off. Just make sure after it is over you don't overeat.

Not going to beat around the bush - it's tricky and not for everyone. It takes a lot of hard work and dedication but it can be done.

The diet and split of lifting/cardio days is what I've tried to do, but I haven't been consistent. Haven't tried eating less on cardio days. That's interesting.

[SupDock]

Originally Posted by RaidersOftheCellar

The diet and split of lifting/cardio days is what I've tried to do, but I haven't been consistent. Haven't tried eating less on cardio days. That's interesting.

I don’t think that matters. Hit your protein goals and be a slight caloric excess.

There is a reason that in general people cut, bulk, repeat. It works better. And the math is simpler.

[Katipan]

Mom is dating a big name from the Golden age of body building. Mr. Universe is about 70 yrs old and eats the same basic meals everyday. Oatmeal. Fish with tomato slices. Slab of pure protein.

Old AF. Walks sideways through doorways.

[Bearcat]

I've been lacking motivation lately (but still dragging my ass to the gym at least a couple times per week), so I was research drop sets last night... the consensus seemed to be there isn't a ton of research out there, but can be used sparingly.

And using the same general math that I've done for sets per muscle per workout and per week, I was needing more leg sets anyway and don't have much time to do several more sets with breaks.

Did my normal leg routine and just added a couple drop sets at the end of each thing during the last sets... if nothing else, it's a nice way to empty the tank at the end of a workout. Feels good, might not be able to walk tomorrow.

[penguinz]

Originally Posted by Bearcat

I've been lacking motivation lately (but still dragging my ass to the gym at least a couple times per week), so I was research drop sets last night... the consensus seemed to be there isn't a ton of research out there, but can be used sparingly.

And using the same general math that I've done for sets per muscle per workout and per week, I was needing more leg sets anyway and don't have much time to do several more sets with breaks.

Did my normal leg routine and just added a couple drop sets at the end of each thing during the last sets... if nothing else, it's a nice way to empty the tank at the end of a workout. Feels good, might not be able to walk tomorrow.

I have been reading a bunch about how the idea of starting low and raising weight each set is not ideal way to build muscle/strength. They are saying to do all your working sets at your 80-85% of 1RM and work to failure on each set. Once you get your last set to be failure at 6-10 reps (whatever you set your goal to) then add weight next time and start the process over again.

Idea is to extend your time under max tension and not deal with energy depletion from light/easy reps.

One thing I have done in the past to break a plateau on legs is to throw 135 on the squat bar and try to get to 100 reps in as few sets as possible. just be ready to puke when you are done and walk like your legs are made out of rubber bands.

[SupDock]

Originally Posted by penguinz

I have been reading a bunch about how the idea of starting low and raising weight each set is not ideal way to build muscle/strength. They are saying to do all your working sets at your 80-85% of 1RM and work to failure on each set. Once you get your last set to be failure at 6-10 reps (whatever you set your goal to) then add weight next time and start the process over again.

Idea is to extend your time under max tension and not deal with energy depletion from light/easy reps.

One thing I have done in the past to break a plateau on legs is to throw 135 on the squat bar and try to get to 100 reps in as few sets as possible. just be ready to puke when you are done and walk like your legs are made out of rubber bands.

I thought starting low was more about warming up. I think figuring out where you are in terms of percent of 1 RM is overstated

I can curl 40s with good form and go to failure. I can also curl 30s, go super slow, really focus on contracting hard at the top, and have the same rep range to failure as the 40s.

Focusing on your mind muscle connection, contracting hard at the end of the concentric phase and going slow on the eccentric phase is the most important.

I really don’t pay super attention to my weight, I just want to go to failure.
When I start to get over 10 reps I increase the weight.

[Bearcat]

Originally Posted by SupDock

Focusing on your mind muscle connection

I've been doing that for chest stuff lately.. lightening the weight on a few things and adding a couple of movements that feel chestier than others.

[Bearcat]

Originally Posted by penguinz

I have been reading a bunch about how the idea of starting low and raising weight each set is not ideal way to build muscle/strength. They are saying to do all your working sets at your 80-85% of 1RM and work to failure on each set. Once you get your last set to be failure at 6-10 reps (whatever you set your goal to) then add weight next time and start the process over again.

Idea is to extend your time under max tension and not deal with energy depletion from light/easy reps.

One thing I have done in the past to break a plateau on legs is to throw 135 on the squat bar and try to get to 100 reps in as few sets as possible. just be ready to puke when you are done and walk like your legs are made out of rubber bands.

I see that strategy a lot, with lower weight to start, but I've always taken it as a powerlifting thing from guys lifting far more than most.

I'll do a few uncounted reps at the very beginning of my day for a stretch/warm up, but then target 8-12 reps for everything after that. Once I hit 12, I'll up the weight a bit next time.

The drop set thing at the end won't change that, it's pretty much getting in a couple extra sets at the end without the added breaks. A couple of youtubers were mentioning it might help with different muscle fibers given the lower weight, but not enough research has been done.