Quick question on the game sunday...

PastorMikH · 09-18-2006, 03:53 PM

I put this up in a thread, but it will probably die there and I would like something explained to me.

On the drive at the end of half when Dante caught the ball for a first, got hit, but turned and got out of bounds, why wasn't Dante ruled out of bounds? I just go through watching that play. He caught the ball, got hit, but managed to turn and run with the defender on his back out of bounds. It is my opinion that the clock SHOULD HAVE BEEN STOPPED. I know they said forward progress had stopped, but the reason it stopped was Dante turned and ran for the OB to stop the clock instead of juking and trying to go forward.

I've seen many plays just like that where the ball carrier got out of bounds, some while being tackled and stretching, and the clock is stopped. Why didn't that happen sunday?

Stinger · 09-18-2006, 03:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PastorMikH

I know they said forward progress had stopped,

There is your answer forward progress was stopped on the field of play so the player is down on the field and not out of bounds to stop the clock. It was the judgement of the official.

Hootie · 09-18-2006, 04:01 PM

forward progress was stopped, and if it wasn't, then he ran backwards and wouldn't have picked up the first down. So it was either first down forward progress stops, or 4th down clock stops...Personally, I think the referee got it right on the field.

jspchief · 09-18-2006, 04:02 PM

If they had granted his run out of bounds as part of the play, that would have negated allowing him his forward progress, thus taking away the first down he had reached.

Think of it like this:

Joe Runningback gets to the 20 yardline, but hits a wall of defenders. If that wall of defenders pushes him backwards at that point, he granted "forward progress" at the 20 and the play is considered dead at his furthest point upfield. However, if he escapes that wall of defenders by running backwards, then gets tackled further back, he loses those yards.

Hall couldn't have the benefit of "forward progress" while still being allowed to run around to get out of bounds. He was either OB short of the marker, or dead at forward progress in bounds past the marker.

Hootie · 09-18-2006, 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jspchief

If they had granted his run out of bounds as part of the play, that would have negated allowing him his forward progress, thus taking away the first down he had reached.

Think of it like this:

Joe Runningback gets to the 20 yardline, but hits a wall of defenders. If that wall of defenders pushes him backwards at that point, he granted "forward progress" at the 20 and the play is considered dead at his furthest point upfield. However, if he escapes that wall of defenders by running backwards, then gets tackled further back, he loses those yards.

Hall couldn't have the benefit of "forward progress" while still being allowed to run around to get out of bounds. He was either OB short of the marker, or dead at forward progress in bounds past the marker.

I just made this same post but did it in about half the words. I'm amazing.

2bikemike · 09-18-2006, 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stinger

There is your answer forward progress was stopped on the field of play so the player is down on the field and not out of bounds to stop the clock. It was the judgement of the official.

Maybe I am not remembering correctly but Dante was clearly across the 1st down marker when he turned and headed for the sideline retreating a yard or two in the process. IIRC they marked the ball 1 yard short of the 1st down marker. I recall being a little confused on that play as well.

I hate watching the game at sports bars and not on my big screen with the DVR so I miss a lot at the sports bar.

Hootie · 09-18-2006, 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2bikemike

Maybe I am not remembering correctly but Dante was clearly across the 1st down marker when he turned and headed for the sideline retreating a yard or two in the process. IIRC they marked the ball 1 yard short of the 1st down marker. I recall being a little confused on that play as well.

I hate watching the game at sports bars and not on my big screen with the DVR so I miss a lot at the sports bar.

Wrong.

His forward progress was across the 1st down marker, where he ended up out of bounds was a yard shy.

PastorMikH · 09-18-2006, 04:20 PM

Thanks JSP

So, had Dante caught the ball further beyond and get OB in like manner, would they have stopped the clock then since it wasn't a choice between stopping the clock on 4th verses running it on first?

chief52 · 09-18-2006, 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PastorMikH

Thanks JSP

So, had Dante caught the ball further beyond and get OB in like manner, would they have stopped the clock then since it wasn't a choice between stopping the clock on 4th verses running it on first?

Not sure I understand your question, but the bottom line is if the official gives the runner forward progress the clock will be live. Forward progress can only be given in the field of play. The play is dead at that point and if the runner gets pushed out of bounds he is carrying a dead ball. The play is already over.

Hootie · 09-18-2006, 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chief52

Not sure I understand your question, but the bottom line is if the official gives the runner forward progress the clock will be live. Forward progress can only be given in the field of play. The play is dead at that point and if the runner gets pushed out of bounds he is carrying a dead ball. The play is already over.

dude, we answered the question 14 times in this thread already...

chief52 · 09-18-2006, 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hootie

dude, we answered the question 14 times in this thread already...

Sorry Dude...apparently he had another question. Guess you missed that one.

09-18-2006, 03:53 PM
PastorMikH Will KC ever be better? Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Land of Red Dirt & Necks Casino cash: $9945087	Quick question on the game sunday... I put this up in a thread, but it will probably die there and I would like something explained to me. On the drive at the end of half when Dante caught the ball for a first, got hit, but turned and got out of bounds, why wasn't Dante ruled out of bounds? I just go through watching that play. He caught the ball, got hit, but managed to turn and run with the defender on his back out of bounds. It is my opinion that the clock SHOULD HAVE BEEN STOPPED. I know they said forward progress had stopped, but the reason it stopped was Dante turned and ran for the OB to stop the clock instead of juking and trying to go forward. I've seen many plays just like that where the ball carrier got out of bounds, some while being tackled and stretching, and the clock is stopped. Why didn't that happen sunday?
Posts: 20,454

09-18-2006, 04:01 PM	#3
Hootie Banned Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Dallas, Texas Casino cash: $10004900	forward progress was stopped, and if it wasn't, then he ran backwards and wouldn't have picked up the first down. So it was either first down forward progress stops, or 4th down clock stops...Personally, I think the referee got it right on the field.
Posts: 56,356

09-18-2006, 04:02 PM	#4
jspchief BAMF Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Your Face Casino cash: $9998710	If they had granted his run out of bounds as part of the play, that would have negated allowing him his forward progress, thus taking away the first down he had reached. Think of it like this: Joe Runningback gets to the 20 yardline, but hits a wall of defenders. If that wall of defenders pushes him backwards at that point, he granted "forward progress" at the 20 and the play is considered dead at his furthest point upfield. However, if he escapes that wall of defenders by running backwards, then gets tackled further back, he loses those yards. Hall couldn't have the benefit of "forward progress" while still being allowed to run around to get out of bounds. He was either OB short of the marker, or dead at forward progress in bounds past the marker. __________________ Courage is not the absence of fear but rather the judgment that something is more important than fear. The brave may not live forever but the cautious do not live at all.
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09-18-2006, 04:20 PM	#8
PastorMikH Will KC ever be better? Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Land of Red Dirt & Necks Casino cash: $9945087	Thanks JSP So, had Dante caught the ball further beyond and get OB in like manner, would they have stopped the clock then since it wasn't a choice between stopping the clock on 4th verses running it on first? __________________
Posts: 20,454