Chiefs Albert/Joeckel perspective - Page 30

**cdcox** · 04-18-2013, 11:01 PM

How would you feel if the Chiefs had the #2 overall pick and packaged it and Albert for Joeckel? Because that's what the Chiefs are on the brink of doing.

#1 pick = 3000 points
#54 pick = 360 points

difference is 2640 points

#2 pick is worth 2600 points

Chiefs are going to invest 3000 - 360 = 2640 points to replace Albert with Joeckel. It could be a good deal for the Chiefs if 1) Albert is out of the league in two years, 2) Jockel is a HOFer and 3) the alternatives (like Geno) don't have very good careers.

Nightfyre · 04-20-2013, 03:15 PM

A top 10 QB in today's league is worth more than the best pass-rusher or the best tackle of all time. It's a fact.

Sorter · 04-20-2013, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by keg in kc

Take Geno out of the equation and just talk about tackles. It's about a return on investment. Let's throw reality out the door and postulate that a middling prospect like Joeckel/Fisher could end up being the best LT in the game. The return on the investment is still limited, because it's a position that can a) be filled without much of a decline in quality from a lower draft position (see: well, nearly every LT in the league) and b) has minimal direct impact on the outcome of games. There's a reason you've never heard the term "playmaking LT". That's not to say it isn't an important position. It certainly is. But it's not a position that you should ever draft #1. And definitely not when you're talking about players who, put simply, just aren't stars.

The hilarious irony is that we're in the process of trading our left tackle to the last team to draft a left tackle at 1, all of 6 years ago. Which is probably exactly what we'll do in 5 or 6 years, despite all this talk about "Joeckel's just 21! He can be a cornerstone for a decade!!" And he's not even close to the player Jake Long was coming out.

To me, the biggest issues with taking any OL early is that you can scheme around them. You can't scheme around a poor QB consistently and expect exceptional results.

However, you can scheme around an average or below avg tackle and allow your QB to play to their skill level (see Drew Brees/Aaron Rodgers). This can be done with route design or chips, slide, and protections.

philfree · 04-20-2013, 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by keg in kc

Take Geno out of the equation and just talk about tackles. It's about a return on investment. Let's throw reality out the door and postulate that a middling prospect like Joeckel/Fisher could end up being the best LT in the game. The return on the investment is still limited, because it's a position that can a) be filled without much of a decline in quality from a lower draft position (see: well, nearly every LT in the league) and b) has minimal direct impact on the outcome of games. There's a reason you've never heard the term "playmaking LT". That's not to say it isn't an important position. It certainly is. But it's not a position that you should ever draft #1. And definitely not when you're talking about players who, put simply, just aren't stars.

The hilarious irony is that we're in the process of trading our left tackle to the last team to draft a left tackle at 1, all of 6 years ago. Which is probably exactly what we'll do in 5 or 6 years, despite all this talk about "Joeckel's just 21! He can be a cornerstone for a decade!!"

Yeah I think it sucks that we're drafting a LT #1 overall but I'm still going to hold out some hope that Andy Reid's Chiefs are going to be worth a shit. I won't quit watching that's for sure. I don't think drafting a QB that they don't see as the guy #1 overall is a win just because we tried either. That's no more recipe for success as drafting a LT.

**Anyong Bluth** · 04-20-2013, 03:45 PM

Congratulations to us Chief's fans! Our first number 1 pick ever, and we decide to buck the trend by most teams except 2 since at least the 1950's by drafting an OT at #1 overall. (Only others being Orlando Pace & Jake Long)

New era Chiefs = trailblazers because I can't think of any other time a team moved a more than serviceable player at a position virtually never worth the #1 just so they can draft their replacement and feel that 2nd round pick justifies that course of strategy!

Hammock Parties · 04-20-2013, 03:49 PM

The Dolphins are the more desperate party in this trade.

If they don't land Albert they have jack and shit at LT.

I certainly hope Dorsey realizes this.

**Anyong Bluth** · 04-20-2013, 04:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wonton Prejudice

The Dolphins are the more desperate party in this trade.

If they don't land Albert they have jack and shit at LT.

I certainly hope Dorsey realizes this.

Ya, but if they're so desperate why are we able to squeeze more than just a 2nd out of them? Not to mention there's debate if the Chiefs will for sure get the better of their 2 2nd rounders. If they are so wanton shouldn't they push for say Albert and a 3rd in exchange for their 2 2nds?

Hell, if they want an OT so bad and know one won't be there by their 1st round pick make them an deal to swap 1sts plus other picks they'd send to the Chiefs. Ya, I know it's a pipedream.

Direckshun · 04-20-2013, 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wonton Prejudice

The Dolphins are the more desperate party in this trade.

If they don't land Albert they have jack and shit at LT.

I certainly hope Dorsey realizes this.

Except they could simply trade up to something like 5, and get Fisher.

In that scenario, the Chiefs still have Albert, and the 1.1. A position they do not want anymore, if they ever did.

**Tribal Warfare** · 04-20-2013, 04:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city

@TonyPauline: Sources tell me several position coaches for the Kansas City Chiefs prefer tackle Eric Fisher over Luke Joeckel....

I'd be a quarter less pissed

**Dave Lane** · 04-20-2013, 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RunKC

They said they want to build now and the future.

Joeckel is good now and for another 10+ years. What's not to get about that?

There's an awesome punter we can take that will awesome for 12 years. Definitely need them at 1.1

Sweet Daddy Hate · 04-20-2013, 04:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by patteeu

Who says you can't teach nastiness?

I'm a damned PHD in nastiness, and I damn sure couldn't teach it to YOU, Mr. High Intelligence. So there's your answer.
Posted via Mobile Device

Sweet Daddy Hate · 04-20-2013, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RunKC

Luke Joeckel isn't this slapdick that most here make him to be.

He owned the best pass rushers/DL in the best conference in the nation last year with no help from his team.

He's a slapdick, mother****er. Now shut your goddamned douchehole. (see, Patt?)
Posted via Mobile Device

**Dave Lane** · 04-20-2013, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peyton's Princess

cool

I'm done worrying about it. If the Chiefs suck forever the Chiefs suck forever. Being angry and posting angry messages every time I come to ChiefsPlanet like OTWP doesn't seem like a real productive way to spend my life. I'd rather talk about rape and roofies and pina coladas.

Hootie

Quit being a fan.

Pretty simple.

BYE

Sweet Daddy Hate · 04-20-2013, 04:49 PM

Anyone who claims Jokel as "BPA" in ANY draft past, present, or future, should be taken out back to RunKC's gimp-hovel and ****ed in the ass with blunt objects until their goddamned teeth fall out.
Posted via Mobile Device

ChiefRocka · 04-20-2013, 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sweet Dick Willie

Anyone who claims Jokel as "BPA" in ANY draft past, present, or future, should be taken out back to RunKC's gimp-hovel and ****ed in the ass with blunt objects until their goddamned teeth fall out.
Posted via Mobile Device

Your dumb

Ebolapox · 04-20-2013, 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChiefRocka

Your dumb

**You're**

04-18-2013, 11:01 PM
cdcox www.nfl-forecast.com Join Date: Sep 2000 Casino cash: $2361769	Albert/Joeckel perspective How would you feel if the Chiefs had the #2 overall pick and packaged it and Albert for Joeckel? Because that's what the Chiefs are on the brink of doing. #1 pick = 3000 points #54 pick = 360 points difference is 2640 points #2 pick is worth 2600 points Chiefs are going to invest 3000 - 360 = 2640 points to replace Albert with Joeckel. It could be a good deal for the Chiefs if 1) Albert is out of the league in two years, 2) Jockel is a HOFer and 3) the alternatives (like Geno) don't have very good careers.
Posts: 45,536

04-20-2013, 03:15 PM	#436
Nightfyre MVP Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Helena, MT Casino cash: $3658849	A top 10 QB in today's league is worth more than the best pass-rusher or the best tackle of all time. It's a fact.
Posts: 18,547

04-20-2013, 03:45 PM	#439
Anyong Bluth Deus ambulans inter homines Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Chicago Casino cash: $9689340	Congratulations to us Chief's fans! Our first number 1 pick ever, and we decide to buck the trend by most teams except 2 since at least the 1950's by drafting an OT at #1 overall. (Only others being Orlando Pace & Jake Long) New era Chiefs = trailblazers because I can't think of any other time a team moved a more than serviceable player at a position virtually never worth the #1 just so they can draft their replacement and feel that 2nd round pick justifies that course of strategy! __________________ Suck it, *beautiful*
Posts: 14,917

04-20-2013, 03:49 PM	#440
Hammock Parties I'll be back. Join Date: Nov 2002 Casino cash: $4730478	The Dolphins are the more desperate party in this trade. If they don't land Albert they have jack and shit at LT. I certainly hope Dorsey realizes this. __________________ Chiefs game films
Posts: 277,822

04-20-2013, 04:49 PM	#448
Sweet Daddy Hate Unsparing Join Date: Aug 2008 Casino cash: $10004900	Anyone who claims Jokel as "BPA" in ANY draft past, present, or future, should be taken out back to RunKC's gimp-hovel and ***ed in the ass with blunt objects until their goddamned teeth fall out. Posted via Mobile Device*
Posts: 77,135