Fat Ass Gretz at it again - Page 3

ken ott · 08-02-2005, 06:38 PM

I Just read his latest article, and it pisses me off. I got no problem paying me more money to help with the stadiums, but the owners (Lamar & Glass) need to pony up more money than 50 mill. by the Royals, and a whopping 25 mill. from the Chiefs. What a bunch of cheap asses.

GRETZ: Commitment & Partnership: It Can Happen
Aug 02, 2005, 6:03:51 AM by Bob Gretz - FAQ

RIVER FALLS, WI – Oh, if only the do nothing folks from the Missouri State House and the No-Show Governor of the Show-Me State could have been here Monday afternoon to see what happens when politicians and a professional football team work together.

Right here in the Chiefs summer home was the Governor of Wisconsin, Jim Doyle. He took time out of his busy schedule to be on campus for the official dedication of the training room and locker room renovations that have been done here at UW-River Falls.

A relatively small outlay of $2.4 million was enough to get the Governor out of Madison and into the northwestern part of the state. Why? There’s a simple reason: the Chiefs are important to the state of Wisconsin.

There were the usual comments about the Chiefs being Wisconsin’s favorite AFC team and sad memories were recalled of the Chiefs visit to Lambeau Field two years ago when they beat the beloved Packers in overtime. But with his mere presence, it was obvious the Governor wasn’t kidding or being politically correct when he said: “The Kansas City Chiefs are part of the Wisconsin family.”

He went on to talk about the partnership between the state, the school and the football team. Doyle called the Chiefs a “classy organization” and one that “every time they said they would do something in return for something, it’s been delivered on.”

Are you listening in the Missouri House? How about the Governor’s Mansion in Jefferson City? The Chiefs spend 23 to 25 days a year in Wisconsin, but nobody, not the school, the state or the Governor, takes their presence for granted. The folks in the land of cheese have provided a road map on how to get something done.

It helps when the Governor is involved. Doyle was part of the process in approving and finding funding for this project from the very start. Much like every other state that makes up our union, Wisconsin has budget problems. There are increasing demands for roads, education and health care. They are the 18th largest state with 5,363, 675 residents. Missouri is the 17th largest state with a population of 5,595,211. So you can see that the problems facing these two states are very similar.

Let’s be very clear here: what the state of Wisconsin pulled off with this renovation was peanuts compared to what’s needed at Arrowhead Stadium. It will take more than 100 times the River Falls outlay to return Arrowhead to “state of the art” status.

But the route taken from idea (improvements to keep the Chiefs returning to River Falls) to Tuesday’s ribbon cutting is a perfect map for Jackson County and the state of Missouri to follow.

First, officials from UW-River Falls brainstormed on how they could improve the facilities on campus with the Chiefs in mind. As part of their process, they spoke at length with the Chiefs and got their ideas. The plan was taken to the state capitol, where Doyle got behind the project. Lobbying efforts were done with the state legislature and with the students of UW-River Falls, who kicked in money for this project as well.

There were ups and downs but in 2004, the money was approved for the project and today, the Chiefs enjoy the benefits of a first class training room and locker rooms.

Nothing in this process was mysterious or underhanded. UW-River Falls wanted to keep the Chiefs and better their university with improved facilities which will be used by the Chiefs 25 days a year and the students the other 340 days. It was important to the state of Wisconsin that there were improvements at the school and the Chiefs were still summer residents. Something got done. How is the Chiefs situation in Kansas City, Missouri with Arrowhead really any different?

It’s time for the do nothings of Missouri to play follow the leader. It’s time for the No Show Governor to take a lesson from Governor Doyle and grab the lead in this situation. In the battle over where funds from the Athletes & Artist tax were directed, the Missouri Governor sat on the sidelines. When the House do nothings killed a vote on the matter, nary a word was heard from the No Show Governor.

Governor Jim Doyle and the folks in Wisconsin have shown the way. Oh, by the way, in the middle of the speeches and ceremonies, Carl Peterson got up and announced that the Chiefs would return to River Falls for training camp next season.

That’s what happens when you aren’t afraid to make a decision that a football team and everything that comes with it is important for a community, a college and a state. That’s what happens when there’s commitment and partnership.

Dr. Johnny Fever · 08-03-2005, 07:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ninjaman

If you want to upgrade Arrowhead then just fix the damn plumbing. Thats all thats wrong with it.

To do a 'greenbay' and throw tons of money at it is STUPID.

Sorry Carl or Hunt Jr. if you are here reading the boards. You guys need to kick in real money and maybe we can build a downtown stadium.

There is nothing wrong with Arrowhead !!!!!!!!

Except location.

...and the award for the dumbest post ever goes to............

jspchief · 08-03-2005, 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2bikebob

Actually, the taxpayers (City of Arlington) will only pay half of the construction cost, capped at $325 million. $60 million of that will be recovered from the 30 year lease at $2 million per year. Additionally, Arlington gets 5% of the naming rights, up to $500k per year.

The Cowboys also pay for all management and upkeep of the stadium during the term of the lease and assume all responsibility for recruiting outside events. So for a bottom line investment of $265 million (conservatively), Arlington gets the economic boost of having the Cowboys call Arlington home for the next three decades and assumes very little risk.

That averages out to an outlay of $8.83 million annually. Apparently Arlington feels having a popular NFL franchise in town will generate more than that amount each year in ancillary revenue. Bob Dole would tend to agree.

Assume 8 home games each season and an attendance of 76000 each game. If each of the 76000 spends $14.50 on tailgate food and beverages, lodging, fuel and all the other crap associated with attending a game, Arlington breaks even over the 30 year term. (This of course is in terms of cash flow, not bottom line tax revenue recovery.) Bob Dole would take that gamble any day of the week.

Of course, the 51 property owners who are having their property ganked probably don't feel that way...

Great. Now do the cost of renevating Arrowhead, offset by the revenue generated.

It doesn't reallly change my point that cities/states regularly do pay for stadiums that the owners could afford to build themselves. Even though most studies have shown that there is little tangible positive economic effect from having a pro sports franchise in your city.

And like I said in another post. Cities like Washington and Dallas will generate enough luxury suite revenue to make it a viable investment for the owners, while KC doesn't have the corporate presence to compete in that area.

Another less obvious benefit, of a pro sports franchise in an otherwise crappy city like KC is that it will have a positive effect on brain drain, IMO. As midwestern cities and states try and come up with new ways to keep young professionals from moving to more exciting places, losing one of the few fun things to do is a step backwards.

jspchief · 08-03-2005, 07:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by beavis

Silly taxpayers... don't you know money grows on trees?

I'd really like to be a multi-millionaire, then still have the balls to ask the Joe Sixpack down the road to kick in a few bucks so I can have a new building to make more money. It's gotta be a tough life.

Maybe you aren't aware of this, but cities and states routinely come up with economic incentives to keep certain businesses and bring in new businesses.

Like I said before, if KC and it's citizens aren't willing to pay for this, you can bet your ass that some other city will be willing to do it. It has nothing to do with whether Lamar can afford to do it himself, and everything with whether he has to.

**Lzen** · 08-03-2005, 08:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jspchief

Maybe you aren't aware of this, but cities and states routinely come up with economic incentives to keep certain businesses and bring in new businesses.

Like I said before, if KC and it's citizens aren't willing to pay for this, you can bet your ass that some other city will be willing to do it. It has nothing to do with whether Lamar can afford to do it himself, and everything with whether he has to.

Yup. Like Parker, I just hope that when the MO idiots lose the Chiefs, Kansas will step up to the plate.

**Lzen** · 08-03-2005, 08:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by beer me

...and the award for the dumbest post ever goes to............

I imagine that if you read some of his other posts, you'd find that he has a lot of dumbest ever post awards.

Well, maybe I'm being kinda mean. We should cut him a little slack. I think he's just a kid who's still naive and uneducated.

Dr. Johnny Fever · 08-03-2005, 08:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lzen

Yup. Like Parker, I just hope that when the MO idiots lose the Chiefs, Kansas will step up to the plate.

The funny thing then will be all of the bitching some Missourians will do that could have helped pass the bi-state bill... and seeing how many swear off the team because of it.

jidar1 · 08-03-2005, 08:25 AM

Using what the Redskins do as an example for the Chiefs is stupid. They sell their luxury boxes to political lobbyist groups for christ sake. They probably have a higher profit margin than any other team thanks to that. Why do you think they can break the bank in FA every year?

And the Cowboys are formerly known as "America's Team", and their merchandise sells like it. Not only that, their market is larger and it's growing like no other place in the country right now. It's easy to see why the Cowboys would pony up a larger percentage of the cash.

As for the rest of the NFL. Well nobody is paying a lot for their stadiums. NOBODY. And if the thick ****ing skulls in MO think that the Chiefs are going to be one of the few teams to pony up, they need a serious reality check. That is not going to happen. Not a chance. No way in hell. If anything the Chiefs are one of the least likely teams to simply because they can't expect the kinds of returns you get in other markets. You don't get to be wealthy enough to own a pro sports franchise by being stupid.

beavis · 08-03-2005, 09:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jspchief

Maybe you aren't aware of this, but cities and states routinely come up with economic incentives to keep certain businesses and bring in new businesses.

I'm fully aware of it. Doesn't make it any less wrong.

beavis · 08-03-2005, 09:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by penguinz

They are not asking for a new building. They are asking that a PUBLIC OWNED building be kept up to date and in compliance of a lease.

Incorrect. They are asking that the current building be kept up to date until a new facility can be built elsewhere.

**Dave Lane** · 08-03-2005, 09:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phobia

Gretz said it himself.... $2.5 Mill vs. $250 Mill.

When the wife goes to the mall and asks for $2000 some of us will cough up the dough. What if she asks for $20,000?

How about $200,000 says the math instructor...

Dave

**Dave Lane** · 08-03-2005, 09:21 AM

Gretz is such a fucking tool. Yes we know you want $250 MM now go and soak your bottom you son of a window dresser.

Dave

htismaqe · 08-03-2005, 09:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jidar1

Using what the Redskins do as an example for the Chiefs is stupid. They sell their luxury boxes to political lobbyist groups for christ sake. They probably have a higher profit margin than any other team thanks to that. Why do you think they can break the bank in FA every year?

And the Cowboys are formerly known as "America's Team", and their merchandise sells like it. Not only that, their market is larger and it's growing like no other place in the country right now. It's easy to see why the Cowboys would pony up a larger percentage of the cash.

As for the rest of the NFL. Well nobody is paying a lot for their stadiums. NOBODY. And if the thick ****ing skulls in MO think that the Chiefs are going to be one of the few teams to pony up, they need a serious reality check. That is not going to happen. Not a chance. No way in hell. If anything the Chiefs are one of the least likely teams to simply because they can't expect the kinds of returns you get in other markets. You don't get to be wealthy enough to own a pro sports franchise by being stupid.

**penguinz** · 08-03-2005, 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by beavis

Incorrect. They are asking that the current building be kept up to date until a new facility can be built elsewhere.

Peterson has said several times in the last few days that they do not want to Leave Arrowhead. They want to renovate it as what was done in Green Bay.

**Mr. Kotter** · 08-03-2005, 10:39 AM

Sorry, but I think Fat Ass has this right....

Jackson county, and Missouri, better wake up. Or the Chiefs are headed to Johnson county....or worse.

**Bearcat** · 08-03-2005, 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jspchief

Even though most studies have shown that there is little tangible positive economic effect from having a pro sports franchise in your city.

I was just thinking about this... business-wise, it's obviously in the Chiefs' best interest to demand the money, because as it's been mentioned 400 times in this thread, someone else will pay if we don't.

But, from Jackson County's/Kansas City's perspective, is it worth it? In economic terms, the Chiefs might draw more out-of-towners than other teams, plus the away crowd, but it's only 8-20 days a year (preseason, spending the entire weekend). There's a benefit from employees of the large companies in the area to have access to luxury suites, but I don't know what the current demand on those is at Arrowhead. There are the benefits that the Chiefs give, as far as contributions, sponsorships, etc. As well as merchandise to retailers, ticket resales, etc. I don't know if that would all add up to the amount of, say, the Big 12 tournament/NCAA tournament.

08-02-2005, 06:38 PM
ken ott Rookie Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Missouri Casino cash: $10004900	Fat Ass Gretz at it again I Just read his latest article, and it pisses me off. I got no problem paying me more money to help with the stadiums, but the owners (Lamar & Glass) need to pony up more money than 50 mill. by the Royals, and a whopping 25 mill. from the Chiefs. What a bunch of cheap asses. GRETZ: Commitment & Partnership: It Can Happen Aug 02, 2005, 6:03:51 AM by Bob Gretz - FAQ RIVER FALLS, WI – Oh, if only the do nothing folks from the Missouri State House and the No-Show Governor of the Show-Me State could have been here Monday afternoon to see what happens when politicians and a professional football team work together. Right here in the Chiefs summer home was the Governor of Wisconsin, Jim Doyle. He took time out of his busy schedule to be on campus for the official dedication of the training room and locker room renovations that have been done here at UW-River Falls. A relatively small outlay of $2.4 million was enough to get the Governor out of Madison and into the northwestern part of the state. Why? There’s a simple reason: the Chiefs are important to the state of Wisconsin. There were the usual comments about the Chiefs being Wisconsin’s favorite AFC team and sad memories were recalled of the Chiefs visit to Lambeau Field two years ago when they beat the beloved Packers in overtime. But with his mere presence, it was obvious the Governor wasn’t kidding or being politically correct when he said: “The Kansas City Chiefs are part of the Wisconsin family.” He went on to talk about the partnership between the state, the school and the football team. Doyle called the Chiefs a “classy organization” and one that “every time they said they would do something in return for something, it’s been delivered on.” Are you listening in the Missouri House? How about the Governor’s Mansion in Jefferson City? The Chiefs spend 23 to 25 days a year in Wisconsin, but nobody, not the school, the state or the Governor, takes their presence for granted. The folks in the land of cheese have provided a road map on how to get something done. It helps when the Governor is involved. Doyle was part of the process in approving and finding funding for this project from the very start. Much like every other state that makes up our union, Wisconsin has budget problems. There are increasing demands for roads, education and health care. They are the 18th largest state with 5,363, 675 residents. Missouri is the 17th largest state with a population of 5,595,211. So you can see that the problems facing these two states are very similar. Let’s be very clear here: what the state of Wisconsin pulled off with this renovation was peanuts compared to what’s needed at Arrowhead Stadium. It will take more than 100 times the River Falls outlay to return Arrowhead to “state of the art” status. But the route taken from idea (improvements to keep the Chiefs returning to River Falls) to Tuesday’s ribbon cutting is a perfect map for Jackson County and the state of Missouri to follow. First, officials from UW-River Falls brainstormed on how they could improve the facilities on campus with the Chiefs in mind. As part of their process, they spoke at length with the Chiefs and got their ideas. The plan was taken to the state capitol, where Doyle got behind the project. Lobbying efforts were done with the state legislature and with the students of UW-River Falls, who kicked in money for this project as well. There were ups and downs but in 2004, the money was approved for the project and today, the Chiefs enjoy the benefits of a first class training room and locker rooms. Nothing in this process was mysterious or underhanded. UW-River Falls wanted to keep the Chiefs and better their university with improved facilities which will be used by the Chiefs 25 days a year and the students the other 340 days. It was important to the state of Wisconsin that there were improvements at the school and the Chiefs were still summer residents. Something got done. How is the Chiefs situation in Kansas City, Missouri with Arrowhead really any different? It’s time for the do nothings of Missouri to play follow the leader. It’s time for the No Show Governor to take a lesson from Governor Doyle and grab the lead in this situation. In the battle over where funds from the Athletes & Artist tax were directed, the Missouri Governor sat on the sidelines. When the House do nothings killed a vote on the matter, nary a word was heard from the No Show Governor. Governor Jim Doyle and the folks in Wisconsin have shown the way. Oh, by the way, in the middle of the speeches and ceremonies, Carl Peterson got up and announced that the Chiefs would return to River Falls for training camp next season. That’s what happens when you aren’t afraid to make a decision that a football team and everything that comes with it is important for a community, a college and a state. That’s what happens when there’s commitment and partnership.
Posts: 22

08-03-2005, 08:25 AM	#37
jidar1 Starter Join Date: May 2005 Casino cash: $10004900	Bah Using what the Redskins do as an example for the Chiefs is stupid. They sell their luxury boxes to political lobbyist groups for christ sake. They probably have a higher profit margin than any other team thanks to that. Why do you think they can break the bank in FA every year? And the Cowboys are formerly known as "America's Team", and their merchandise sells like it. Not only that, their market is larger and it's growing like no other place in the country right now. It's easy to see why the Cowboys would pony up a larger percentage of the cash. As for the rest of the NFL. Well nobody is paying a lot for their stadiums. NOBODY. And if the thick ****ing skulls in MO think that the Chiefs are going to be one of the few teams to pony up, they need a serious reality check. That is not going to happen. Not a chance. No way in hell. If anything the Chiefs are one of the least likely teams to simply because they can't expect the kinds of returns you get in other markets. You don't get to be wealthy enough to own a pro sports franchise by being stupid.
Posts: 150

08-03-2005, 09:21 AM	#41
Dave Lane Space Cadet and Aczabel Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Kanab, UT, USA Casino cash: $9333275 VARSITY	Gretz is such a fucking tool. Yes we know you want $250 MM now go and soak your bottom you son of a window dresser. Dave __________________ Thanks, Trump for the civics lesson. We are learning so much about RICO, espionage, sedition, impeachment, the 25th Amendment, order of succession, nepotism, separation of powers, 1st Amendment, obstruction of justice, the emoluments clause, conflicts of interest, collusion, sanctions, oligarchs, money laundering and so much more.
Posts: 40,584

08-03-2005, 10:39 AM	#44
Mr. Kotter The Dude Abides Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Dakota Country Casino cash: $5895285	Sorry, but I think Fat Ass has this right.... Jackson county, and Missouri, better wake up. Or the Chiefs are headed to Johnson county....or worse. __________________ "I've always said I worry about legacy and winning rings more than making money at this moment...We see what's going on around the league, but at the same time, I'll never do anything that's going to hurt us from keeping the great players around me.”
Posts: 46,350