College kids lack skills? This report says so.

chagrin · 01-19-2006, 03:09 PM

This doesn't suprise me, seeing how everyone seems to be more focused on how they look, what clothes they wear and what they drive rather than education.

story

WASHINGTON (AP) — Nearing a diploma, most college students cannot handle many complex but common tasks, from understanding credit card offers to comparing the cost per ounce of food.
Those are the sobering findings of a study of literacy on college campuses, the first to target the skills of students as they approach the start of their careers.

More than 50% of students at four-year schools and more than 75% at two-year colleges lacked the skills to perform complex literacy tasks.

That means they could not interpret a table about exercise and blood pressure, understand the arguments of newspaper editorials, compare credit card offers with different interest rates and annual fees or summarize results of a survey about parental involvement in school.

The results cut across three types of literacy: analyzing news stories and other prose, understanding documents and having math skills needed for checkbooks or restaurant tips.

"It is kind of disturbing that a lot of folks are graduating with a degree and they're not going to be able to do those things," said Stephane Baldi, the study's director at the American Institutes for Research, a behavioral and social science research organization.

Most students at community colleges and four-year schools showed intermediate skills, meaning they could perform moderately challenging tasks. Examples include identifying a location on a map, calculating the cost of ordering office supplies or consulting a reference guide to figure out which foods contain a particular vitamin.

There was brighter news.

Overall, the average literacy of college students is significantly higher than that of adults across the nation. Study leaders said that was encouraging but not surprising, given that the spectrum of adults includes those with much less education.

Also, compared with all adults with similar levels of education, college students had superior skills in searching and using information from texts and documents.

"But do they do well enough for a highly educated population? For a knowledge-based economy? The answer is no," said Joni Finney, vice president of the National Center for Public Policy and Higher Education, an independent and non-partisan group.

"This sends a message that we should be monitoring this as a nation, and we don't do it," Finney said. "States have no idea about the knowledge and skills of their college graduates."

The survey examined college and university students nearing the end of their degree programs. The students did the worst on matters involving math, according to the study.

Almost 20% of students pursuing four-year degrees had only basic quantitative skills. For example, the students could not estimate if their car had enough gas to get to the service station. About 30% of two-year students had only basic math skills.

Baldi and Finney said the survey should be used as a tool. They hope state leaders, educators and university trustees will examine the rigor of courses required of all students.

The survey showed a strong relationship between analytic coursework and literacy. Students in two-year and four-year schools scored higher when they took classes that challenged them to apply theories to practical problems or weigh competing arguments.

The college survey used the same test as the National Assessment of Adult Literacy, the government's examination of English literacy among adults. The results of that study were released in December, showing about one in 20 adults is not literate in English.

On campus, the tests were given in 2003 to a representative sample of 1,827 students at public and private schools. The Pew Charitable Trusts funded the survey.

It has a margin of sampling error of plus or minus 3 percentage points.

jidar · 01-19-2006, 03:13 PM

More like, most people simply aren't very bright and when you continually adjust your education system so that everybody who wants into college gets into college, you're going to end up with a bunch of people in college who aren't bright.

Cormac · 01-19-2006, 03:14 PM

Yay. I understood the whole article....until this part

Quote:

It has a margin of sampling error of plus or minus 3 percentage points.

Garcia Bronco · 01-19-2006, 03:15 PM

I think many go to college that would be better off at a trade school.

chagrin · 01-19-2006, 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jidar

More like, most people simply aren't very bright and when you continually adjust your education system so that everybody who wants into college gets into college, you're going to end up with a bunch of people in college who aren't bright.

word

kepp · 01-19-2006, 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jidar

More like, most people simply aren't very bright and when you continually adjust your education system so that everybody who wants into college gets into college, you're going to end up with a bunch of people in college who aren't bright.

Yep...similiar to the concept of "dumbing down" a junior high or high school's curriculum so no one gets "left behind."

**ptlyon** · 01-19-2006, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jidar

More like, most people simply aren't very bright and when you continually adjust your education system so that everybody who wants into college gets into college, you're going to end up with a bunch of people in college who aren't bright.

Buy 'em books, buy 'em books, and what do ya got?

A stupid kid and a room full of books.

KCChiefsMan · 01-19-2006, 03:38 PM

a lot of these students are rich kids who expect everything handed to them, including grades. I'm sure there are a lot of students who have not had a job in their whole lives. I worked 40+ hours per week all through college, 100% financially independant. I guaruntee that my skills coming out of college are far above a lot of the current students who will graduate later on

**Dunit35** · 01-19-2006, 04:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KCChiefsMan

a lot of these students are rich kids who expect everything handed to them, including grades. I'm sure there are a lot of students who have not had a job in their whole lives. I worked 40+ hours per week all through college, 100% financially independant. I guaruntee that my skills coming out of college are far above a lot of the current students who will graduate later on

Great post KCChiefsMan. I know a lot of people in the dorms I live in and I can only think of one person that has a job. That would be me, my job sucks but without it I would probably have no money. In fact when my old roomate would run out of money, he would just call his parents and they would send him some. I dont think once, did it ever cross his mind to work alittle bit. His parents still do his checkbook.

**Bob Dole** · 01-19-2006, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garcia Bronco

I think many go to college that would be better off at a trade school.

Actually, in many cases it's getting increasingly difficult to distinguish college from trade school.

Hydrae · 01-19-2006, 05:09 PM

My question though is, shouldn't these mostly be skills people should know coming out of HIGH SCHOOL? We are talking about things needed for ever day living and there are a lot of us out here that never went to college who can do this stuff. That doesn't mean I can earn as much money as the idiot who went to college for 4 years though even though my intelligence is evidently much higher.

**Bearcat** · 01-19-2006, 05:10 PM

We have some of the brightest 4th graders in the world, but by the time they finish high school they're way behind.... then I saw something the other night saying we need competition within school districts, and some teachers were actually saying that wasn't the answer, because "competition isn't good for the children".... guess we could ask the KC school district if Plan A: Throwing lots of money into the district, worked out

dj56dt58 · 01-19-2006, 05:11 PM

Can't understand articles in a newspaper? Must be reading JW's column..

**Bob Dole** · 01-19-2006, 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hydrae

My question though is, shouldn't these mostly be skills people should know coming out of HIGH SCHOOL? We are talking about things needed for ever day living and there are a lot of us out here that never went to college who can do this stuff. That doesn't mean I can earn as much money as the idiot who went to college for 4 years though even though my intelligence is evidently much higher.

Hush yo mouf.

We wouldn't want to risk setting the expectations so high that someone might fail to meet them and subsequently damage their self-esteem.

Skills and knowledge are over rated. What's most important is that we all feel good about ourselves.

**Dunit35** · 01-19-2006, 10:16 PM

A high school grad can make more money than a college grad, but a lot of times its a lot harder of a job. Working in the oilfield and other jobs like that.

01-19-2006, 03:09 PM
chagrin Giggitty! Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Missoula, Mt Casino cash: $9914905	College kids lack skills? This report says so. This doesn't suprise me, seeing how everyone seems to be more focused on how they look, what clothes they wear and what they drive rather than education. story WASHINGTON (AP) — Nearing a diploma, most college students cannot handle many complex but common tasks, from understanding credit card offers to comparing the cost per ounce of food. Those are the sobering findings of a study of literacy on college campuses, the first to target the skills of students as they approach the start of their careers. More than 50% of students at four-year schools and more than 75% at two-year colleges lacked the skills to perform complex literacy tasks. That means they could not interpret a table about exercise and blood pressure, understand the arguments of newspaper editorials, compare credit card offers with different interest rates and annual fees or summarize results of a survey about parental involvement in school. The results cut across three types of literacy: analyzing news stories and other prose, understanding documents and having math skills needed for checkbooks or restaurant tips. "It is kind of disturbing that a lot of folks are graduating with a degree and they're not going to be able to do those things," said Stephane Baldi, the study's director at the American Institutes for Research, a behavioral and social science research organization. Most students at community colleges and four-year schools showed intermediate skills, meaning they could perform moderately challenging tasks. Examples include identifying a location on a map, calculating the cost of ordering office supplies or consulting a reference guide to figure out which foods contain a particular vitamin. There was brighter news. Overall, the average literacy of college students is significantly higher than that of adults across the nation. Study leaders said that was encouraging but not surprising, given that the spectrum of adults includes those with much less education. Also, compared with all adults with similar levels of education, college students had superior skills in searching and using information from texts and documents. "But do they do well enough for a highly educated population? For a knowledge-based economy? The answer is no," said Joni Finney, vice president of the National Center for Public Policy and Higher Education, an independent and non-partisan group. "This sends a message that we should be monitoring this as a nation, and we don't do it," Finney said. "States have no idea about the knowledge and skills of their college graduates." The survey examined college and university students nearing the end of their degree programs. The students did the worst on matters involving math, according to the study. Almost 20% of students pursuing four-year degrees had only basic quantitative skills. For example, the students could not estimate if their car had enough gas to get to the service station. About 30% of two-year students had only basic math skills. Baldi and Finney said the survey should be used as a tool. They hope state leaders, educators and university trustees will examine the rigor of courses required of all students. The survey showed a strong relationship between analytic coursework and literacy. Students in two-year and four-year schools scored higher when they took classes that challenged them to apply theories to practical problems or weigh competing arguments. The college survey used the same test as the National Assessment of Adult Literacy, the government's examination of English literacy among adults. The results of that study were released in December, showing about one in 20 adults is not literate in English. On campus, the tests were given in 2003 to a representative sample of 1,827 students at public and private schools. The Pew Charitable Trusts funded the survey. It has a margin of sampling error of plus or minus 3 percentage points.
Posts: 13,394

01-19-2006, 03:13 PM	#2
jidar MVP Join Date: May 2005 Location: a Casino cash: $10004900	More like, most people simply aren't very bright and when you continually adjust your education system so that everybody who wants into college gets into college, you're going to end up with a bunch of people in college who aren't bright.
Posts: 5,502

01-19-2006, 03:15 PM	#4
Garcia Bronco No Keys, No Problem Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Denver Casino cash: $5253136	I think many go to college that would be better off at a trade school.
Posts: 30,863

01-19-2006, 03:38 PM	#8
KCChiefsMan AIC Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: West Roxbury, MA Casino cash: $10004900	a lot of these students are rich kids who expect everything handed to them, including grades. I'm sure there are a lot of students who have not had a job in their whole lives. I worked 40+ hours per week all through college, 100% financially independant. I guaruntee that my skills coming out of college are far above a lot of the current students who will graduate later on
Posts: 11,478

01-19-2006, 05:09 PM	#11
Hydrae Sandbox: Leander Lasercats Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Austin, Tx Casino cash: $2297000	My question though is, shouldn't these mostly be skills people should know coming out of HIGH SCHOOL? We are talking about things needed for ever day living and there are a lot of us out here that never went to college who can do this stuff. That doesn't mean I can earn as much money as the idiot who went to college for 4 years though even though my intelligence is evidently much higher.
Posts: 14,687

01-19-2006, 05:10 PM	#12
Bearcat Would an idiot do that? Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Arizona Casino cash: $2784931	We have some of the brightest 4th graders in the world, but by the time they finish high school they're way behind.... then I saw something the other night saying we need competition within school districts, and some teachers were actually saying that wasn't the answer, because "competition isn't good for the children".... guess we could ask the KC school district if Plan A: Throwing lots of money into the district, worked out __________________
Posts: 55,345

01-19-2006, 05:11 PM	#13
dj56dt58 Banned Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Missouri Casino cash: $9960055	Can't understand articles in a newspaper? Must be reading JW's column..
Posts: 6,361

01-19-2006, 10:16 PM	#15
Dunit35 Keepin it Real Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Oklahoma Casino cash: $1507045	A high school grad can make more money than a college grad, but a lot of times its a lot harder of a job. Working in the oilfield and other jobs like that.
Posts: 10,489