can we please stop talking about time of possession? Please?

[Buehler445]

Everyone is talking about time of possession. That is mind bogglingly stupid. Winning is about offensive and defensive efficiency. Scores and stops. It has nothing at all to do with time. If Mahomes scores in one play every possession that’s really efficient but won’t take up any time. Moreover if we take a 12 minute drive and fumble at the 2, that isn’t going to win any games but by god we’ll win the time of possession.

****ing pussies like Squirmin Herman Mother****ing Sack of **** Edwards talk about time of possession. Winners talk about scores and stops.

[Buehler445]

Originally Posted by TripleThreat

@OP

Time of possession means a lot more than you think. I understand your way of thinking, well if they scored in 8minutes who cares, when our offense is up, we need to score too wether it be 3 minutes or in 5 minutes etc.

The problem though is when their offense scores after an 8minute drive. We come out and score in 1minute, our defense goes out and they are on the field for another 7minute scoring drive. Half is over, we are down 14-7. Move onto the next half, we get the ball back, we go 3 and out. There team comes out, 4minute drive, no score, we get ball back and we score, 14-14. Our defense has been on the field for 18minutes of the game, theirs 5minutes. Now their offense scores at will because our defense is gassed, and our offense has to switch up because our defense can't get off the field.

TLDR our offense is better than theirs, but our offense is playing vs a refresed, read to go defense in the 4th quarter, where their offense is playing vs a gassed defense.

It’s all about production. TOP is (sometimes) of the plays that actually affect winning

[Buehler445]

Originally Posted by notorious

via Imgflip Meme Generator

Holy shit

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

I think the problem actually goes back to punts because the Texans never did punt. Not one time.

[FloridaMan88]

It's the "Death by 1,000 Scratches" defense that we've seen from Spags' defense even going back to the preseason.

At this point I'd rather they give up a big play and let the team score in 2-3 plays rather than go on these continuous 10+ play drives.

At least it gets Mahomes back on the field quicker.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by Buehler445

Get stops and TOP will follow.



Mother****er

THEY ARE CORRELATED. BUT TOP IS NOT CAUSAL TO WINNING.

Read that again.

For ****s mother****ing sake. There is a difference between correlation and causation.

We’re talking about getting wins. The team needs to strive towards affecting change to factors that are causal to winning. Stops and scores. Not time of ****ing possession

Jesus dude.

I don't think we disagree. I could care less about offense TOP. I don't even care about defensive TOP. We need to give up less plays per drive. I'd rather give up a lot of points quickly.

[WhiteWhale]

Originally Posted by Chiefshrink

Ummmmm, you possess the ball in order to get more scores and stops.



So when a team rebounds the ball they don't have possession of it ?




Hey, we agree on one thing!!



Reid knows he cannot run the ball at will(and why he abandons because defenses make their adjustments) and PM2 II is talented enough to get away with throwing 75-80% of the time assuming everyone is healthy and even when they are not Reid still throws cuz he knows he still has a chance with Pat.



Couldn't agree more.

The horrid defense is a given issue BUT until that gets fixed it is our offensive line that cannot pass block nor run block against good d-lines that is our next biggest issue



We are not scoring fast therefore TOP is very relevant.



Thank you!!




You address directly by getting better o-line play and a better run defense BUT this is not happening this year unfortunately IMHO.



and who would ? Not me !! BUT we are not scoring fast so..........



Were not getting either in a timely fashion it seems. Therefore what do you do then? You try to possess the ball to get more opportunities, I think?

Rebounding is more like special teams. Time of possession is time of possession. That's a stat in basketball too stupid. Same rules apply. TOP between sports is apples and apples, but you instead brought a watermelon and are like 'DERRR, SAME THING AMIRITE?" No. You are wrong. TOP is TOP. It's a stat that reflects things, not a CAUSAL stat as the OP has tried to explain to you dense stubborn clowns.

If a basketball team is allowing the other team to shoot 60% from the field while shooting 34%, they'll probably lose the rebounding battle. Guess what? Rebounding isn't the primary issue here. Ineffecient offense and bad defense is.

CAn you think of how that might correlate to KC's issues? Maybe in a small way?

I seriously have no idea why so many of you are baffled by this point. It's velcro. Just strap it together.

[Red Dawg]

As long as Andy doesn't care about the defense we will be screwed. His game plan never involves helping his shit defense at all.

[Buehler445]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

I don't think we disagree. I could care less about offense TOP. I don't even care about defensive TOP. We need to give up less plays per drive. I'd rather give up a lot of points quickly.

The only point I’m trying to make is that TOP is a horseshit metric for determining success.

That’s it.

[scho63]

If you can run the ball and chew up the clock all game, you wear down the defense and at the end of the game, they have nothing ;left when it counts. (Just ask the Chiefs)

[Buehler445]

Originally Posted by scho63

If you can run the ball and chew up the clock all game, you wear down the defense and at the end of the game, they have nothing ;left when it counts. (Just ask the Chiefs)

Ok. But that has nothing to do with the fact that TOP is not actually causal to winning.

[Giant Octopodes]

Originally Posted by Buehler445

OK. So I’m shortsighted because I suggest that we look at the actual production of the unit regardless of the circumstance. Then you go list off a bunch of situations that are essentially excuses for poor production.

I want to look at high level overviews of the game and you want to look at specific excuses.

One of those is short sighted but it’s not me, man.

Time of possession is a fine indicator as it does sometimes correlate to winning. But Reid sits there and says time of possession is on him. Hogshit. Figure out how to score points and get stops, whatever way you can. **** TOP

Yes, that is correct. Looking at just raw production, and ignoring the circumstances which led to that production, is short-sighted. And you say excuses, I say reasons, but let's not argue over semantics. I am indeed arguing you should look at specific reasons why you might have poor production, instead of just looking at high level overviews. I think it is more productive and more likely to result in success, especially as there is indeed a correlation, likely for the reasons I previously elaborated upon.

Again I'm not saying getting points is a bad thing. At all. I'm simply saying that historically, demonstrably, defenses perform better when they have to defend for 20 minutes than when they have to defend for 40. Part of that is on the defense, in getting stops and getting off the field, while part of that is on the offense, in keeping extended drives alive. Both are the responsibility of the head coach, which is probably why Reid said what he said.

You indicated they need to get points and get stops. I'd argue that points weren't the issue there. I'd argue that 24 points is good enough to beat the majority of teams in the NFL, and it was giving up 31 points which ultimately led to the defeat. If you want fewer points scored, you need greater defensive drive efficiency. If you want greater defensive drive efficiency, they need to be less tired, so you need to increase offensive time of possession, however you can.

That might not have anything to do with getting points offensively, and might have more to do with incorporating more run plays and short yardage plays to make the same scoring drive take 5 minutes instead of 2. The Chiefs had only 2 drives of greater than 4 minutes, and only 1 which was 10 plays or more. They averaged 4.9 plays per drive, and averaged almost exactly 2 minutes per drive. The Texans had 7 drives of 4 minutes or greater, and 6 drives of 10 or more plays. This is indeed an issue which contributed (though of course it was not the sole cause) to the Texans winning. To say it's a garbage stat which should be ignored is indeed as previously stated short sighted.

[crazycoffey]

Time of possession is entirely a variable stat, I agree.

However; Time of possession also is historically a favorable variable.

Like turnovers. “You can’t turn it over and expect to win”. There is a validity to both of those variables.

Scoring fast and sitting on the sideline, has never been a recipe for success. Being able to score fast is a luxury. And can bring you back from an almost certain loss, but it has never been the ideal. Controlling the clock has. And the chiefs don’t do that.....

[Buehler445]

Any of you dumb ****s want to continue this argument now?

Chiefs owned TOP 37:51 to 22.09.

It's about scores and stops, mother****ers.

[kcclone]

Originally Posted by Buehler445

Any of you dumb ****s want to continue this argument now?

Chiefs owned TOP 37:51 to 22.09.

It's about scores and stops, mother****ers.

Only people who have never played football think TOP doesn't matter. Ask any coach in the sport.

It's not the number in and of itself that matters. But losing TOP consistently, means you don't control the tempo of the game. It indicates you can't run the ball or stop the other team.

Period

*We also dominated TOP against the Vikings and beat them with our 3rd string QB so you conveniently left that out.

[lcarus]

Originally Posted by Buehler445

Any of you dumb ****s want to continue this argument now?

Chiefs owned TOP 37:51 to 22.09.

It's about scores and stops, mother****ers.

The fact that we won TOP so badly is why it's so surprising we lost that game. We had no business losing that game. The fumble that gave them a TD was the difference in the game. Without that they have no shot.