The Official "Lost" the series discussion

[Deberg_1990]

I figured I would start a thread for this and see what happens....there seemed to be quite a few viewers on the board for this show the past few weeks.....I like the direction the show is taking so far......episode 3 tonight at 7 central on ABC....

[Reaper16]

So... Season 4 was easily, easily, the strongest season of TV that the series has yet produced. 1 poor episodes, one or two meh-to-solid episodes, and many episodes that rank among the best that a major network drama could possibly produce. The finale doesn't necessarily work as a self-contained episode (nor do its three parts work individually as episodes) but its good in the context of the whole series. Season 4 was good, even though it essentially serves as broad set-up for season 5, which looks to be insane. I don't feel like writing up a huge list of questions/concerns because I'm going to jump straight into 5 like after I click on "Post Quick Reply."

[Buck]

For me, Jack change in Season Five, but for a lot of people he stayed the same.

[Red Brooklyn]

FWIW, I would rank the seasons thusly:

1. Season One (10/10)
2. Season Six (9/10)
3. Season Two (8.5/10)
4. Season Four (8/10)
5. Season Five (8/10)
6. Season Three (7/10)

[Reaper16]

Originally Posted by Red Brooklyn

FWIW, I would rank the seasons thusly:

1. Season One (10/10)
2. Season Six (9/10)
3. Season Two (8.5/10)
4. Season Four (8/10)
5. Season Five (8/10)
6. Season Three (7/10)

You don't watch much TV, do you? Well, maybe I'm being unfair. Are you ranking the seasons based on fanboy satisfaction or on being serial episodic drama on television?

[Red Brooklyn]

I don't watch much tv. And I pride myself on that fact, actually.

I'm not sure what you mean by "fanboy satisfaction." I'm ranking them based on which I found most interesting; which gave me the most satisfactory viewing experience in terms of character, writing, directing and over-all story telling.

[Reaper16]

Originally Posted by Red Brooklyn

I don't watch much tv. And I pride myself on that fact, actually.

I'm not sure what you mean by "fanboy satisfaction." I'm ranking them based on which I found most interesting; which gave me the most satisfactory viewing experience in terms of character, writing, directing and over-all story telling.

Respecfully, of course, I must disagree with you then. I can't see how season one can be on top when it has bad episodes of TV like "Hearts and Minds," "Special" and "Homecoming;" a brutal three-episode stretch. Of the first four seasons, season 4 was easily the strongest group of episodes while being prototypically Lost in that it strengthens and reinforces all of the major series themes - science vs faith, free will vs determinism, the consequences of choice, doing the right thing in the face of ambiguity of what the right thing is, the cost of keeping secrets - while also explaining a lot of mythology while introducing plenty of new quirks AND never sacrificing character moments to be overly-explanatory. Lost has finally found a major groove here, imo.

[irishjayhawk]

Originally Posted by Red Brooklyn

FWIW, I would rank the seasons thusly:

1. Season One (10/10)
2. Season Six (9/10)
3. Season Two (8.5/10)
4. Season Four (8/10)
5. Season Five (8/10)
6. Season Three (7/10)

I'd have to disagree.

Season Four
Season Five (close behind)
Season Six
Season Two (I'd almost call it a tie between 1 & 2)
Season One
Season Three (well below)


If I separated out all but the last 5-6 episodes of Season Three, it'd easily move up past Season 6. But then it'd be a 5-6 episode season.


EDIT: Just talking with someone who said Seasons One and Two had a more consistent episode to episode level whereas 4-6 had more ups and high highs but not as consistent. I'd probably agree with that. I'm also looking at my ranking and I think the issue most will comment on is Season One close to the bottom.

[Red Brooklyn]

Fair enough, my friend. I'm glad you're enjoying the series. Again, I don't watch a lot of TV so perhaps I'm inexperienced or naive, but I'm never seen anything as gripping, satisfying and (pound for pound) rewarding as the first season of LOST. There are low spots. But the low spots of S1 still exceed the low points of other seasons. Honestly, I think the low spots of S1 exceed some bright spots in other seasons.

I think for me it's about the overall flow, but also just the intrege of beginings. I view each season as a visual novel with each episode being a chapter. Some chapters aren't as fulfilling as others, but the first "book" is still the best overall book. For me.

Season four, is wonderful. I give it a solid B. And your points are all valid. I can see why you're so attracted to that season. I think I felt the same way following S3 as well. However, going back and rewatching several times, it's lost a bit of sheen for me. There are a lot of characters that really begin taking a backseat to the overall thrust of the plot beginning in S4. That's my only real issue. That, and the fact that the season feels truncated by the writer's strike. I feel like there was a lot more that wanted to happen in S4. Of course, the flip side is that the show benefitted from less "filler." And the final stretch of episodes in S4 (The Shape Of Things To Come to There's No Place Like Home) is arguable the best run of episodes in series history.

On a personal level, I think the big "reveal" is the show's weakest. The island moving is a little wonky to me. After three stellar finale's with heart-stopping final events, I felt like the island moving was the closest the show ever came to jumping the shark. Most of the things that people don't like about the way LOST ended are a direct result of that event, and that story telling device. I see why some think it was the beginning of the end. However, part of the brilliance of S5 is how TPTB respond. What happens next made moving the island worth it, ultimately. But it still feels a little odd. Even now.

[Red Brooklyn]

Originally Posted by irishjayhawk

EDIT: Just talking with someone who said Seasons One and Two had a more consistent episode to episode level whereas 4-6 had more ups and high highs but not as consistent. I'd probably agree with that. I'm also looking at my ranking and I think the issue most will comment on is Season One close to the bottom.

I would agree with that as well. Especially in regards to S5. I think S6 is pretty outstanding. I don't recall a lot of "lows". Maybe "What Kate Does," and "Recon." But other than that...

"LA X", "Sundown," "Lighthouse," "Everybody Loves Hugo," "Happily Ever After," "The Substitute," "The Candidate," "The End," "Ab Aerterno," these are all some of my favorite episodes of LOST.

And I'd say "What Kate Does" is better than "Eggtown." And Sawyer didn't even get a centric in S4 - that's another strike against it.

[Reaper16]

Originally Posted by Red Brooklyn

Fair enough, my friend. I'm glad you're enjoying the series. Again, I don't watch a lot of TV so perhaps I'm inexperienced or naive, but I'm never seen anything as gripping, satisfying and (pound for pound) rewarding as the first season of LOST. There are low spots. But the low spots of S1 still exceed the low points of other seasons. Honestly, I think the low spots of S1 exceed some bright spots in other seasons.

I think for me it's about the overall flow, but also just the intrege of beginings. I view each season as a visual novel with each episode being a chapter. Some chapters aren't as fulfilling as others, but the first "book" is still the best overall book. For me.

Season four, is wonderful. I give it a solid B. And your points are all valid. I can see why you're so attracted to that season. I think I felt the same way following S3 as well. However, going back and rewatching several times, it's lost a bit of sheen for me. There are a lot of characters that really begin taking a backseat to the overall thrust of the plot beginning in S4. That's my only real issue. That, and the fact that the season feels truncated by the writer's strike. I feel like there was a lot more that wanted to happen in S4. Of course, the flip side is that the show benefitted from less "filler." And the final stretch of episodes in S4 (The Shape Of Things To Come to There's No Place Like Home) is arguable the best run of episodes in series history.

On a personal level, I think the big "reveal" is the show's weakest. The island moving is a little wonky to me. After three stellar finale's with heart-stopping final events, I felt like the island moving was the closest the show ever came to jumping the shark. Most of the things that people don't like about the way LOST ended are a direct result of that event, and that story telling device. I see why some think it was the beginning of the end. However, part of the brilliance of S5 is how TPTB respond. What happens next made moving the island worth it, ultimately. But it still feels a little odd. Even now.

A qualm: none of Lost's first four seasons feel novelistic in scope in and of themselves. There are too many unresolved issues for the seasons to feel like complete books. My hope is that the series, once all viewed, will feel novelistic like the best dramas (The Wire, Mad Men, Breaking Bad, The Sopranos) are.

Also, if you've never "seen anything as gripping, satisfying and (pound for pound) rewarding as the first season of LOST" then please, please, watch the four dramas I just mentioned in parentheses).

[SithCeNtZ]

Originally Posted by irishjayhawk

I'd have to disagree.

Season Four
Season Five (close behind)
Season Six
Season Two (I'd almost call it a tie between 1 & 2)
Season One
Season Three (well below)


If I separated out all but the last 5-6 episodes of Season Three, it'd easily move up past Season 6. But then it'd be a 5-6 episode season.


EDIT: Just talking with someone who said Seasons One and Two had a more consistent episode to episode level whereas 4-6 had more ups and high highs but not as consistent. I'd probably agree with that. I'm also looking at my ranking and I think the issue most will comment on is Season One close to the bottom.

I would say it's not really fair to compare the seasons because they had such vastly different objectives. Seasons 1 and 2(and sort of 3) were all about building characters and making you care about them, so of course there had to be more filler episodes and less action. It also laid down the framework with tons of questions and a very unique story line. Seasons 4,5,6 were more entertaining from a plot movement perspective and you got to see some of the character build up pay off, so I think most would favor those seasons. The problem was that seasons 4,5,6 completely abandoned the plot lines of 1,2,3 and thus 1,2,3 looks worse in retrospect because you know how little the plot mattered. However, if seasons 1 and 2 were not as overall as good as they were, I think you would have had many more people quit on the show before it finished.

[Red Brooklyn]

Originally Posted by Reaper16

A qualm: none of Lost's first four seasons feel novelistic in scope in and of themselves. There are too many unresolved issues for the seasons to feel like complete books. My hope is that the series, once all viewed, will feel novelistic like the best dramas (The Wire, Mad Men, Breaking Bad, The Sopranos) are.

Also, if you've never "seen anything as gripping, satisfying and (pound for pound) rewarding as the first season of LOST" then please, please, watch the four dramas I just mentioned in parentheses).

Will do. I've never actually seen any of them. Obviously, I've heard great things about all of them. I'm especially looking forward to The Wire.

[Red Brooklyn]

Originally Posted by Reaper16

A qualm: none of Lost's first four seasons feel novelistic in scope in and of themselves. There are too many unresolved issues for the seasons to feel like complete books. My hope is that the series, once all viewed, will feel novelistic like the best dramas (The Wire, Mad Men, Breaking Bad, The Sopranos) are.

I'm not sure I understand this qualm. I find a lot of book series' to have unanswered questions and unresolved issues from book to book. Especially, when looking at something like The Dark Tower which I know was a huge inspiration to Damon and Carlton while writing LOST.

[Reaper16]

Originally Posted by Red Brooklyn

Will do. I've never actually seen any of them. Obviously, I've heard great things about all of them. I'm especially looking forward to The Wire.

Yay! And I didn't say that to slam Lost by any means. I said that because when I finish the series and don't proclaim Lost to be in the upper echelon of TV dramas (which, so far, it isn't - though certainly among the best dramas to appear on major network TV) I want you to know why.

[Reaper16]

Originally Posted by Red Brooklyn

I'm not sure I understand this qualm. I find a lot of book series' to have unanswered questions and unresolved issues from book to book. Especially, when looking at something like The Dark Tower which I know was a huge inspiration to Damon and Carlton while writing LOST.

And, subsequently, literary critics rarely regard those kinds of books/series positively, fwiw.