Chiefs Who is more responsible for this turnaround. Clark Hunt, John Dorsey, or Andy Reid. - Page 6

penbrook · 12-18-2013, 12:37 AM

Discuss.

**Rain Man** · 12-18-2013, 01:00 PM

I like all of those guys. If you trace back the origins, though, you would likely include that Andy and Dorsey arrive later in the timeline and they're the tactical reasons for the success. Clark made the move to bring them in, so he's the strategic reason.

And of course, he made the move due to the combined actions of the Save Our Chiefs movement, Scott Pioli, and Romeo Crennel, so those three groups also get credit.

saphojunkie · 12-18-2013, 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pam Oliver's Forehead

What? Go **** yourself. I created that document entirely of my own accord. Countless hours spent researching pro football reference dot com.

The Matt Cassel document was one of, if not THE, greatest piece of sports discussion that I have ever seen or heard of.

**FRCDFED** · 12-18-2013, 01:14 PM

The role that SOC played cannot be discounted. It was probably one of the first organized efforts a fanbase has undertaken to express their displeasure with the efforts of an NFL team to put a winning product on the field. With that being said, SOC consists of the many individuals who donated, came up with the ideas, or supported in other ways. It represents a great number of people. It was a team effort and the inventor deserves kudo's for not being afraid to confront the organization.

It took Clark to recognize the discontent and to actually want to make change happen. Remember, he was new to the ownership game when he hired Pioli. Plus Pioli was supposed to be a sure thing based on his executive of the year awards. Clark listened when others may not have and made sweeping changes in the front office.

Then credit goes to Dorsey, Reid, and the new coaching staff. Sure there have been stumbling blocks but so far how can a fan not be pleased with the adjustments that the coaching staff has made. It appears that this staff does not stay status-quo when faced with adversity. They analyze it and create solutions to the problems. Plus, when was the last time anyone heard anything out of Dorsey? He knows his place and focuses on his job. Not the media.

Then credit goes to the players that actually execute the plays on the field. This starts with our shiny new QB. However, many players have stood out in this historic turnaround.

The bottom line is that anyone or everyone from the ownership, coaching staff, players, and fanbase all had a role in this success. Let's just enjoy it together./

htismaqe · 12-18-2013, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saphojunkie

The Matt Cassel document was one of, if not THE, greatest piece of sports discussion that I have ever seen or heard of.

God damn it!!!!

STOP!!!!

OrtonsPiercedTaint · 12-18-2013, 01:16 PM

Belcher was a huge link in the chain of events. I'd distance myself from that chain. Or lay it to rest

saphojunkie · 12-18-2013, 01:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by htismaqe

God damn it!!!!

STOP!!!!

Hammock Parties · 12-18-2013, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saphojunkie

The Matt Cassel document was one of, if not THE, greatest piece of sports discussion that I have ever seen or heard of.

Thank you, thank you.

Also completely original. Hours of research.

You are very, very welcome.

CoMoChief · 12-18-2013, 01:33 PM

I give the credit to SOC for making the problem go mainstream and shined a horribly bad light on the administration. That was huge. That is what got the ball rolling.

**Rain Man** · 12-18-2013, 01:59 PM

I have to also make a note about Clark.

When he took over, he did what I thought was the absolutely perfect thing to do. He hired a GM who had been involved in amazing success, and he hired a young out-of-the-box creative coach. We may not like Pioli now, but at the time it was a huge coup to hire him away from New England and he was a low-risk, high-reward play. On the other hand, Haley was a high-risk, high-reward play, but it's still a good long-term call. Say what you will about Haley, but he's not afraid to take risks and go against the grain, and that's a trait of the greatest coaches.

Haley didn't work out, but I still think it was a good risk to take. As for Pioli, we learned our lesson with him and Cassel that you just don't make deals with New England. If Belichick lets them go, it's for a reason. But Pioli was a great hire at the time.

So anyway, those two blow up, and what does Clark do? He goes out and takes the same high-reward, low-risk play with Dorsey. Dorsey is a guy who built a strong regime elsewhere. This time, he takes a low-risk, moderate reward play with Andy Reid. You know what you're getting with Andy. Perhaps the Andy hire was a reaction to the fan revolt, and obviously it's paying off better than history would suggest.

The bottom line is that you can dislike the results from his first round, but you have to like the philosophy he's employing.

Mr. Laz · 12-18-2013, 02:03 PM

holy crap, what did i do.

DTLB58 · 12-18-2013, 05:33 PM

Just read this. Good as any place to lay it down. You are welcome for not starting a new thread just to tell you this.

@mchappell51: One reason for KC's massive turnaround (11-3 after 2-14)? Chiefs plus-21 in turnovers this year. Minus-24 in 2012.

Not new info. But updated stats are nice.

**Rain Man** · 12-18-2013, 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ComoLaz

holy crap, what did i do.

Uh-oh. Did you just soil yourself?

stevieray · 12-18-2013, 05:54 PM

candy wrapper in the stairwell.

chiefzilla1501 · 12-18-2013, 05:55 PM

I like Dorsey. But he's raw. And you can see it. I think he overcompensated for Alex smith and the fisher pick will work out, but he could have taken more ofa. Chance. Probably overpaid for some free agents. Looked a little lost in the Branden Albert trade discussions.

I give full credit to Clark hunt. This team was mostly good but the culture And force fitting of offense and defense has to go.

Deberg_1990 · 12-18-2013, 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phobia

Oh for Christ's sake. Get over yourself. Good grief. No1curr. It's over. You had your 15 minutes. It's not that I even disagree that SOC was impactful. It's just the, "It was us, don't forget us" nature of this stupid post. Stupid shit. That's the difference between you and Marty. Marty would never make this kind of post because he's not a dipshit. So irritating. Just let the accomplishment live on its own merits. Shit.

I've always been curious about the amount of impact SOC had. If SOC had never existed, does Clark still fire Pioli? Does Clark still rush to go get a legit head coach?
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12-18-2013, 12:37 AM
penbrook LEGEND! Join Date: Feb 2013 Casino cash: $10033840	Who is more responsible for this turnaround. Clark Hunt, John Dorsey, or Andy Reid. Discuss.
Posts: 16,409

12-18-2013, 01:00 PM	#76
Rain Man NFL's #1 Ermines Fan Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: My house Casino cash: $3338491 VARSITY	I like all of those guys. If you trace back the origins, though, you would likely include that Andy and Dorsey arrive later in the timeline and they're the tactical reasons for the success. Clark made the move to bring them in, so he's the strategic reason. And of course, he made the move due to the combined actions of the Save Our Chiefs movement, Scott Pioli, and Romeo Crennel, so those three groups also get credit. __________________ I'm putting random letters here as a celebration of free speech: xigrakgrah misorojeq rkemeseit.
Posts: 141,338

12-18-2013, 01:14 PM	#78
FRCDFED Line'em up Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: somewhere out there Casino cash: $9326297	The role that SOC played cannot be discounted. It was probably one of the first organized efforts a fanbase has undertaken to express their displeasure with the efforts of an NFL team to put a winning product on the field. With that being said, SOC consists of the many individuals who donated, came up with the ideas, or supported in other ways. It represents a great number of people. It was a team effort and the inventor deserves kudo's for not being afraid to confront the organization. It took Clark to recognize the discontent and to actually want to make change happen. Remember, he was new to the ownership game when he hired Pioli. Plus Pioli was supposed to be a sure thing based on his executive of the year awards. Clark listened when others may not have and made sweeping changes in the front office. Then credit goes to Dorsey, Reid, and the new coaching staff. Sure there have been stumbling blocks but so far how can a fan not be pleased with the adjustments that the coaching staff has made. It appears that this staff does not stay status-quo when faced with adversity. They analyze it and create solutions to the problems. Plus, when was the last time anyone heard anything out of Dorsey? He knows his place and focuses on his job. Not the media. Then credit goes to the players that actually execute the plays on the field. This starts with our shiny new QB. However, many players have stood out in this historic turnaround. The bottom line is that anyone or everyone from the ownership, coaching staff, players, and fanbase all had a role in this success. Let's just enjoy it together./
Posts: 3,184

12-18-2013, 01:16 PM	#80
OrtonsPiercedTaint MVP Join Date: Dec 2012 Casino cash: $10004980	Belcher was a huge link in the chain of events. I'd distance myself from that chain. Or lay it to rest
Posts: 5,994

12-18-2013, 01:33 PM	#83
CoMoChief Mahomes Dynasty Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Parts Unknown Casino cash: $8052254	I give the credit to SOC for making the problem go mainstream and shined a horribly bad light on the administration. That was huge. That is what got the ball rolling. __________________
Posts: 39,156

12-18-2013, 01:59 PM	#84
Rain Man NFL's #1 Ermines Fan Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: My house Casino cash: $3338491 VARSITY	I have to also make a note about Clark. When he took over, he did what I thought was the absolutely perfect thing to do. He hired a GM who had been involved in amazing success, and he hired a young out-of-the-box creative coach. We may not like Pioli now, but at the time it was a huge coup to hire him away from New England and he was a low-risk, high-reward play. On the other hand, Haley was a high-risk, high-reward play, but it's still a good long-term call. Say what you will about Haley, but he's not afraid to take risks and go against the grain, and that's a trait of the greatest coaches. Haley didn't work out, but I still think it was a good risk to take. As for Pioli, we learned our lesson with him and Cassel that you just don't make deals with New England. If Belichick lets them go, it's for a reason. But Pioli was a great hire at the time. So anyway, those two blow up, and what does Clark do? He goes out and takes the same high-reward, low-risk play with Dorsey. Dorsey is a guy who built a strong regime elsewhere. This time, he takes a low-risk, moderate reward play with Andy Reid. You know what you're getting with Andy. Perhaps the Andy hire was a reaction to the fan revolt, and obviously it's paying off better than history would suggest. The bottom line is that you can dislike the results from his first round, but you have to like the philosophy he's employing. __________________ I'm putting random letters here as a celebration of free speech: xigrakgrah misorojeq rkemeseit. Last edited by Rain Man; 12-18-2013 at 05:28 PM..
Posts: 141,338

12-18-2013, 02:03 PM	#85
Mr. Laz Don't Tease Me Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: KS Casino cash: $11047037	holy crap, what did i do. __________________
Posts: 95,626

12-18-2013, 05:33 PM	#86
DTLB58 DT CARD COLLECTOR Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: ManCave Casino cash: $10005837	Just read this. Good as any place to lay it down. You are welcome for not starting a new thread just to tell you this. @mchappell51: One reason for KC's massive turnaround (11-3 after 2-14)? Chiefs plus-21 in turnovers this year. Minus-24 in 2012. Not new info. But updated stats are nice. __________________ 667 Different DT cards and counting
Posts: 7,574

12-18-2013, 05:54 PM	#88
stevieray best in the biz Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Under Pressure Casino cash: $2605273	candy wrapper in the stairwell.
Posts: 71,185

12-18-2013, 05:55 PM	#89
chiefzilla1501 In Search of a Life Join Date: Aug 2008 Casino cash: $2124497	I like Dorsey. But he's raw. And you can see it. I think he overcompensated for Alex smith and the fisher pick will work out, but he could have taken more ofa. Chance. Probably overpaid for some free agents. Looked a little lost in the Branden Albert trade discussions. I give full credit to Clark hunt. This team was mostly good but the culture And force fitting of offense and defense has to go.
Posts: 48,055