Poe.

[Buckweath]

People need to stop with being disappointed by Dorsey and Jackson poor sack numbers, or poor pass rush if you prefer.

Do you realize this Chiefs defense with Dorsey and Jackson starting all 16 games finished 6th in the league in pass defense despite having no Eric Berry back there and a passrusher like Justin Houston who wasn't a factor early on.
Did you see those games against Rodgers, Big Ben, Brady (without Eric Berry I remember you)?

Let's hope Dontari Poe can collapse the pocket regularly, if not this year next year, but I definitly think Dorsey and Jackson are a good part of the reason why this defense might already be elite.

I really hope the Chiefs resign Dorsey, he is an underrated player, not a star but real solid.

[ModSocks]

Originally Posted by Buckweath

People need to stop with being disappointed by Dorsey and Jackson poor sack numbers, or poor pass rush if you prefer.

Do you realize this Chiefs defense with Dorsey and Jackson starting all 16 games finished 6th in the league in pass defense despite having no Eric Berry back there and a passrusher like Justin Houston who wasn't a factor early on.
Did you see those games against Rodgers, Big Ben, Brady (without Eric Berry I remember you)?

Let's hope Dontari Poe can collapse the pocket regularly, if not this year next year, but I definitly think Dorsey and Jackson are a good part of the reason why this defense might already be elite.

I really hope the Chiefs resign Dorsey, he is an underrated player, not a star but real solid.

Considering Dorsey and Jackson come out on obvious passing downs, and that the Chiefs were near the bottom in total sacks, ima say that Jackson and Dorsey DIDN'T have a large part in that.

Tying up blockers and stopping the run is not their only job. If this Defense is going to take the next step forward to ELITE status, they have to get more production out of their DE's.

[Buckweath]

Originally Posted by Detoxing

Considering Dorsey and Jackson come out on obvious passing downs, and that the Chiefs were near the bottom in total sacks, ima say that Jackson and Dorsey DIDN'T have a large part in that.

Tying up blockers and stopping the run is not their only job. If this Defense is going to take the next step forward to ELITE status, they have to get more production out of their DE's.

Whatever if we have a rotation at DEs... Do you deny that the Chiefs pass defence was elite in the second half of last season?

It's clear to me that Dorsey and Jackson's primary job is to stop the run, which they have proved to be great at. I wish they woud give us a bit more passrush but I don't expect it to happen and with the rise of Justin Houston, Allen Bailey and hopefully a decent rookie season by Poe, why are you so concerned by Dorsey and Jackson pass rush?

Between Hali, Houston, Bailey, maybe Poe and Berry and Arenas as great DB passrushers, the passrush will be fine my friend, do not worry.

[ModSocks]

Originally Posted by Buckweath

Whatever if we have a rotation at DEs... Do you deny that the Chiefs pass defence was elite in the second half of last season?

It's clear to me that Dorsey and Jackson's primary job is to stop the run, which they have proved to be great at. I wish they woud give us a bit more passrush but I don't expect it to happen and with the rise of Justin Houston, Allen Bailey and hopefully a decent rookie season by Poe, why are you so concerned by Dorsey and Jackson pass rush?

Between Hali, Houston, Bailey, maybe Poe and Berry and Arenas as great DB passrushers, the passrush will be fine my friend, do not worry.

There is a lot of cause to be concerned about the pass rush. They were tied for 3rd worst in the league last season.

Dorsey and Jackson combined for a whopping ONE sack the ENTIRE season. That is pathetic.

So lets go with what you've dreamed up though.

Hali continues to be Hali and gets 12-14 Sacks.

Houston Continue where he left off and get 8-10 Sacks.

Dorsey and Jackson continue Being Dorsey and Jackson: 1 Sack

The DB's rushing the QB thing is a bit of a reach, but we'll go with it.

Arenas: 2 Sacks

Berry: 2 Sacks

Now lets say we get about 10 sacks from everywhere else (which is what we got last year) : That would put us at 34 Sacks on the season.

We will have improved from 29th int the league to about 20th.

Not good enough.

BUT

If Dorsey and Jackson do what a good 34 DE would do...Produce 4-5 Sacks each on the season, then we'd be top 10.

Or....close to Elite.

Point?

Dorsey and Jackson producing a combined 1 sack per season isn't going to cut it.

[Rasputin]

Thank you Detoxing, that's the kind of point I was trying to make out of my questions. I havn't fealt like they've played good enough especially on passing downs. This year they best be getting at the QB. Poes job is collaps the inside, but he is too young & wet behind the ears to get his technique down to be that effective for his first year so we got to count on Dorsey & T Jack to really get after the QB. We should be constructive critisism for there play on the field imo & not just say that's good enough, it's not.

[ModSocks]

Originally Posted by KC Tattoo

Thank you Detoxing, that's the kind of point I was trying to make out of my questions. I havn't fealt like they've played good enough especially on passing downs. This year they best be getting at the QB. Poes job is collaps the inside, but he is too young & wet behind the ears to get his technique down to be that effective for his first year so we got to count on Dorsey & T Jack to really get after the QB. We should be constructive critisism for there play on the field imo & not just say that's good enough, it's not.

Exactly. It's not good enough. I'm not saying they are bad players, but they have to step it up in passing situations. Their lack of production is too much for the rest of the team to overcome, and Poe isn't going to do them any favors, at least not in his first year or two. There isn't a NT on the planet that will help Dorsey and Jackson win 1vs1. They have to do it themselves, and to this point, neither have shown that they can.

We're not asking for the world here. Something like 4-5 sacks each. We need them to produce that if this D is going to take the next step forward.

The problem with CP's members is that "They just have to clog the lanes" has been beaten into so many people's heads.

It's PART of their job, not their only job.

Even if Houston picks up where he left off and Hali continues to be Hali, it won't be enough to make this defense Elite. Not until those two step it up.

[Rasputin]

To me it's so what if you can stop the run? Can you stop the pass on first, second or third downs? Cus teams are passing on all the downs and the offences have it easy with the rules so DBs are having to lay off the WRs so it's a must to be able to attack the QB from the D line.

[themanwithnoname]

Originally Posted by Detoxing

There is a lot of cause to be concerned about the pass rush. They were tied for 3rd worst in the league last season.

Dorsey and Jackson combined for a whopping ONE sack the ENTIRE season. That is pathetic.

So lets go with what you've dreamed up though.

Hali continues to be Hali and gets 12-14 Sacks.

Houston Continue where he left off and get 8-10 Sacks.

Dorsey and Jackson continue Being Dorsey and Jackson: 1 Sack

The DB's rushing the QB thing is a bit of a reach, but we'll go with it.

Arenas: 2 Sacks

Berry: 2 Sacks

Now lets say we get about 10 sacks from everywhere else (which is what we got last year) : That would put us at 34 Sacks on the season.

We will have improved from 29th int the league to about 20th.

Not good enough.

BUT

If Dorsey and Jackson do what a good 34 DE would do...Produce 4-5 Sacks each on the season, then we'd be top 10.

Or....close to Elite.

Point?

Dorsey and Jackson producing a combined 1 sack per season isn't going to cut it.

But, if Dorsey and Jackson aren't in on passing downs so how are they going to get sacks then? Point, without knowing exactly what they are being asked to actually do, how can you say they need to improve?

Jackson and Dorsey are there to enable others to make plays. Odd that after their improved play, we're talking about how DJ, Hali, and now Houston are making plays. The problem is that its still not enough because the Chiefs are not a big blitzing defense, and rely on just a couple of guys to essentially be their pass rush (hell you could almost argue one guy and amazingly its actually worked decently). I personally would like to see them get more aggressive, and I think that is actually the next step that needs to be taken. We'll see how things turn out obviously, but I think Jackson and Dorsey were told deliberately not to be super aggressive and get after the QB.

[Rasputin]

Originally Posted by themanwithnoname

But, if Dorsey and Jackson aren't in on passing downs so how are they going to get sacks then? Point, without knowing exactly what they are being asked to actually do, how can you say they need to improve?

Jackson and Dorsey are there to enable others to make plays. Odd that after their improved play, we're talking about how DJ, Hali, and now Houston are making plays. The problem is that its still not enough because the Chiefs are not a big blitzing defense, and rely on just a couple of guys to essentially be their pass rush (hell you could almost argue one guy and amazingly its actually worked decently). I personally would like to see them get more aggressive, and I think that is actually the next step that needs to be taken. We'll see how things turn out obviously, but I think Jackson and Dorsey were told deliberately not to be super aggressive and get after the QB.

I don't think it be too much to ask for each of them to get 10 sacks or average a sack a game would be nice. The thing is one sack for the season just doesn't cut it for either of them and I don't care it's not recipe for winning when your DEs get one sack per year. Even in a 34, at the least give me 12 sacks combined between them. One sack is BS. On a good season they both can get 10+sacks.

[whoman69]

Originally Posted by themanwithnoname

But, if Dorsey and Jackson aren't in on passing downs so how are they going to get sacks then? Point, without knowing exactly what they are being asked to actually do, how can you say they need to improve?

Jackson and Dorsey are there to enable others to make plays. Odd that after their improved play, we're talking about how DJ, Hali, and now Houston are making plays. The problem is that its still not enough because the Chiefs are not a big blitzing defense, and rely on just a couple of guys to essentially be their pass rush (hell you could almost argue one guy and amazingly its actually worked decently). I personally would like to see them get more aggressive, and I think that is actually the next step that needs to be taken. We'll see how things turn out obviously, but I think Jackson and Dorsey were told deliberately not to be super aggressive and get after the QB.

Sorry but they were on the field for 200 passing downs last year. Teams are throwing out of their base set against our base defense on 1st and 2nd downs. That means for all those plays Dorsey and Jackson are next to useless.