Home Mail MemberMap Chat (0) Wallpapers
Go Back   ChiefsPlanet > The Lounge

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-01-2012, 10:17 PM  
Sorter Sorter is offline
Caralho
 
Sorter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Casino cash: $13861
The Primary Flaw with Romeo's 2-Gap

A few have been asking "Why don't we switch to a 4-3" and most have been like myself and have been campaigning for a switch to the 1-gap.

Now, Direckshun has posted a nice breakdown of the difference between the two philosophies, and I'll link that later.

However, the 2-gap isn't a completely flawed scheme. To run it effectively in today's NFL, you need to have DEs like Tyson/Dorsey who are solid against the run but also can diagnose run vs. pass quickly and then provide an adequate pass rush (pushing the pocket or obtaining a double team while still progressing upfield).

For example, the Ravens and Mike Nolan (D-Coordinator for the Falcons) still run a 2-gap philosophy. (Nolan runs a hybrid 3-4 2-gap and a 4-3, but I can talk about that later).The difference is that while the Ravens run the 2-gap (albeit, having their DEs play the 4-tech instead of our 5), they utilize a fire-zone heavy concept. Meaning, they will pull DEs into coverage occasionally and bring pressure from safeties, nickel and dime backs. Their philosophy is to "Rush 5, drop 6".

For those that think our Defense sucks, you're entitled to your opinion but it is wrong. To those that think the 2-gap entirely sucks, you're wrong as well. The main problem with this defense IMO is the inability to get pressure from our base front (3-4 odd, DEs playing the 5-tech). To play our scheme effectively, you need smart DEs who can address the play quickly and accordingly. Simply put, our DEs are not smart enough or talented enough to do so in our base front. Granted, Allan Bailey is fine from our sub package (playing the 3-tech), but can't be relied on in our base front because he doesn't play well against the run or quickly diagnoses run v. pass enough to provide an adequate rush, much like our other DEs.

I know most will just see a wall of text, but this will probably help several understand some of our defensive flaws and why we struggle against the pass in our base set.

Cliffs:
1. Our 2-gap requires players we have not acquired; it can still be effective but is much more difficult to do than a 1-gap philosophy.
2. The responsibilities for a 2-gap DE and NT are much more difficult than those of a 1-gap.
3. I personally would like to see our team go to a 1-gap. Attacking defensive lineman are much better served than run-stoppers in today's NFL.

I know most will tl;dr, but if you disagree with it, post your thoughts. We have too much bitching on this site and not enough discussion about scheme, football philosophies, and concepts.
Posts: 16,202
Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2012, 10:18 PM   #2
L.A. Chieffan L.A. Chieffan is offline
PLAY GOOD FOOTBALL
 
L.A. Chieffan's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: American Gardens Building
Casino cash: $10811
THE 3-4 IS CASSELLS FAULT
Posts: 15,741
L.A. Chieffan is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.L.A. Chieffan is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.L.A. Chieffan is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.L.A. Chieffan is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.L.A. Chieffan is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.L.A. Chieffan is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.L.A. Chieffan is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.L.A. Chieffan is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.L.A. Chieffan is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.L.A. Chieffan is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.L.A. Chieffan is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2012, 10:19 PM   #3
Reaper16 Reaper16 is offline
Eat/Sleep/Procrastinate/Repeat
 
Reaper16's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Dystopia
Casino cash: $9413
Welp, we need to draft more 5-techniques in the first round then. Who's in! Anybody?
__________________

Quote:
Originally Posted by Delano View Post
Reaper16's taste in beer, music, and literature are unmatched on this message board.
Posted via Mobile Device
Posts: 32,794
Reaper16 has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.Reaper16 has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.Reaper16 has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.Reaper16 has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.Reaper16 has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.Reaper16 has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.Reaper16 has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.Reaper16 has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.Reaper16 has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.Reaper16 has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.Reaper16 has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2012, 10:21 PM   #4
Chiefspants Chiefspants is offline
Good as New
 
Chiefspants's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jul 2007
Casino cash: $8357
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reaper16 View Post
Welp, we need to draft more 5-techniques in the first round then. Who's in! Anybody?
I think a project offensive tackle would suit the 2013 team nicely.
Posts: 5,058
Chiefspants has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.Chiefspants has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.Chiefspants has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.Chiefspants has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.Chiefspants has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.Chiefspants has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.Chiefspants has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.Chiefspants has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.Chiefspants has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.Chiefspants has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.Chiefspants has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2012, 11:18 PM   #5
Psyko Tek Psyko Tek is online now
special teams
 
Psyko Tek's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Mesa AZ
Casino cash: $5079
ist n't the hole d line 1st rounders
and yeah I spelled it that way on purpose
__________________
Psyko Tek

Battle not with monsters, lest ye become a monster, and if you gaze into the abyss, the abyss gazes also into you.

Friedrich Nietzsche

**** You Fred,
The abyss is my wallpaper
Posts: 10,247
Psyko Tek wants to die in a aids tree fire.Psyko Tek wants to die in a aids tree fire.Psyko Tek wants to die in a aids tree fire.Psyko Tek wants to die in a aids tree fire.Psyko Tek wants to die in a aids tree fire.Psyko Tek wants to die in a aids tree fire.Psyko Tek wants to die in a aids tree fire.Psyko Tek wants to die in a aids tree fire.Psyko Tek wants to die in a aids tree fire.Psyko Tek wants to die in a aids tree fire.Psyko Tek wants to die in a aids tree fire.
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2012, 11:26 PM   #6
chiefzilla1501 chiefzilla1501 is offline
Gonzo = Sexy Bitch
 

Join Date: Aug 2008
Casino cash: $16466
Great post. I would agree with this.

Though, I still really liked what I saw from last year. The big differences (maybe I'll change that to "huge" differences) between this year and last year, though, are:

1) We need a ****ing DC. Romeo has been slow to adjust. In Atlanta, they repeatedly ran the same pick play on our man-to-man. No adjustment. In San Diego, no excuse not to give Berry a little help when he struggled on Gates early. In San Diego and New Orleans, why did it take so long to realize that stunting our linemen would help create pressure? Too, too, too slow to adjust scheme.

2) Kelly Gregg. He was somewhat invisible, but our Nose Tackle play has been atrocious. And we all know when that happens, everything falls apart. Berry and DJ might play more effectively if the Nose Tackle did his job.

3) Soft players. Our players used to hit offensive players in the mouth. Now they're playing finesse, read and react.


I agree. The 2-gap can work. I don't think it's as much scheme as it is this idiotic idea on Pioli's part to put Romeo in charge of both the team and the defense.
Posts: 21,552
chiefzilla1501 threw an interception on a screen pass.chiefzilla1501 threw an interception on a screen pass.chiefzilla1501 threw an interception on a screen pass.chiefzilla1501 threw an interception on a screen pass.chiefzilla1501 threw an interception on a screen pass.chiefzilla1501 threw an interception on a screen pass.chiefzilla1501 threw an interception on a screen pass.chiefzilla1501 threw an interception on a screen pass.chiefzilla1501 threw an interception on a screen pass.chiefzilla1501 threw an interception on a screen pass.chiefzilla1501 threw an interception on a screen pass.
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2012, 11:27 PM   #7
Chocolate Hog Chocolate Hog is offline
Winner
 
Chocolate Hog's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: My house
Casino cash: $14062
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reaper16 View Post
Welp, we need to draft more 5-techniques in the first round then. Who's in! Anybody?
I'm paying to have a banner fly over Arrowhead that says "Fire Pioli Draft a 5 tech"
Posts: 35,399
Chocolate Hog has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.Chocolate Hog has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.Chocolate Hog has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.Chocolate Hog has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.Chocolate Hog has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.Chocolate Hog has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.Chocolate Hog has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.Chocolate Hog has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.Chocolate Hog has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.Chocolate Hog has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.Chocolate Hog has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2012, 11:29 PM   #8
Sorter Sorter is offline
Caralho
 
Sorter's Avatar
 

Join Date: Sep 2011
Casino cash: $13861
Quote:
Originally Posted by billay View Post
I'm paying to have a banner fly over Arrowhead that says "Fire Pioli Draft a 5 tech"
I'll chip in if we can fly said banner with a picture of Tyson Jackson on it.
Posts: 16,202
Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2012, 12:01 AM   #9
Blick Blick is offline
Veteran
 

Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Overland Park
Casino cash: $5000
The smart people know that a 2 gap defense is more difficult to play than a one gap defense. That's why it's annoying that we run it.

Even IF you diagnose pass early, respecting the run as a 2 gap lineman has already set you up for failure on your pass rush because you have to play head up on the blocker to make sure you can discard your blocker to either side to play both of your gaps. You essentally end up blocking yourself that way by keeping offensive linemen in front of you instead of getting past them.

It just goes against the fundamental nature of defense...getting OFF blocks and attacking the football.
Posts: 1,004
Blick is the dumbass Milkman is always talking aboutBlick is the dumbass Milkman is always talking aboutBlick is the dumbass Milkman is always talking aboutBlick is the dumbass Milkman is always talking aboutBlick is the dumbass Milkman is always talking aboutBlick is the dumbass Milkman is always talking aboutBlick is the dumbass Milkman is always talking aboutBlick is the dumbass Milkman is always talking aboutBlick is the dumbass Milkman is always talking aboutBlick is the dumbass Milkman is always talking aboutBlick is the dumbass Milkman is always talking about
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2012, 12:07 AM   #10
Sorter Sorter is offline
Caralho
 
Sorter's Avatar
 

Join Date: Sep 2011
Casino cash: $13861
Yup. Blick, I find myself repeating this to a **** ton of people here and I don't know what the requirements are for a sticky. That is why I made this thread.

As you said the fundamental flaws with the 2-gap is that is designed to stop the run and requires absolute monsters on your front 3 to provide a pass rush. To most of us that have some football knowledge, this is obvious. However, I keep seeing threads about the 4-3 and getting neg repped for telling people to use the search function. So, I make thread that hopefully educates people about defensive philosophies and our scheme. However, it will get buried and nobody will read it anyways.
Posts: 16,202
Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2012, 12:08 AM   #11
Count Alex's Losses Count Alex's Losses is offline
Banned
 
Count Alex's Losses's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2002
Casino cash: $40573
Quote:
. Simply put, our DEs are not smart enough or talented enough to do so in our base front. Granted, Allan Bailey is fine from our sub package
Allen Bailey sucks. Believe it.

Two games this year he doesn't have a single QB pressure.

There are only two guys with a positive pass rush grade on this defense and one of them is not even Hali. It's DJ.
__________________
Better to be the bastard child of a king and his whore than to be a ****ing peasant at the shite homer trough.
Posts: 172,367
Count Alex's Losses is obviously part of the inner Circle.Count Alex's Losses is obviously part of the inner Circle.Count Alex's Losses is obviously part of the inner Circle.Count Alex's Losses is obviously part of the inner Circle.Count Alex's Losses is obviously part of the inner Circle.Count Alex's Losses is obviously part of the inner Circle.Count Alex's Losses is obviously part of the inner Circle.Count Alex's Losses is obviously part of the inner Circle.Count Alex's Losses is obviously part of the inner Circle.Count Alex's Losses is obviously part of the inner Circle.Count Alex's Losses is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2012, 12:09 AM   #12
T-post Tom T-post Tom is offline
10K. Well, さようなら.
 
T-post Tom's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Tokyo. Milk/Honey/Gazland
Casino cash: $5000
Bring back the Falcon. Or stop pounding square pegs into round holes:

1. Tyson Jackson - LSU: 4-3 LDE
2. Glenn Dorsey - LSU: 4-3 DT
3. Tamba Hali - PSU: 4-3 LDE (Some say undersized for NFL 4-3 DE. I disagree.)
4. Dontari Poe - Memphis: 4-3 Nose Tackle

Could be a great 4-3 with Tamba channeling the spirit of DT.

Last edited by T-post Tom; 10-02-2012 at 12:16 AM..
Posts: 9,999
T-post Tom Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.T-post Tom Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.T-post Tom Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.T-post Tom Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.T-post Tom Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.T-post Tom Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.T-post Tom Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.T-post Tom Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.T-post Tom Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.T-post Tom Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.T-post Tom Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2012, 12:11 AM   #13
Sorter Sorter is offline
Caralho
 
Sorter's Avatar
 

Join Date: Sep 2011
Casino cash: $13861
He has been underwhelming this year, especially for what I had expected out of him. However, he was directly responsible for Houston's game against NO. Watch the tape, you're fine at evaluating film.
Posts: 16,202
Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.Sorter is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2012, 12:11 AM   #14
FAX FAX is offline
testing ... 1, 2, 3
 
FAX's Avatar
 

Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Tennessee
Casino cash: $5000
The additional problem is that, even if your D-ends diagnose the play, ideally we would like to see Dorsey and Jackson take on a double-team and still get a pass rush. Good luck with that.

FAX
Posts: 37,639
FAX is obviously part of the inner Circle.FAX is obviously part of the inner Circle.FAX is obviously part of the inner Circle.FAX is obviously part of the inner Circle.FAX is obviously part of the inner Circle.FAX is obviously part of the inner Circle.FAX is obviously part of the inner Circle.FAX is obviously part of the inner Circle.FAX is obviously part of the inner Circle.FAX is obviously part of the inner Circle.FAX is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2012, 12:12 AM   #15
Count Alex's Losses Count Alex's Losses is offline
Banned
 
Count Alex's Losses's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2002
Casino cash: $40573
By the way, I agree that the 4-3 shit is stupid, though.

The main problem with the D is lack of talent, not scheme.

People want to believe we've built this uber roster but it's simply not true.

There's really only one good safety on the entire roster and he's gimping around like Sammy Knight.
__________________
Better to be the bastard child of a king and his whore than to be a ****ing peasant at the shite homer trough.
Posts: 172,367
Count Alex's Losses is obviously part of the inner Circle.Count Alex's Losses is obviously part of the inner Circle.Count Alex's Losses is obviously part of the inner Circle.Count Alex's Losses is obviously part of the inner Circle.Count Alex's Losses is obviously part of the inner Circle.Count Alex's Losses is obviously part of the inner Circle.Count Alex's Losses is obviously part of the inner Circle.Count Alex's Losses is obviously part of the inner Circle.Count Alex's Losses is obviously part of the inner Circle.Count Alex's Losses is obviously part of the inner Circle.Count Alex's Losses is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump




All times are GMT -6. The time now is 06:24 AM.


This is a test for a client's site.
A new website that shows member-created construction site listings that need fill or have excess fill. Dirt Monkey @ https://DirtMonkey.net
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.