Lance Armstrong cleared of doping charges (and now drops the fight)

[alnorth]

Originally Posted by Donger

I know. Perhaps I should have been clearer: USADA can't, by itself, strip Armstrong of his TDF victories. UCI can.

This is correct, but its a formality at this point. The UCI has only two options: accept the USADA findings and impose the mandated punishment, or take the USADA to the world court of arbitration for sport. If it went there (unlikely), Armstrong has almost zero chance.

Armstrong is giving up because he knows that the USADA has him absolutely dead to rights now, and he's made the calculation that he'd rather travel the path of the angry martyr for the few who still believe him for some odd reason, rather than endure the public humiliation of this arbitration hearing.

[alnorth]

The tragic thing here is that Armstrong probably would have won most or all of those titles if everyone wasn't cheating. He was in a dirty sport and could either do what he had to do, or play it honest and sink into failure and obscurity as all the cheaters passed him by.

It would be fine to be sympathetic with his being put into an impossible situation if he'd just admit the obvious, but right now he's a liar.

[Donger]

Originally Posted by alnorth

This is correct, but its a formality at this point. The UCI has only two options: accept the USADA findings and impose the mandated punishment, or take the USADA to the world court of arbitration for sport. If it went there (unlikely), Armstrong has almost zero chance.

Based on what?

[alnorth]

Originally Posted by Donger

Based on what?

WADA has ruled that USADA had jurisdiction, Armstrong's refusal to contest USADA's findings is basically an admission (like refusing a breathalyzer on a traffic stop) and the world court is not heavily biased to get past the EPO era like the ICF is. Then of course there's the small matter that the Americans are the ones who are recommending that another American, due to overwhelming proof, be stripped of the record 7 titles.

[Donger]

Originally Posted by alnorth

WADA has ruled that USADA had jurisdiction, and the world court is not heavily biased to get past the EPO era like the ICF is. Then of course there's the small matter that the Americans are the ones who are recommending that another American, due to overwhelming proof, be stripped of the record 7 titles.

No, I was asking what new evidence you think that USADA has that proves that Armstrong doped. I haven't seen what that is. Have you? If they have a positive, why wasn't it found before?

[alnorth]

Originally Posted by Donger

No, I was asking what new evidence you think that USADA has that proves that Armstrong doped. I haven't seen what that is. Have you? If they have a positive, why wasn't it found before?

Armstrong failed tests during his 2009 and 2010 comeback attempts.

Then there's the long parade of witnesses, including teammates, going back to 1998. Above all of that, is the blatantly obvious fact that Armstrong could not have possibly beaten a field full of cheaters, by only a few minutes, not hours so that you'd think he's some crazy mutant species of human, during those 7 years.

[Donger]

Originally Posted by alnorth

Armstrong failed tests during his 2009 and 2010 comeback attempts.

Link?

Originally Posted by alnorth

Then there's the long parade of witnesses, including teammates, going back to 1998.

You mean a list of cyclists who DID get positives, were banned, denied it and then came clean? You consider those to be reliable witnesses?

Originally Posted by alnorth

Above all of that, is the blatantly obvious fact that Armstrong could not have possibly beaten a field full of cheaters, by only a few minutes, not hours so that you'd think he's some crazy mutant species of human, during those 7 years.

That doesn't make any sense, either. In fact, it seems to negate your argument. If he HAD beaten all these dopers by hours and not minutes, your argument might make sense. He didn't. He also always had a VERY strong team riding for him. Only in the individual TTs is it a non-team sport. Even then, teamates will support the leader.

[Graystoke]

Originally Posted by Donger

Link?



You mean a list of cyclists who DID get positives, were banned, denied it and then came clean? You consider those to be reliable witnesses?

Here is an interesting read from JV. Who did not get busted, banned or denied.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/08/12/op...pagewanted=all