All of you who want the Chiefs to lose out - Page 2

htismaqe · 12-05-2000, 05:58 PM

OK, I know that you are disapointed, frustrated, upset, and just plain mad. But trust me this is not the best way to handle the situation.
For those of you who want to lose so as to get a top draft pick, what good would that do if we don't use him right? He would be with us for a couple of years then leave (probaly to one of our divisional rivals). A high draft pick will not help as much as you people would like to belive.
Those of you who want the team to lose out so that evryone on the coaching staff is fired, what about the talent on the team that does not want to be associated with a losing team. We have some people that other teams would scoop up in a New York minute (for example Gonzo). [b]These players are more likely to leave if the fans are not even behind them![/b] Why should the players go out and play for fans who don't want them to win. Why do you think they are out there? I understand that you want to clean house as far as coaching, but you take a risk of losing your team as well, because who would want to play for fans like you? I sure wouldn't!
Again I understand your frustrations, but turning on your team is not the way to deal with it. It really makes you guys look like band wagon fans. It is not very becoming of you.

!!!GO CHIEFS!!!

------------------
WILDCATS 29
corn balls 28

Quarterback · 12-05-2000, 10:23 PM

I wore my Chiefs gear today...In Denver.

Anybody else?

Ugly Duck · 12-05-2000, 10:35 PM

always have and always will wear my Chiefs cap everyday.

htismaqe · 12-05-2000, 10:36 PM

You see I don't understand this line of thinking, because to me loyality is of the utmost importance. And being a loyal person, I do not like to see someone or something that I love do poorly. It gives what I love a bad rep, and it gives me a bad rep. Plus the thought of rooting against a team that I have attached myself to, and given my support, is down right wrong. I don't know that I could look myself in the mirror knowing that I have turned on something I love. I just can't do it. For those of you who think that the players are out there for the money, I can't disagree with that, but why did they start playing to begin with? For the love of the game. These players are out there, because they love what they do, and the fact they get paid ridiculous sums of money to do it is an added bonus that, unfortunitly, does become the focus of way to many players. I don't like it, but that is life. I still think that handling this situation this way will have a bigger impact on the players than you all realize. I also would like to say that I agree with Joe Seahawk in post 12. He has a very good point. I can see that I am not going to talk you out of this way of thinking, so I guess that I will quit trying (what is wrong with me? I never give up trying to convince someone that I am right, when I know beyond a shadow of a doubt that I am. I'm slipping). Trust me, there are other ways with wich to deal with these matters. But since you have your minds made up, so be it.

[b]NEVER SAY DIE![/b]
[b]!!!GO CHIEFS!!![/b]

------------------
WILDCATS 29
corn balls 28

[This message has been edited by raiderhader (edited 12-05-2000).]

Ugly Duck · 12-05-2000, 10:41 PM

Raiderhader- we're demonstrating tough love

htismaqe · 12-05-2000, 10:45 PM

CP, I belive strongly in tuff love, but I am not sure that this qualifies. When you love someone, you don't want to see them fall. You know that it will happen, but you take no liking to it at all.

[b]NEVER SAY DIE![/b]
[b]!!!GO CHIEFS!!![/b]

------------------
WILDCATS 29
corn balls 28

elvislivesinkc · 12-05-2000, 10:46 PM

We need to clean house in coaching and management. Our current bunch of clowns has failed. They have lost the respect of the fans and the players. The season is already a failure. If we don't dump Carl, Gun and the Stooges, the future will be a failure as well. They had their chance, and they blew it. Could any of you perform this poorly at your job and NOT GET FIRED? I sure couldn't.

I don't like watching the Chiefs lose week after week. But I'll take it over watching them lose year after year. We have too much talent to be this bad, and no one in the league is playing as bad as the Chiefs are right now. Someone else will do better. I don't see how they could do worse.

Of course, what any of us doom-types say doesn't mean much. We aren't losing to good teams anymore - we're getting slapped around by the doormats, the other doormats, of the NFL. I simply don't see how the Chiefs could beat anyone right now. They're coming close, they're getting blown out, they're beating themselves, they're getting beat by others. There is only one constant.

Tick-tock, Gun.

Political Observer · 12-06-2000, 06:16 AM

Frazod,
You bring up something that leads me to a question.
I am/have been of like mind with many of you. I have been rooting for the Chiefs to win each game with the same ferver and passion during the game as always, while at the end, when the losses have mounted up, I haven't been nearly as upset, because with each loss I have felt that Goonther MaGoo's hold on his job was slipping more and more.
The question, since it is clear to us, the fans, that MaGoo and the staff have lost the respect of the players and fans, should it also not be clear to the people that matter, the people who have the power to make the necessary changes? Would winning at this point change that perception? If not, then do any of us want to see continued losses just to improve our draft position? I don't.
the milkman
really doesn't like losing

[This message has been edited by Lompoc Brave (edited 12-06-2000).]

kc hopeful · 12-06-2000, 11:17 AM

While I will never advocate intentionally losing games at this point The W's and L's are less important than evaluation of young talent. The Chiefs can not make the playoffs this year so they need to take this opportunity to evaluate their players under true game conditions. Cloud, Moreau, etc.. need to get a chance to show what they can or can't do. Todd Collins needs some PT to show if he is capable of being the Chiefs 2nd string QB next year. I say throw them in the pond and see if they sink or swim.

------------------
"A bartender is just a pharmacist with a limited inventory."

wutamess · 12-06-2000, 11:32 AM

IMO we should play the final 3 games to evaluate young players (as Rod said), and also to win if at all possible.

I don't care about draft position. If we pick 5th or 6th and get hit with a huge rookie contract, how the hell are we going to fit it under the cap? Anyway, there are plenty of top quality players which can be picked around 15th if we finish 8-8. Obviously that is where we drafted Gonzo and Tait. It depends more on talent evaluation at the end of the day, than on where you pick.

I also don't care about schedule. [b]It doesn't matter anymore[/b] given the age of parity. Last year Denver had an "easy" schedule but ended up playing teams that ALL finished .500 or better. Oakland's schedule went the opposite way, looked like a ***** and then turned out much more easy than anticipated given which direction Minnesota, GB and Miami (among others) went.

If our coaching staff is retained, whether we finish 5-11 or 8-8 I will be sooooo disgusted. There is NOTHING they can do in the remaining 3 games to redeem themselves. So we might as well win them for confidence sake. Winning out might avoid a "habit of losing" from developing. I [b]hope[/b] we finish 8-8 to carry some momentum (to go with a new coaching staff!) into next season. Losing is never good IMO.

Go Chiefs.

12-06-2000, 11:46 AM

A very, very good friend of mine has been a methamphetamine addict for about 7 years. He's been arrested, spent time in prison, has 3 kids he'll never see again (and he's never been married), he hurts everybody he comes into contact with, and so on. Everyday we tried to talk to him. Everyday we ROOTED FOR HIM TO WIN THIS BATTLE.

About 6 weeks ago, 2 guys broke into his house, supposedly because he owed them money or drugs or whatever, and beat him within an inch of his life. For about 4 days, he was sober. Then he came back one night and said, "you know, if I hadn't of been tweaking that night, I wouldn't have been strong enough to fight those guys off."

At some point, it became painfully obvious that the only way he will ever beat this is to have something so bad, so vile, happen that he won't be able to go back.

That is how I feel about the Chiefs. This team is going nowhere, and fast. If they win the last 3 to go 8-8, Carl will see that as a "step in the right direction" and he will RETAIN the WORST COACHING staff in the NFL. If they lose the last 3, it's quite possible that even CP won't be back. And in the long run, "the big picture", that's a GOOD thing.

I can assure you that the players right now understand how the fans feel. EVERYBODY, player and fan alike, is frustrated with the coaching staff and you can see it in their faces.

If we win out, go 8-8, and retain the current GM and staff, how many more 7-9, 8-8, 9-7 seasons are you willing to go through?

I love the Chiefs and I root for them to win. However, if they don't, I will be happy with that, this time.

------------------
Parker
[b]ChiefsPlanet Administrator</B>

12-06-2000, 11:51 AM

To add to what's already been said...

It's not about Gunther getting fired. 5-11 or 8-8, I think he will be retained. Firing him with 2 years left on his contract would make the King look real bad.

However, the difference between 5-11 and 8-8 is HUGE when Lamar looks at CP's contract. That's the key. It's not Gunther, or the stooges that need to go. If CP doesn't stay, the exit of the coaching staff is IMPLIED.

------------------
Parker
[b]ChiefsPlanet Administrator</B>

Chief Henry · 12-06-2000, 07:50 PM

I just want to win one more game, the Donx of course. Then I wouldn't mind finishing 6-10. That would be the best of both worlds. Bad enough to get a good pick and fire all the coordinators and maybe even Gun. A double digit sloss season could do the trick. However, a 7-9 one will not guarantee a good pick.

12-05-2000, 10:23 PM	#16
Quarterback Starter Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: San Jose, CA, USA Casino cash: $10004900	I wore my Chiefs gear today...In Denver. Anybody else?
Posts: 451

12-05-2000, 10:35 PM	#17
Ugly Duck MVP Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Petaluma, CA, USA Casino cash: $9955920	always have and always will wear my Chiefs cap everyday.
Posts: 10,146

12-05-2000, 10:36 PM	#18
htismaqe 'Tis my eye! Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Chiefsplanet Casino cash: $10269900	You see I don't understand this line of thinking, because to me loyality is of the utmost importance. And being a loyal person, I do not like to see someone or something that I love do poorly. It gives what I love a bad rep, and it gives me a bad rep. Plus the thought of rooting against a team that I have attached myself to, and given my support, is down right wrong. I don't know that I could look myself in the mirror knowing that I have turned on something I love. I just can't do it. For those of you who think that the players are out there for the money, I can't disagree with that, but why did they start playing to begin with? For the love of the game. These players are out there, because they love what they do, and the fact they get paid ridiculous sums of money to do it is an added bonus that, unfortunitly, does become the focus of way to many players. I don't like it, but that is life. I still think that handling this situation this way will have a bigger impact on the players than you all realize. I also would like to say that I agree with Joe Seahawk in post 12. He has a very good point. I can see that I am not going to talk you out of this way of thinking, so I guess that I will quit trying (what is wrong with me? I never give up trying to convince someone that I am right, when I know beyond a shadow of a doubt that I am. I'm slipping). Trust me, there are other ways with wich to deal with these matters. But since you have your minds made up, so be it. [b]NEVER SAY DIE![/b] [b]!!!GO CHIEFS!!![/b] ------------------ WILDCATS 29 corn balls 28 [This message has been edited by raiderhader (edited 12-05-2000).]
Posts: 100,022

12-05-2000, 10:41 PM	#19
Ugly Duck MVP Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Petaluma, CA, USA Casino cash: $9955920	Raiderhader- we're demonstrating tough love
Posts: 10,146

12-05-2000, 10:45 PM	#20
htismaqe 'Tis my eye! Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Chiefsplanet Casino cash: $10269900	CP, I belive strongly in tuff love, but I am not sure that this qualifies. When you love someone, you don't want to see them fall. You know that it will happen, but you take no liking to it at all. [b]NEVER SAY DIE![/b] [b]!!!GO CHIEFS!!![/b] ------------------ WILDCATS 29 corn balls 28
Posts: 100,022

12-05-2000, 05:58 PM
htismaqe 'Tis my eye! Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Chiefsplanet Casino cash: $10269900	OK, I know that you are disapointed, frustrated, upset, and just plain mad. But trust me this is not the best way to handle the situation. For those of you who want to lose so as to get a top draft pick, what good would that do if we don't use him right? He would be with us for a couple of years then leave (probaly to one of our divisional rivals). A high draft pick will not help as much as you people would like to belive. Those of you who want the team to lose out so that evryone on the coaching staff is fired, what about the talent on the team that does not want to be associated with a losing team. We have some people that other teams would scoop up in a New York minute (for example Gonzo). [b]These players are more likely to leave if the fans are not even behind them![/b] Why should the players go out and play for fans who don't want them to win. Why do you think they are out there? I understand that you want to clean house as far as coaching, but you take a risk of losing your team as well, because who would want to play for fans like you? I sure wouldn't! Again I understand your frustrations, but turning on your team is not the way to deal with it. It really makes you guys look like band wagon fans. It is not very becoming of you. !!!GO CHIEFS!!! ------------------ WILDCATS 29 corn balls 28
Posts: 100,022

12-05-2000, 10:46 PM	#21
elvislivesinkc Veteran Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: hollywood, ca 90028 Casino cash: $10004900	We need to clean house in coaching and management. Our current bunch of clowns has failed. They have lost the respect of the fans and the players. The season is already a failure. If we don't dump Carl, Gun and the Stooges, the future will be a failure as well. They had their chance, and they blew it. Could any of you perform this poorly at your job and NOT GET FIRED? I sure couldn't. I don't like watching the Chiefs lose week after week. But I'll take it over watching them lose year after year. We have too much talent to be this bad, and no one in the league is playing as bad as the Chiefs are right now. Someone else will do better. I don't see how they could do worse. Of course, what any of us doom-types say doesn't mean much. We aren't losing to good teams anymore - we're getting slapped around by the doormats, the other doormats, of the NFL. I simply don't see how the Chiefs could beat anyone right now. They're coming close, they're getting blown out, they're beating themselves, they're getting beat by others. There is only one constant. Tick-tock, Gun.
Posts: 1,100

12-06-2000, 06:16 AM	#22
Political Observer Starter Join Date: Nov 2000 Casino cash: $10004900	Frazod, You bring up something that leads me to a question. I am/have been of like mind with many of you. I have been rooting for the Chiefs to win each game with the same ferver and passion during the game as always, while at the end, when the losses have mounted up, I haven't been nearly as upset, because with each loss I have felt that Goonther MaGoo's hold on his job was slipping more and more. The question, since it is clear to us, the fans, that MaGoo and the staff have lost the respect of the players and fans, should it also not be clear to the people that matter, the people who have the power to make the necessary changes? Would winning at this point change that perception? If not, then do any of us want to see continued losses just to improve our draft position? I don't. the milkman really doesn't like losing [This message has been edited by Lompoc Brave (edited 12-06-2000).]
Posts: 124

12-06-2000, 11:17 AM	#23
kc hopeful Starter Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: The Texas Pothandle Casino cash: $10005020	While I will never advocate intentionally losing games at this point The W's and L's are less important than evaluation of young talent. The Chiefs can not make the playoffs this year so they need to take this opportunity to evaluate their players under true game conditions. Cloud, Moreau, etc.. need to get a chance to show what they can or can't do. Todd Collins needs some PT to show if he is capable of being the Chiefs 2nd string QB next year. I say throw them in the pond and see if they sink or swim. ------------------ "A bartender is just a pharmacist with a limited inventory."
Posts: 471

12-06-2000, 11:32 AM	#24
wutamess MVP Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Lee's Summit Casino cash: $5391637	IMO we should play the final 3 games to evaluate young players (as Rod said), and also to win if at all possible. I don't care about draft position. If we pick 5th or 6th and get hit with a huge rookie contract, how the hell are we going to fit it under the cap? Anyway, there are plenty of top quality players which can be picked around 15th if we finish 8-8. Obviously that is where we drafted Gonzo and Tait. It depends more on talent evaluation at the end of the day, than on where you pick. I also don't care about schedule. [b]It doesn't matter anymore[/b] given the age of parity. Last year Denver had an "easy" schedule but ended up playing teams that ALL finished .500 or better. Oakland's schedule went the opposite way, looked like a ***** and then turned out much more easy than anticipated given which direction Minnesota, GB and Miami (among others) went. If our coaching staff is retained, whether we finish 5-11 or 8-8 I will be sooooo disgusted. There is NOTHING they can do in the remaining 3 games to redeem themselves. So we might as well win them for confidence sake. Winning out might avoid a "habit of losing" from developing. I [b]hope[/b] we finish 8-8 to carry some momentum (to go with a new coaching staff!) into next season. Losing is never good IMO. Go Chiefs.
Posts: 8,275

12-06-2000, 11:46 AM	#25
AustinChief Guest Casino cash: $	A very, very good friend of mine has been a methamphetamine addict for about 7 years. He's been arrested, spent time in prison, has 3 kids he'll never see again (and he's never been married), he hurts everybody he comes into contact with, and so on. Everyday we tried to talk to him. Everyday we ROOTED FOR HIM TO WIN THIS BATTLE. About 6 weeks ago, 2 guys broke into his house, supposedly because he owed them money or drugs or whatever, and beat him within an inch of his life. For about 4 days, he was sober. Then he came back one night and said, "you know, if I hadn't of been tweaking that night, I wouldn't have been strong enough to fight those guys off." At some point, it became painfully obvious that the only way he will ever beat this is to have something so bad, so vile, happen that he won't be able to go back. That is how I feel about the Chiefs. This team is going nowhere, and fast. If they win the last 3 to go 8-8, Carl will see that as a "step in the right direction" and he will RETAIN the WORST COACHING staff in the NFL. If they lose the last 3, it's quite possible that even CP won't be back. And in the long run, "the big picture", that's a GOOD thing. I can assure you that the players right now understand how the fans feel. EVERYBODY, player and fan alike, is frustrated with the coaching staff and you can see it in their faces. If we win out, go 8-8, and retain the current GM and staff, how many more 7-9, 8-8, 9-7 seasons are you willing to go through? I love the Chiefs and I root for them to win. However, if they don't, I will be happy with that, this time. ------------------ Parker [b]ChiefsPlanet Administrator</B>
Posts: n/a

12-06-2000, 11:51 AM	#26
AustinChief Guest Casino cash: $	To add to what's already been said... It's not about Gunther getting fired. 5-11 or 8-8, I think he will be retained. Firing him with 2 years left on his contract would make the King look real bad. However, the difference between 5-11 and 8-8 is HUGE when Lamar looks at CP's contract. That's the key. It's not Gunther, or the stooges that need to go. If CP doesn't stay, the exit of the coaching staff is IMPLIED. ------------------ Parker [b]ChiefsPlanet Administrator</B>
Posts: n/a

12-06-2000, 07:50 PM	#27
Chief Henry MVP Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: IOWA Casino cash: $10005088	I just want to win one more game, the Donx of course. Then I wouldn't mind finishing 6-10. That would be the best of both worlds. Bad enough to get a good pick and fire all the coordinators and maybe even Gun. A double digit sloss season could do the trick. However, a 7-9 one will not guarantee a good pick.
Posts: 8,361